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Author Topic: Panther Ace Guide  (Read 31098 times)
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Apex Offline
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« on: February 23, 2008, 05:34:50 pm »

"The Panther is one of the best Tanks in the war. Armed with a deadly 75mm main Gun and exceptional frontal armor, the Panther's only weakness is its rear and top armor."


Introduction

The Panther is a powerful unit. I consider it the most powerful weapon in the axis arsenal. Every axis player can field it, and many do.
But almost as often as Panthers get fielded, they get destroyed. Once a Panther hits the field, it often becomes the center of attention, many allied players focusing on killing it. Some axis commanders use their Panthers in ways that are not smart, helping their opponents. With this guide I want to show you some micro and macro skills, especially for new players, to transform your Panther into a Panther Ace.


I. Why the Panther?
Axis tank choices are big. StuG, StuH, Panzer IV, Tiger and King Tiger are the alternatives to the Panther. All of them have strenghts and weaknesses, just as the Panther has. StuG, StuH and and Panzer IV can be fielded in addition to the Panther, so the main question Blitz and Terror Commanders have to make is whether they prefer the Tiger or King Tiger over the Panther.

Why not the Tiger:
The Tiger has a big gun and lots of health. It is especially powerful against infantry, an area where the Panther lacks. But in the end, I consider it too slow. The long turret rotation time makes it vulnerable against fast moving units like M8s and M10s and its low speed decreases its potential to make fast strikes.

Why not the King Tiger:
The King Tiger has an even bigger gun and even more health. A rolling fortress, it moves just as fast. It often dies because of stickied engine damage or backdropped RRs. Many players love this tank for its durability, but it's slow.

Why not many small tanks:
Hordes of Stugs and PIVs might be able to swarm a Sherman, but they cant stand up against a Pershing. Their low health makes it too difficult to gain some veterancy too.

Player preferences differ, but in my oppinion the Panther is the best because it is the best all around unit. The versatility of speed, powerful gun and excellent sloped armor make it the tank of choice.


II. Equipment and Support
Okay, you chose to buy a Panther. What now? Lets look at the Panther options.

Mounted MG: Adds the little extra against infantry. An area where the default Panther lacks, it is affordable for its price and sticky rifles cant chase you across the map anymore.
Side Skirts: Expensive. Grants you a 50% less received damage against Bazookas and RRs. If you get them, it usually means you will get one less tank. If you really want your Panther to be an Ace though, take it.

Support tanks: You can either get a Panzer IV or 2 Stugs to support your Panther. As a Blitz player, I prefer to take a StuG and a StuH over a Panzer IV. Both upgraded with MGs, they are efficient low population infantry and vehicle counters I deploy early and mid game before I roll out my Panther.
Other Support: Repair Bunkers. Very expensive, but if you want your Panther to dominate, get 2 of them. Build them a little spread out in a defendable area close to your spawn. Keep an eye out for those pesky M8 and RR rushes.

Doctrine Abilites: The big names here are Heat Rounds and German Steel. Both permanently increase the effectiveness of your Panther.
My personal favorite though, is Blitzkrieg. Although it is a bit harder to use because it is a timed ability, combined with conviction your Panther can lay whole tank squadrons to waste.


Fully equipped and ready to go, this is your Panther. Well, maybe not just yet. Do not press decommission.   


III. Deployment
So your Panther is geared up and the game starts. When to deploy the Beast?
Always talk about this with your teammates. 3 Panthers on the field at the same time against an enemy who only fields infantry does more harm than good.

1. Early Game
Some players like to start with their Panther. It is all the AT you need in the beginning and with some proper infantry support it can roll up the the enemy defensive line before even properly set up. But putting all your chips on the Ace is risky. A well placed and supported 57mm can halt your advance in its tracks, and if you get unlucky enough to lose your Panther, it might really come back at you later in the game. Dont do it.

2. Mid Game
With enough population to properly support your Panther it got more potential to wreak havoc. Judge the situation, never just bring out you Panther because you feel like it. When the enemy got lots of AT-guns sitting around, you might wanna wait a little. If they just started an armor assault, or you feel that they lack AT and its time to take out the crowbar, bring the Panther and teach them to do better. Mortars, Snipers and HMGs pay out as support against manpacked AT. Always keep an eye on your pop cap though. Rolling out a Panther but having no room for infantry to cap will kill you.

3. Late Game
Its now or never. Holding your Panther for the majority of the game is tough, but can pay out huge. Many enemy AT-guns and tanks might already be neutralized, decreasing the possible resistance your Panther faces. If you can hold back the enemy with infantry and smaller tanks for early and mid game, this is the game breaker. You got an Ace up your sleeve.


IV. Micromanagement
The time is right and your Panther deploys. Use it right, and it will win you the game.

1. First Shot
If the enemy didnt notice the Panther rolling in, don't spoil the suprise. This is an element not to be underestimated. Dont just drive it up straight to the frontline shooting at some rifles, hold it back a little waiting for the right moment. If you know there is a half health Sherman around, dont reveal your position until the the Sherman makes another attack on your seemingly helpless HMG. Roll up on it fast and feed it some lead.

2. Attack
Shooting a tank sounds easy. It is. Just right click on the target unit. If you want your Panther to get killed.
Right clicking on a target makes the Panther usually roll up to maximum distance and start firing. This is bad for 2 reasons.
- When the target moves back just a little, you are out of range.
- When the target falls back, your Panther will pursue it no matter what.
This is why you should never just right click on enemy tanks to attack them. Always use the right mouse button to move into a firing postion. Your Panther will automatically start shooting at the tank when in range and wont pursue it int the unknown. Only right click to attack when you specifically target unit other then the auto-aquired unit (tank with the lessest health).

Against infantry, always try to keep your distance because of those sneaky stickies and just keep kiting.
Against tanks, there are 3 basic methods of engagement.

a) Long Range Sniping
Your Panther usually has a Penetration advantage at long range. Move your Panther into an appropriate position from where to attack the tank at long range and it will start firing. Get a feeling for the Panthers max range. If your opponent is dumb enough he will sit tight and lose his tank. Usually he will fall back after taking some damage. Usually you will not kill the enemy tank by this, but it is safe to use. Do it when you know the enemy has an AT-Gun somewhere in the back. Beware when the enemy has multiple tanks, or your opponent is a Pershing. Get the improved barrels ability for increased maximum range. Watch your flanks, especially when the sniped tank doesnt move, and always have a retreat route. 


Long Range Engagement with a Sherman. Rangers are nearby, so keep your distance.

b) Shoot and Scoot
The first part is the same like when sniping. But after your first shot, you order your tank to move forward, about 1 and a half Panther lengths. The goal is to stop when your Panther is ready to fire the next shot. This boosts your accuracy unlike when shooting on the move and allows your Panther to give off more shots at a retreating enemy. Use it when the situation is unclear and when you dont know whether it is safe to rush them. Especially useful against hard to hit light vehicles like M8s. Also very good in combination with the blitzkrieg ability, because of its decreased accuracy modifier.


Shoot and move. This is about the distance where you have to stop when you fired the first shot at maximum distance. He might have an AT-gun somewhere, so be careful.

c) The Bum Rush
Simple. Drive up to the enemy tank and nail him. Do it when you know that the area is clear and whe you are sure that you can beat the enemy tank. If possible, drive behind him to cut of his route of escape.


You can see that the area is clear because of your hidden sniper, and you choose to rush the crocodile, sealing its fate. Watch your flank though.

3. Defense
First things first. Always show your front armor towards the enemy. When driving backwards click close behind the Panther to avoid a 180 degree turn. This is important. Too many tanks die because their commander cant decide wheter to turn around or drive backwards. This takes attention away from other stuff on the battlefield, but is often just needed. If you get into a situation where you will lose, just fall back.
Enemies will often try to circle strafe you. The basic counters here is turning your front armor towards the enemy and/or kiting away. Know them well. If you find out the difference when to kite and when to turn, it will give you the edge you need. Hit the stop button if you overturn your turret, giving of a shot, then continue to turn. If a calliope fires at you from close range, drive towards him, under the barrage.
Getting hit by a hidden AT gun and driving away from it is easy. But there are a couple of situations where more is needed.

a) Retreating Forward
Sometimes, simply falling back might not be the best idea.


You got your Panther in an exposed position in enemy territory, chasing down that annoying crocodile. An unexpected AT-gun gives you painful side hits. Make your decision quick. To the front, side or back? 


Deciding that the direct way back is too dangerous because of continious AT-gun fire and emerging RRs, and that you might get cut off completely when chasing the Croc, you decide to fall back to your friendly forces to the right. Front facing towards the enemy of course!

b) Advanced Kiting
Basic kiting is just moving backwards. Until you hit the wall. Use the surroundings when kiting to deny line of fire, and think up your route in advance to lure pursuers into possible traps. Use this to punish clown cars, half-tracks loaded with sticky riflemen. If you are getting swarmed, back up into small passages so that the enemy cant use his advantage in numbers.


Typical scene, 2 cowboys chasing you. If you simply kite back you will die. Make up your mind quick where you want to go.


You took a corner to deny enemy fire, and to let your hidden Pak38 greet them.

c) Escaping Encirclement
Sometimes your Panther receives an inappropriate amount of hostility. When allies make up their mind to do everything to destroy that Panther, it gets nasty. Although you should always keep an eye on your flanks and secure them (or yell at your teammates to do it when they are jacking off at the chateau again), it sometimes happens that you get encircled.


Oh shit. Now you are in trouble. Stand and fight and die in Honor?


Wrong. Escape driving backwards towards the weakest enemy. He might get off a side hit or 2, but the others will bite on your strong front armor. Keep driving backwards until you are in the green zone again, and if it is your spawn point. Do not show your ass!

4. Terrain
Use the terrain to your advantage. There is are countless ways on how to do this. The most useful purpose is using it as shot blocker.


Heavy crushing hedges is incredibly useful. Not only for full blown attacks at unexpected positions, but also just to create firing angles where you can give off an extra shot or too without coming under fire. Just make a little hole, back up again and fire through it.


Buildings are excellent shot blockers. Using a building as cover is especially useful to deny enemy fire. Just sneak and peak, fire a shot and back up again. When you mastered it, the enemy won't be able to get off a single shot.


V. Macromanagement

Teamwork
Combined arms is the key here. Talk with you teammates. Support your Panther. It might be the single greatest asset in your arsenal, but in a properly managed force it becomes unbeatable. Dont support your Panther with other tanks, as your ability to counter AT gets severly weakened. Standard infantry and support teams are important here. Soften up the enemy defenses with mortars, snipers and artillery before you move in.  Snipers and morters require extra micro, so it might be better if your teammate supplements your force with them. Communicate before calling in platoons. Directly support your Panther with infantry in an assault, scout the area before you move in. Be patient, but on the spot when needed. Dont take unnecessary risks if you want to last.


A Panther attack group. Designed for late EiR combat with 40 pop.

Another key to becoming an ace is to set up traps.

Panther as bait

You act like a noob attacking with your Panther unsupported, then falling back slowly even showing that weak back armor. The enemy just cant resist the urge to pursue you, running right into the prepared death zone. What looks to them like a misplaced firestorm behind them has the purpose of further pushing them in. Dont overdo it.

Iron Cross Time

A Pershing is spending his last moments trying to get some easy money hammering your teammates poor StuG. You arranged that your mate wont to fall back with the StuG on purpose binding the Pershing, sacrificing itself for the greater glory and to give you time to move into position. Previously infiltrated Stormtroopers are ready to ambush the Pershings infantry escort. A Puma is ready to race in behind the Pershing to block its retreat route. In a moment, your Panther Ace will heavy crush the hedge to snap the trap. Switch to the allied ventrilo channel to witness the sound of panicing fear. Pershing got Aced.


I hope I could give some insight into the arts of Panther warfare with this guide. Experienced players will propably already know many of these hints and tricks, but if a new player could learn something he didnt know before, its pupose is already fulfilled.


Cheers
Apex


« Last Edit: December 17, 2008, 04:43:37 pm by Apex » Logged
Ucross Offline
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« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2008, 05:45:18 pm »

Nice guide.  The speed is definitely the panthers biggest advantage, and the skirts also help against stickies and decrease zookas by 70%. =)
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Thtb-Ally Offline
The German Guy on the Ally side?
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« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2008, 06:08:39 pm »

I guess "O.S.H.I.T." has been countered Wink
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BradAxis Offline
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« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2008, 06:13:00 pm »

nice Wink
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CommanderNewbie Offline
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« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2008, 07:11:43 pm »

Fun guide, A+ Apex
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Prydefalcn - Axis
Bonte Offline
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« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2008, 09:19:26 pm »

Apex with ligntning war tiger has 5(without ligtningwar its 4) max speed vs panthers 5.2..do u that it would be microable enough?..but then agian a panther with lightning war would have almost puma speed...
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DasNoob Offline
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« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2008, 09:34:14 pm »

Most excellent post Apex, I will try them asap after reading this.
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slowzo2 Offline
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« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2008, 10:06:03 pm »

The only thing i can think of you that you missed is how to handle circle strafing.  Not that i have a good way to avoid it, i just use it allot to kill panthers.
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Days of War Offline
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« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2008, 10:08:03 pm »

The only thing i can think of you that you missed is how to handle circle strafing.  Not that i have a good way to avoid it, i just use it allot to kill panthers.

Deny them the rear armor by backing up into your side.
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Ucross Offline
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« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2008, 10:11:23 pm »

One of the things I'd like included in the guide is how they are a weakness if there are too many and the other team only has infantry.

Often I see this with axis and they lose all their capping power and get pushed back.
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Kolath Offline
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« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2008, 10:23:39 pm »

Great guide, Apex!  I should try out a panther sometimes.  As a defensive doctrine player, I normally roll with some PIVs as infantry support along with a stuka or nebel as a core damage dealer.  But the panther could be an interesting change of pace.
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scrapking Offline
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Posts: 924


« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2008, 10:23:44 pm »

Well done, bravo.

I learned a thing or two.
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acker Offline
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« Reply #12 on: February 23, 2008, 11:42:55 pm »

Take notes, people. Apex's guide is for Allied players, too.

-Attack where the Panther is not. It's badass, but it can only be in one place at a time.

-Don't feed single tanks to a Panther.

-Don't buy Rangers if you actually want to hurt the Panther*. RRs work, though.

-Vanilla Rifles can fend off Panthers. Just rush them forward, and watch the Panther back off. If it doesn't back off, then repeat the rush with sticky rifles later in the game.

-Never use stickies without first blocking the Panther.

-Whittle down the more fragile AT units first. Panthers die very quickly without support.

-If they don't have RBs, they have skirts. Always assume they have both until proven otherwise.

-Always take out the Pios. Always. If that Panther can't repair, things become considerably easier.

-By the way, that Panther is as fast as a Sherman. Don't expect to circle-strafe it.

-If it advances, the Panther always has support. Calliope the area directly behind the Panther. Howitzer the stone walls and buildings behind the Panther, too.

*null.
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AmPM Offline
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« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2008, 12:58:54 am »

Anything that can penetrate it can pwn it, they hardly have more HP than a Sherman. With that in mind ATGs with AP rounds kill them.
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Lai Offline
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« Reply #14 on: February 24, 2008, 03:59:10 am »

Nice examples explaining the concepts. Next, make a KT guide Cheesy Don't forget the pic from my biggest mistakes thread. Wink
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Thtb-Ally Offline
The German Guy on the Ally side?
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« Reply #15 on: February 24, 2008, 05:18:57 am »

Just calliope infront of it as close range. -> I pwned 21 Phanters like that last war, and 3 KT as well as 5 Tigers.
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Unkn0wn Offline
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« Reply #16 on: February 24, 2008, 06:30:34 am »

Awesome guide Apex, well done.
Definately need more guides like this, with screenshots and everything!

I'll be updating the Panzer Command for 2.0 and then write some other guides as well Smiley.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2008, 06:32:52 am by Unkn0wn » Logged
Apex Offline
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« Reply #17 on: February 24, 2008, 07:53:33 am »

Lightning War is definitely a good ability. A LW Tiger can move quite fast, erasing one of his main weaknesses. But the slow turret rotation, which is even more hindering IMO, stays and also limits the potential of the increased speed. And the Tiger is still a fat pig, even when faster it is difficult to maneuver. A LW Panther might already be too fast.

The problem is that there are other more appealing tier4 abilities in the blitz doctrine. Heat Rounds is a solid choice, but I prefer Conviction. And the Blitz Core tree as a whole seems rather weak, I only use its tier1.
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Unkn0wn Offline
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« Reply #18 on: February 24, 2008, 08:29:26 am »

I still prefer Tigers over Panthers, the slightly lower speed values don't bother me that much.
The Tiger is a beast because it performs in all conditions, I just wish it could get an MG gunner.

The King Tiger is definately a no-go for me, it's just too slow Smiley.

I miss the Tiger Ace Sad.
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Apex Offline
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« Reply #19 on: February 24, 2008, 09:08:43 am »

Tigers are almost support units. Sitting in the back dealing punishment.
Panthers are strike units. Get in there fast, kill everything, get out fast again.
Thats why I prefer the Panther.

Suggestions from the other posts have been included.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2008, 09:42:48 am by Apex » Logged
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