Repairkits: Hard-counters?

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[Talas]

Fellow comrades,
I've been thinking of the repairkits and so. Like, first off. Inf. sqds tend to lose sqd,-members and through that they aren't able to regain full strength, which is currently the opposite of vehicles. Well, if they survive the encounter, which is the same for inf.

It's been said before that is very much "all-or-nothing". Getting that KT back to a safe repairarea may win the battle which makes the allies also too go for "all-or-nothing"-attack, paradropping AB:s or charge with M10:s. However, this type of encouraged gameplay ultra-aggro/vet-hunt, doesn't enjoy me.

So. That's basiclly the background.


IMO mines, stickes, faust (when the target vehicle is damaged) etc. is there to buy time and to get a critical. These are, in some ways, a hard-counter to tanks and in the same way mines, most often, damages and supress a inf. sqd. without them most often taking casualties. Same is true for the tanks (damage and critical) although with only one pop of repairkit it makes a well-placed sticky/mine a potential gamewinner, compared to the KT surviving and getting repaired to full health.

If the meaning of repair should be criticals I would say that repairkits should heal a lot less HP and get more uses. Say, heal 20% of HP, 2 uses. In this way you can repair criticals by getting to full health if not severely damaged. If the tank is severely damaged you can try and get lucky, repairing the criticals but still got a damaged tank that is still in the critical-zone for coming damage, making it as risky as using a 2-man-sqd.

This would lead to that Tiger isn't worthless by one sticke, the KT don't win the game by surviving with that 2% health, you don't need to "vet hunt" down repairing tanks to not face them a second time. If you knock a tank down hard, it also stays that way, almost

In my ears, it's a win-win-situation which removes the big drawbacks AND takes away the, IMO to big, advantages. Making a more fun and not so big-gambling game.

Cost on mines, stickes and the like may have to be changed as well, along with repair-costs.

Discuss!

[AmPM]

How is any of that a win win? All it does is make things like mines and stickies less effective in the short term and removes the ability to repair large amount of HP, currently most repairs heal nearly 100% of the units health (outside of some that were not adjusted for their unit).

[o4b2]

So the problem for you is that when facing tigers, KTs and jagds as allies you need to make a risky attack to prevent the tank from repairing to full health and from coming at you for a second time?

As an axis player, I do like the part that would allow me to have multiple, smaller repairs, as stickies/mines at 100 percent health cripple the tank or force you to use your repair almost immediately.

As an allied player, I think that dealing massive damage to a tank means that it will never be more than say 60 percent health would be nice.

Can you clarify this:

If the tank is severely damaged you can try and get lucky, repairing the criticals but still got a damaged tank that is still in the critical-zone for coming damage, making it as risky as using a 2-man-sqd.

Do you mean that if you have a low-health tank that the chances for say a sticky to give it a damaged engine are higher than say at 100% health? If so this is already built in to an extent.

The way I believe the repair mechanics work is that if a critical comes in the region of 40-100% health, the vehicle must be repaired to 100% health to remove that critical. Same business for 5-40% (repairs at 40%) and 0-5% (repairs at 5%). So using a 20% repair on a 10% health tank which was given a damaged engine between 5-40 percent will not heal the critical. I suggested a workaround to this awhile ago (not sure if it actually works) that would allow you to, as you said, "get lucky" and repair a critical if you used it at low health.

All in all, I really don't know if this is the solution to the problem, or even if there is a problem. I think repair kits have solved the major problems that existed in eir with respect to repairing (repair bunkers, OBM, etc).

[Mysthalin]

I do not believe that is a good idea Talas - what we have now works.

Do not forget that while that Tiger/King Tiger/Schwimwaggen is repairing, the enemy is down that much popcap, and is relieving pressure from the frontlines, which means that instead of trying a mad push for the tank/vehicle, you should be capturing more favorable grounds from the enemy so defeating that "resurrected" tank would be easier. Of course, if you think you CAN kill the enemy tank as it repairs - by all means try, but it is generally better to abuse the fact the enemy is repairing in the form of capturing territory and killing other units that would later support said tank.

[AmPM]

O4B, the problem comes not with larger tanks, but with medium and light vehicles which need to use the same repair system to keep the balance between medium spam and a couple heavies.

Would you want your Shermans/P4's/STuGs to only repair 20%? For a few of those thats less than 1 ATG hit of health.

[Tymathee]

i dont agree with you but you did give me a great idea. We can have a separate repair kit that only does crits but leaves health alone. It would have the double repair icon on it so it's easy to distinguish.

if you put a health state under "critical_action" I wonder if it'll only repair the crit. Or does that not matter.

[Unkn0wn]

Problem is that there is absolutely no way for us to prioritise repairing criticals, if there was then indeed we would be able to have repair kits heal crits first and only a considerable amount of health. But the way it is in vCOH is that if you take a crit when in the green and your tank drops to 5% health you'll need to heal it back to pretty much 100% before you lose that damaged engine.

I guess having repair kits with more uses but less repaired per usage COULD be an alternative approach to the whole repairing aspect but I'm not sure if that would be as desirable as it would pretty much be a nerf to AT weaponry doing critical damage.

[lionel23]

With Unknown on this, repairs work just fine for regular tanks, the issue is the super heavies due to the shit ton of HP they got compared to your basic sherman or stug, and I guess as Unknown says, there's no way to prioritze crits first.