The calliope compared to other Artillery pieces

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[winisez]

The reason this is not in the balance section is because i do not believe it to be a balance issue, I believe the calliope is superior to The 25 pounder, the Hummel, Howitzer and Stuka, and that is fine, allies, Armour doctrine in particular need an artillery piece of significant awesomeness, which the calliope provides nicely.

Ive put this in a seperate thread to avoid attempted hijack of another thread where crazy refuted my assertion that the calliope is an incredible artillery piece, by asking whether or not I had actually used it, I assume this was an attempt to infer that i had no idea what i was talking about.

What i want to discuss is whether or not people believe it is the best artillery piece in the game, whether it is tied with the Nebel ( what i believe to be the second best) or whether it is inferior to another piece I have failed to consider. ( i am aware i have not mentioned the priest,however without the doctrine it is rather difficult to judge what the unit will actually do).

To me the first step in answering the question is to ascertain what you want an artillery piece to do, to me an artillery piece is supposed to deliver long range disruption and damage in relatively short notice ( -5 seconds, includes time to position, aim and so forth).

The best two artillery pieces for this are in my opinion undoubtedly the Nebel and the Calliope. The reason I believe the calliope is superior to the nebel is that due to its volume of projectiles being significantly higher, It seems to be more reliable, where as the nebel has awesome potential, but is generally accepted to be quite random.

Furthermore It would be erroneous to ignore the price difference between the two units, the most significant factor to be in this regard to me is the fuel, with the calliope being roughly 3x the cost of the nebel, to me this more or less accounts for the lack of risk that the calliope will be captured and used against you, and that it is significantly harder to kill the nebel due to its durability and its speed.

Just a last comment- while the calliope is doctrine specific and the nebel is not i see that as no reason for the calliope to be vastly superior to the nebel, doctrines are supposed to add tactical and strategic options. Doctrines are NOT supposed to increase the cost efficiency of units, though in actual fact that is often the case, e.g carbines.


what are others thoughts on this?

[Groundfire]

wait, so your making a post purely on observations?

What is it that you want us to discuss. Youv'e basically given no information that needs to be refuted or refined.

[Smokaz]

He wants the hummel to be better.

[DuckOfDoom]

I do not understand why you are comparing a Nebelwerfer to Calliope, they are completely different artillery pieces.

First of all, a calliope is an direct fire artillery piece, which means that you need to have a clear field of fire to your target for it to be effective, where the nebelwerfer is an indirect fire artillery piece which ignores obstacles.

Second of all, nebelwerfer deals more supression and damage over time then direct damage, where the calliope is all about direct damage.

Third of all, a nebelwerfer is a crewed support weapon, vulnerable both to infantry and at, where the calliope is a mobile armored vehicle.

And finaly, a nebelwerfer gets bonuses to destroying buildings and garrisoned units where the calliope does not.

So, what are you saying, exactly? I dont understand from your post how the calliope is "better" then a nebelwerfer, its like comparing cutlery that serve completely different dining purposes - "I guess the knife is better than a fork for cutting a steak, so that means that the fork is useless" - the only thing that knife and fork have in common that they are both cutlery, thats about it. Sure, the knife might be better at cutting things, but the fork is much better at picking pieces of food off the plate.

tl;dr stop comparing two units that do completely different things.

edit: also yeah, I have a calliope in my army.

[tank130]

"I guess the knife is better than a fork for cutting a steak, so that means that the fork is useless" - the only thing that knife and fork have in common that they are both cutlery, thats about it. Sure, the knife might be better at cutting things, but the fork is much better at picking pieces of food off the plate.

This point is completely useless. How the fuck can you compare units if you don't include the spoon. I am so sick of you people leaving out the spoon........

[Mgallun74]

"I guess the knife is better than a fork for cutting a steak, so that means that the fork is useless" - the only thing that knife and fork have in common that they are both cutlery, thats about it. Sure, the knife might be better at cutting things, but the fork is much better at picking pieces of food off the plate.

This point is completely useless. How the fuck can you compare units if you don't include the spoon. I am so sick of you people leaving out the spoon........

so, tank, you like to spoon?  next time we play a game together we should hang out at the spawn and uhh... SPOON! 

buahhaha

[Pak88mm]

nothing better than an arty piece that can defend itself from tanks and infantry. i call that fair and balanced.....

[wittman420]

the calliope is badass, but sense their going to limit heavys to 1 per company i think they should limit the calliope to one a company. ;P

[Mgallun74]

nothing better than an arty piece that can defend itself from tanks and infantry. i call that fair and balanced.....

uh, thats what it was in reality?  what do u want it to do, just sit there like a freaking rock? lol..

i wish, somebody could allow us US Infantry players to move our howis around.

[smurfORnot]

First of all, a calliope is an direct fire artillery piece, which means that you need to have a clear field of fire to your target for it to be effective, where the nebelwerfer is an indirect fire artillery piece which ignores obstacles.

and still calli can hit you even if you are behind the house or hedges...

[Groundfire]

First of all, a calliope is an direct fire artillery piece, which means that you need to have a clear field of fire to your target for it to be effective, where the nebelwerfer is an indirect fire artillery piece which ignores obstacles.

and still calli can hit you even if you are behind the house or hedges...

If the arc is wrong, your just gonna blow up the houses and hedges'

[Two]

Along with the inf behind it most the time

[Tymathee]

the callie is the best arty piece for one major reason, when  you fire at an area, you're going to hit something. The other arty pieces when u fire at an area u have a higher chance of makign some incredible damage but u dont allways hit something, the callies spread almost ensure you'll hit when you're aiming at even if the target moves sometimes, but it doesn't alwayss do alot of damage. Its a nasty lil bugga and my favorite arty piece.

[NightRain]

nothing better than an arty piece that can defend itself from tanks and infantry. i call that fair and balanced.....

uh, thats what it was in reality?  what do u want it to do, just sit there like a freaking rock? lol..

i wish, somebody could allow us US Infantry players to move our howis around.

that's what other artilleries do...sit in spawn like a rock waiting for someone to come and try to blow it up

[Illegal_Carrot]

I'd have to agree that the Calli is definitely the best arty piece in the entire game. The thing is godly, can take quite a beating and keep going, is guaranteed to kill a whole bunch with its barrage, can't be counter-artied, or recrewed and used against you. With its main gun reengaged, it can even back a mean punch and defend itself.
A better comparison would be the Stuka and the Calli, in which case the Callie is still superior.

[Sach]

for utility value by pop the nebel is much better. Calliope really stunts your company against anyone that knows how to avoid being barraged.

[CrazyWR]

I'm not trying to say anything judging you win, I'm using one this war for the first time in EIR, and I'm seriously unimpressed.  Sure sometimes it has some great hits, but I can't count the amount of times I've got 0 kills or only 1 or 2 after barraging a bunch of support weapons.  Obviously I'm not the best with it, but I personally prefer a 105 or a nebel...

[NightRain]

You are lucky if you get more than 10 with a nebel. You are unlucky if you get 10 with calliope. It normally scores 20+

[Smokaz]

I quite often get 15-25 kills on my vet 3 nebel before I have to retreat the crew. Nebel isnt like the calliope. The calliope destroys things, the nebel only softens them up or kills weak units.

[winisez]

i agree with smokaz, most vetted nebs i see get a fair few kills, however i often see a calliope get about 8 kills in its first barrage. I do agree that it is not going to target the same targets as a hummel/ 105, which are basically support weapon snipers.  The calliope and hummel are best used to target massed infantry, hence the comparison between them.