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[Unkn0wn]

Well Ucross did tell everyone to build the most ridiculous and unbalanced/powerful companies people could think of. Since afterall, if it works, people will use it in the alpha, even if it's just a major spam fest of 100 infantry squads.

That being said:
Axis Grenadier Kompanie
Remaining  1 / 310 / 70 / 0
#x Unit (Pop / MP / Mun / Fuel)
5x Grenadiers  (15 / 950 / 0 / 0)
1x Officer  (3 / 260 / 0 / 0)
1x MG42 HMG  (2 / 240 / 30 / 0)
1x Upgrade: Panzershrek  (0 / 0 / 125 / 0)
1x Sniper  (2 / 360 / 30 / 0)
3x Upgrade: Grenades  (0 / 0 / 45 / 0) w/4 max uses
1x StuG  (5 / 800 / 0 / 150)
1x Pioneers  (2 / 80 / 0 / 0)

Allied Company
Remaining  1 / 110 / 100 / 10
#x Unit (Pop / MP / Mun / Fuel)
1x M10 Tank Destroyer  (4 / 800 / 0 / 140)
2x Engineers  (4 / 220 / 0 / 0)
1x Rangers  (3 / 220 / 70 / 0)
1x .30 Cal HMG  (2 / 210 / 20 / 0)
1x Mortar  (2 / 390 / 60 / 0)
7x Riflemen  (14 / 1050 / 0 / 0)
2x Upgrade: Grenades  (0 / 0 / 50 / 0) w/4 max uses



Oh and I heavily support Forefall on:

These ammunition limits are too minimal to really test the game imo.  More resources, especially fuel and munition, should be added to really test the system and balance.  Also, snipers should cost more munitions imo, primarily due to the difficulty in countering them with a set unit composition.

It's great fun to test all of these out, but to really know unit balance we gotta nudge up the resources to a higher amount so that we can get an idea on how most matches in EiR will really run. (And I think it's safe to say, most matches will have way more resources bound to them.)


Final notes:
- Say I want to have one grenadier squad with lmg, grenades & a panzerschreck, how will the system know? Or if I want to spread these 3 weapons across 3 squads?

- Why do allied grenades have 25 munitions per use while axis have 15? Is this a bug?

[fldash]

The system will know, however if you want me to know when I'm manually adding companies, you should specify how you want the upgrades, on separate squads or the same one.

Have you ever used an Axis grenade?  They don't kill anything.  A lot less than the nuclear grenades the Allies have.  That's the difference in fragmentation and concussion. 

[Rez]

You want unbalanced?  If I hoarded my resources, I'd save up 12240 MP, 450 Mun, and 2800 Fuel.  I'd invest it all in the following Kompanie, and dare anyone to counter it.

Remaining  0 / 0 / 0 / 0
#x Unit (Pop / MP / Mun / Fuel)
4x Tiger Ace  (24 / 12000 / 0 / 2800)
3x Pioneers  (6 / 240 / 0 / 0)
3x Upgrade: Bunker  (0 / 0 / 150 / 0)
3x Upgrade: Bunker Install Terror Repair  (0 / 0 / 150 / 0)
3x Upgrade: Flamethrower  (0 / 0 / 90 / 0)
3x Upgrade: Mine Sweeper  (0 / 0 / 60 / 0)

I could have gone with 5 Tiger Aces, but that would leave no Pop cap to bring in repair assets.  With a force like this, you could take a strategic map sector per turn, and nothing could really stop you.  You'd lose zero Tigers, if micro'd well, and you'd be gaining resources from each victory, which you could stockpile for a second or third Tiger Kompanie.

-----------------

Following the resource limits given, how about this unbalanced force:

Remaining  8 / 40 / 0 / 5
#x Unit (Pop / MP / Mun / Fuel)
4x Sniper  (8 / 1440 / 120 / 0)
1x M10 Tank Destroyer  (4 / 800 / 0 / 140)
1x Jeep  (2 / 160 / 0 / 5)
1x Engineers  (2 / 110 / 0 / 0)
1x Upgrade: Flamethrower  (0 / 0 / 30 / 0)
3x Riflemen  (6 / 450 / 0 / 0)
3x Upgrade: BAR  (0 / 0 / 150 / 0)

4 Snipers and 3 BAR-carrying Rifleman squads.  I don't see how any infantry can stand up to this.  One shot each from the Snipers drops a whole Grenadier squad.  The challenge is keeping the M10 alive.

[fldash]

Except, you are forgetting the fact that there are production limits.

For example, if we are playing 10 players versus 10 players, then there will be 50 (5x10) of each 2 unit cap unit available at the beginning of the war and 10 (1x10) units available of each "6 unit cap" unit.

Availability occurs with the war.   Each turn that passes, randomly (computer generated) one unit of the type "6 pop cap" unit becomes available, 2 units of 5 cap become available, 3 units of 4 cap become available, 4 units of 3 cap become available, and 5 units of 2 cap become available.  The totals are then multiplied by the number of players on each side.

So let's say it's a 10vs10.

The allied units would look like this in the 2 cap range:

Engineers: 110MP (50 available)
Riflemen: 150MP (50 available)
Jeep: 160MP, 5F (50 available)
HMG: 210MP, 20Ammo (50 available)
Mortar: 310MP, 40Ammo (50 available)
Sniper: 360MP, 30 Ammo (50 available)

During the first turn those allied commanders will purchase units and it might end up looking like this:

Engineers: 110MP (31 available)
Riflemen: 150MP (22 available)
Jeep: 160MP, 5F (42 available)
HMG: 210MP, 20Ammo (27 available)
Mortar: 310MP, 40Ammo (30 available)
Sniper: 360MP, 30 Ammo (41 available)

At the end of the turn, randomly, 5 units of the 2 unit cap group will get an increase.  Let's say it's: Jeep, Jeep, HMG, Mortar, HMG.   We then multiply this by 10 (10 players playing).  That gives us the new increses of 20 more jeeps, 20 more HMGS, and 10 more Mortars.  So the new totals look like this:

Engineers: 110MP (31 available)
Riflemen: 150MP (22 available)
Jeep: 160MP, 5F (50 available) <-- capped at 50 (5 x number of players / pop cap)
HMG: 210MP, 20Ammo (47 available)
Mortar: 310MP, 40Ammo (40 available)
Sniper: 360MP, 30 Ammo (41 available)

All availabilities will always be capped at the number of players times 5, divided by the pop cap - 1.  So in a 10 vs 10 you can only ever have 10 tigers available, and 50 riflemen available (in other words, the amount you started the war with).

The chance of you being able to snag those Tiger Ace's is very unlikely. 

[Rez]

The Fuhrer isn't going to be too happy with the supply problem.  But who cares what he thinks, I like it.

[Dasfubar]

I hope snipers arn't that abundant otherwise I could use this:
5 snipers
2 AT gun

-enough mun. left for one AP shell-

If the axis do have a bike, and it manages to get behind the AT guns, this force is doomed.

Also, I wonder if the flamethrower should cost a bit more, at least for the allies because it has more staying power with them. (2 man squad vs 3 man squad)

[Ucross]

Forget the jeeps, just use the MP in riflesquads or airborne (which would be basically 15 squads) and rush the snipers and AT. =P

[Forefall]

Point is, support squads are expensive, and in a normal army are effectively attacked by snipers.  Snipers can be difficult to counter and are currently very beneficial in a normal army.  An army of snipers won't work, but an army with several will work too well.

[Ucross]

I disagree.  We'll have to test it.     You grab your snipers and your army, I'll grab my 9 more rifiles and we'll play

[Raddish]

can we vote on the winner? my vote is on the.................................... ...... riflemen

[Dasfubar]

I guess you guys are right, I wasn't really thinking. However... If you drop one sniper and add 2 .30cals there'd be more of a challenge...

hmmm.... hmg's, I wonder what would happen if you had an almost pure hmg company...

[Raddish]

deploy them in a circle wiht some at guns and nothing will beat them, youd need an engineer to make a circular barricade first though

[Lai]

any sniper, mortar or arty will beat it.

[SturmHaubitze]

I think the only "difficult to beat" companies are ones that either...

A. Have one armoured vehicle (StuG / StuH / M10) with infantry devoted to killing any AT or infantry that get in its way.
B. Two to three AT guns with a solid amount of infantry that can keep threats away.

And these aren't impossible to beat either. Trying to make a purely defensive force is probably going to get you killed, considering that mortars trump a static infantry defense.

[Harry Palms]

#x Unit (Pop / MP / Mun / Fuel)

Remaining  5 / 10 / 10 / 5

2x Halftrack  (8 / 1300 / 0 / 140)
2x Upgrade: Quad Upgrade  (0 / 0 / 200 / 0)
3x Riflemen  (6 / 450 / 0 / 0)
1x Jeep  (2 / 160 / 0 / 5)
1x Engineers  (2 / 110 / 0 / 0)
1x 57mm AT Gun  (3 / 550 / 50 / 0)
2x .30 Cal HMG  (4 / 420 / 40 / 0)

[Harry Palms]

#x Unit (Pop / MP / Mun / Fuel)

Remaining  1 / 70 / 10 / 5

1x M10 Tank Destroyer  (4 / 800 / 0 / 140)
3x Rangers  (9 / 660 / 210 / 0)
1x Mortar  (2 / 390 / 60 / 0)
4x Riflemen  (8 / 600 / 0 / 0)
1x .30 Cal HMG  (2 / 210 / 20 / 0)
1x Jeep  (2 / 160 / 0 / 5)
1x Engineers  (2 / 110 / 0 / 0)

[Harry Palms]

#x Unit (Pop / MP / Mun / Fuel)

Remaining  3 / 120 / 0 / 25

5x Riflemen  (10 / 750 / 0 / 0)
1x Upgrade: BAR  (0 / 0 / 50 / 0)
1x Jeep  (2 / 160 / 0 / 5)
1x 57mm AT Gun  (3 / 550 / 50 / 0)
1x M8 Armored Car  (4 / 550 / 0 / 50)
1x Upgrade: M8 Armor Skirts  (0 / 0 / 50 / 0)
1x Upgrade: M8 Machine Gun  (0 / 0 / 50 / 0)
2x Engineers  (4 / 220 / 0 / 0)
1x Halftrack  (4 / 650 / 0 / 70)
1x Upgrade: Quad Upgrade  (0 / 0 / 100 / 0)

[fldash]

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