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Churchill AVRE
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Topic: Churchill AVRE (Read 7829 times)
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fallensoldier7
EIR Veteran
Posts: 667
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #20 on:
July 03, 2010, 06:15:52 pm »
Quote from: Firesparks on July 03, 2010, 04:37:00 pm
Quote from: brn4meplz on July 03, 2010, 04:15:53 pm
You can use an AVRE to change a battle withoput even using an AVRE. I've driven up to infantry or vetted paks so many times just turned right at them(so there is no turret traverse) and the person backs off or retreats because of the threat of instant annihilation. Not only that but between vet and hobarts funnies the recharge is so low and the range is good. Hitting moving units is an art but killing an HMG in a house is simple enough.
If the axis was scouting properly the churchill would have been shot as it was driving up to the pak. If the enemy simply back away it's a lose for the brit because the AVRE is most likely hurting and the axis simply lost a position. You can say that's enough, but it is really worth investing 410mp 240fuel just for that?
He was talking about using it during a battle to scare away a pak, not charging in by itself.
Quote from: gamesguy2 on July 03, 2010, 02:14:37 pm
AVRE is horrid vs pinned units, it does no damage against them.
I don't think very many people know that.
Logged
Spartan_Marine88
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4838
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #21 on:
July 03, 2010, 06:17:05 pm »
Quote from: brn4meplz on July 03, 2010, 05:53:44 pm
A minute is a pretty short time frame considering what it can do in a single shot. decrew a Flak. a Pak. A house. kill a squad. And they are rarely in harms way if you use them correctly. furthermore for 8 population having a 900hp AT sponge on the field is a good bargain. Furthermore should you have hull down you increase the effectiveness of anyone nearby
I can't tell you how many times i have used a AVRE on cooldown to lure a panther or p4 into coming into safe range of my Firefly
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Quote from: Sachaztan on March 24, 2013, 03:49:43 pm
Yes that's me, the special snowflake.
Firesparks
Honoured Member
Posts: 1209
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #22 on:
July 03, 2010, 06:38:50 pm »
Quote from: brn4meplz on July 03, 2010, 05:53:44 pm
A minute is a pretty short time frame considering what it can do in a single shot. decrew a Flak. a Pak. A house. kill a squad. And they are rarely in harms way if you use them correctly. furthermore for 8 population having a 900hp AT sponge on the field is a good bargain. Furthermore should you have hull down you increase the effectiveness of anyone nearby
it's still only possible if you brought hobart funnies AND have a vet 3 avre. Considering that there's only 2 vet3 AVRE in existence it's a moot point. It's purely theory crafting. It's pretty bad if I need vet3 on the unit for it to not suck. You're acting like I can just pop a vet3 AVRE out of thin air.
Quote
I can't tell you how many times i have used a AVRE on cooldown to lure a panther or p4 into coming into safe range of my Firefly
so it's a 410 mp 240 f bait?
Quote
He was talking about using it during a battle to scare away a pak, not charging in by itself.
My point is that to actually scare away a pak (or anything) I would have to get in firing range, which mean I would have to let my churchill get shot at.
«
Last Edit: July 03, 2010, 06:46:14 pm by Firesparks
»
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With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine. However, this is not necessarily a good idea. It is hard to be sure where they are going to land, and it could be dangerous sitting under them as they fly overhead. -- RFC 1925
LeoPhone
Honoured Member
Posts: 0
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #23 on:
July 03, 2010, 06:46:37 pm »
Quote from: brn4meplz on July 03, 2010, 05:53:44 pm
A minute is a pretty short time frame considering what it can do in a single shot. decrew a Flak. a Pak. A house. kill a squad. And they are rarely in harms way if you use them correctly. furthermore for 8 population having a 900hp AT sponge on the field is a good bargain. Furthermore should you have hull down you increase the effectiveness of anyone nearby
it has 700 hp. only croc has 900.
and why take an AVRE for bait if you can get a CCT for much less?
the cct can even take out pinned infantry while the avre cant. (crush ftl)
Logged
fallensoldier7
EIR Veteran
Posts: 667
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #24 on:
July 03, 2010, 06:48:02 pm »
Quote from: Firesparks on July 03, 2010, 06:38:50 pm
Quote
He was talking about using it during a battle to scare away a pak, not charging in by itself.
My point is that to actually scare away a pak (or anything) I would have to get in firing range, which mean I would have to let my churchill get shot at.
Er.. why would your opponents aim for your AVRE when there are far more potent units attacking them? Like a Cromwell or British infantry?
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Jazzhead
EIR Veteran
Posts: 236
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #25 on:
July 03, 2010, 06:50:58 pm »
Quote from: LeoPhone on July 03, 2010, 06:46:37 pm
Quote from: brn4meplz on July 03, 2010, 05:53:44 pm
A minute is a pretty short time frame considering what it can do in a single shot. decrew a Flak. a Pak. A house. kill a squad. And they are rarely in harms way if you use them correctly. furthermore for 8 population having a 900hp AT sponge on the field is a good bargain. Furthermore should you have hull down you increase the effectiveness of anyone nearby
it has 700 hp. only croc has 900.
and why take an AVRE for bait if you can get a CCT for much less?
the cct can even take out pinned infantry while the avre cant. (crush ftl)
Wouldn't the AVRE be more durable b/c it has churchill armor?
Logged
Firesparks
Honoured Member
Posts: 1209
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #26 on:
July 03, 2010, 06:52:23 pm »
Quote from: fallensoldier7 on July 03, 2010, 06:48:02 pm
Quote from: Firesparks on July 03, 2010, 06:38:50 pm
Quote
He was talking about using it during a battle to scare away a pak, not charging in by itself.
My point is that to actually scare away a pak (or anything) I would have to get in firing range, which mean I would have to let my churchill get shot at.
Er.. why would your opponents aim for your AVRE when there are far more potent units attacking them? Like a Cromwell or British infantry?
If the AVRE is as scary and potent as brn4meplz claiming it to be then naturally the axis player is going to aiming for the it first. That's the point of his whole argument isn't it? Now you're saying that the british Tommy or even the cromwell are more potent than a AVRE?
Quote
Wouldn't the AVRE be more durable b/c it has churchill armor?
Most axis weapon still cleaves through churchill armor. The Pak's ambush bonus negate any armor and most axis weapon have at least ~50% chance against it. The churchill is also the slowest speed next to the King Tiger. It's base hp of 700 is also somewhat low for a meatshield.
Quote from: brn4meplz on July 03, 2010, 05:53:44 pm
A minute is a pretty short time frame considering what it can do in a single shot. decrew a Flak. a Pak. A house. kill a squad. And they are rarely in harms way if you use them correctly. furthermore for 8 population having a 900hp AT sponge on the field is a good bargain. Furthermore should you have hull down you increase the effectiveness of anyone nearby
First of all, the avre, mk 4 and mk 6 only have 700 hp, even with hobart's funnies it's still 805.
Secondly it's not 100% foolproof against any of the example you listed. I've had a garrisoned mg42 escape from my avre.
I'm not going to argue against the effectiveness of the hulldown, but I can just take the mk4 if I'm just going to use the more expensive AVRE as a meatshield.
«
Last Edit: July 03, 2010, 08:22:52 pm by Firesparks
»
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brn4meplz
Misinformation Officer
Posts: 6952
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #27 on:
July 03, 2010, 11:00:44 pm »
I do not have a single game where either of my AVRE's does not kill more then it's cost. NOT A SINGLE GAME. They routinely kill multiple support weapons(obviously munitions cost must be calculated instead of fuel as an AVRE will barely/rarely kill a fuel unit) but I routinely kill 2 or more Paks, HMG's or Mortars. Sniper hunting is also a snap with an AVRE and a good investment of shots. You will rarely find my AVRE's in fields. I pretty much keep them limited to Urban areas or shot blockers. Either way I look at it, I rarely take multiple Pak shots, kill more then my cost and only lose them to panthers or massed P4's.
All things considered they are a good investment in my company. If i want to i could vet 3 an AVRE in 5 or less games most likely(they regularly achieve 20+ kills) but I have no compunction losing them and even though the cooldown reduction with vet is nice I'd rather not have the stigma of trying to retain the vet over losing the tank. Much the same as if losing a Vet 3 FF or command tank(happened recently) will bring about a win I'd gladly make the sacrifice.
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He thinks Tactics is a breath mint
Quote from: Unkn0wn on July 31, 2012, 03:50:15 am
Wow I think that was the nicest thing brn ever posted!
Quote from: Bear on June 19, 2013, 01:24:59 pm
the pussy of a prostitute is not tight enough for destroy a condom
3rdCondor
Donator
Posts: 1536
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #28 on:
July 04, 2010, 12:18:28 am »
Until we see priests, this POS is the baddest arty the brits have on the field atm.
Logged
Quote from: Alpha TIG on August 08, 2012, 11:55:14 pm
No tits, but i will bake a cake then eat it in honour of Sir Condor The 3rd
Quote from: Smokaz on August 14, 2012, 04:15:58 pm
fuck the pgren rifle, fucking dogshit weapon
Quote from: TheIcelandicManiac on November 28, 2012, 04:04:22 pm
My beautiful black pussy won
Firesparks
Honoured Member
Posts: 1209
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #29 on:
July 04, 2010, 05:56:25 am »
Quote from: brn4meplz on July 03, 2010, 11:00:44 pm
I do not have a single game where either of my AVRE's does not kill more then it's cost. NOT A SINGLE GAME. They routinely kill multiple support weapons(obviously munitions cost must be calculated instead of fuel as an AVRE will barely/rarely kill a fuel unit) but I routinely kill 2 or more Paks, HMG's or Mortars. Sniper hunting is also a snap with an AVRE and a good investment of shots. You will rarely find my AVRE's in fields. I pretty much keep them limited to Urban areas or shot blockers. Either way I look at it, I rarely take multiple Pak shots, kill more then my cost and only lose them to panthers or massed P4's.
All things considered they are a good investment in my company. If i want to i could vet 3 an AVRE in 5 or less games most likely(they regularly achieve 20+ kills) but I have no compunction losing them and even though the cooldown reduction with vet is nice I'd rather not have the stigma of trying to retain the vet over losing the tank. Much the same as if losing a Vet 3 FF or command tank(happened recently) will bring about a win I'd gladly make the sacrifice.
It's a specialized tank that excel in certain situation. I'm not saying it's worthless but what you are describing is not strength, it's its constraint. By comparison the normal tanks still retain the ability to kill vehicle and roaming infantry and attack static defense. It serve a very specialized role in the RE and I'm saying that it's over priced as it is right now.
You keep going on about how awesome the AVRE is with vet, but I'm saying it's mostly a moot point. Veterancy are nice (temporary) bonus for a unit. It's there because every unit has veterancy and shouldn't be the deciding factor in regard to buying a unit.
Logged
TheLastArmada
EIR Veteran
Posts: 215
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #30 on:
July 04, 2010, 08:53:19 am »
Quote from: Firesparks on July 04, 2010, 05:56:25 am
It's a specialized tank that excel in certain situation. I'm not saying it's worthless but what you are describing is not strength, it's its constraint. By comparison the normal tanks still retain the ability to kill vehicle and roaming infantry and attack static defense. It serve a very specialized role in the RE and I'm saying that it's over priced as it is right now.
You keep going on about how awesome the AVRE is with vet, but I'm saying it's mostly a moot point. Veterancy are nice (temporary) bonus for a unit. It's there because every unit has veterancy and shouldn't be the deciding factor in regard to buying a unit.
+1
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rifle87654
EIR Veteran
Posts: 1107
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #31 on:
July 04, 2010, 09:09:19 am »
Quote
once you miss it's a dead weight for over 2 minute while the ability recharge. Hobart's funnies cuts down the reload time but it's still a long wait.
Tell the devs to make that hull mg below better.
Accu, dmg, surpress...
Make it like gren lmg42.
Logged
Quote from: TheIcelandicManiac on July 13, 2011, 09:33:42 am
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Does he have a problem?
Anyway he's hilarious.
TheLastArmada
EIR Veteran
Posts: 215
Re: Churchill AVRE
«
Reply #32 on:
July 04, 2010, 09:21:51 am »
Quote from: rifle87654 on July 04, 2010, 09:09:19 am
Quote
once you miss it's a dead weight for over 2 minute while the ability recharge. Hobart's funnies cuts down the reload time but it's still a long wait.
Tell the devs to make that hull mg below better.
Accu, dmg, surpress...
Make it like gren lmg42.
Thats actually not a bad idea...
Seeing as supressed inf take next to no damage from a Petard round
either try to gib the squads with the mortar or hope to supress with the Hull mg
Would make the AVRE comparable to a Super 1 shot StuH with better armor
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