Your biggest pricing/pool gripe

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[Unkn0wn]

Hey all

We'd like to throw out some pricing/pool fixes to help balance the game while we wait for the doctrine rework and some stat overhauls on reward units to be released.

For now, we'd like to hear from the community what prices/pool values they are really having trouble with justifying in their company, preferably with elaboration as to why this unit is either underpriced or overpriced. This to help the balance team discover possible imbalances, oversights and whatnot.

So post away!

[NightRain]

Commandos are absolutely devestating with their poolcost ( and manpower cost (310) While their effectiveness doesn't even match unupgraded Stormtrooper squads performance (recomendation for price 300 manpower instead of 310). I'm not sure if this issue is same with the Failschrimjägers but anyway  the pool for Mandos is horrible.

British M7 Priest's Both pool and price are absolutely stunningly high compared to its effectiveness. 24 Pool cost is extraordinarily huge for a medicore SPG I do believe this same issue rests with the Hummel as well.

I'm somewhat sure that British officers shouldn't come with poolcost of 6, at least NOT the Ltd.

Perhaps Stormtrooper poolcost could come down a little bit, as it is 9. Price of 300 makes sure that these fellows aren't spammed in great numbers. Small adjustment on pool to a lower direction would be good.

Axis mortar pool of 6 should be increased to 7. This is due to both HMG42 and Axis Mortar being both at 6 pool while they share a different role Axis mortar is unarguable the best mortar in EIRR like environment.

I've always wondered why Nebel is 400 manpower 35 munitions and 100 fuel, why the munition count? Due to fire? No other artillery comes with mun cost unless repair/ability is bought.

Both 105mm and 25Pdr needs a price increase OR Mobile Artillery gets a price reduction. There is absolutely no reason to take Mobile artillery over immobile artillery on the allied side that is. 105 is cheap 380 and 140 fuel and 25Pdr even cheaper 360mp 120 fuel. Compared to mobile arty which is Calliope, Hummel and M7. While Calliope is fine due to it being a M4 Sherman, both M7 and Hummel are in a massive price. 3x 25Pdrs and 2.5x 105mm is way better than one Priest. 2-3 Barrels compared to 1 is just silly imo. Suggestion is this:

Either Immobile Arty gets a price increase or Mobile Artillery comes down in its price. Mobility = Minor defence (Both pieces are Slow and fragile).

Those for now




ADDED:

Bazooka should come with a higher cost. 190 manpower with 55 mun bazooka can take on any light vehicle and medicorely vs Medium and Heavy. 190 Manpower + 55 muns  + Tank Reapers + Spam of them...Gentlemen, you know what that is, the march of doom vs any PE player and vehicle heavy companies. Who cares about ATGs when Zooks become minishrecks

[skaffa]

Would be more fun if storms cost a bit less Pool.

[Groundfire]

Brns taking it upon himself to tie the pool cost of elite infantry to their upgrades, allowing you to field storms, mandos, etc with no weapons upgrades at a cheaper pool cost.

So that's being addressed, are there any other pool compliants that fall outside of the pool cost for elites?

[skaffa]

Does that include nades ?

[EliteGren]

Nades will probably increase pool value by +1.

[Artekas]

I don't like the idea of minor upgrades for infantry costing more pool at all, but I might be a bit biased because that change will put my current company about 30 points into oversupply.

[AmPM]

How does that help?

Stormies for instance are insanely high pool cost (9), extremely expensive (300mp) AND have super expensive upgrades.

None of the units need to be used without upgrades at a lower pool cost, they just need a default lower pool cost.

Want your infantry to be only Stormies? Ok, but good luck affording any upgrades.

Otherwise, they are only slightly better Grens.

6 pool is about as high as any "Elite" Infantry should get.

[Unkn0wn]

Nono Artekas, I think you misunderstand the system.

1. It will only be for elite infantry
2. The base elite infantry unit will cost less pool
3. With its best upgrades the elite infantry unit will have the pool cost it has currently.


For example, currently AB is 8 pool
Standard AB could be 4 pool cost.. You buy grenades, the total pool cost of that squad is raised to 5.
You buy RRs, pool cost is now 8.

This way people can field more unupgraded elite infantry, allowing for a bit more company variety.
(Ranger heavy companies, full-AB companies, etc.)

6 pool is about as high as any "Elite" Infantry should get.

There's a reason they're 8 really. We don't want people to field blobs of SMG rangers, RR Airbourne, Schreck Storms, etc.

As for Storms, we can probably consider lowering them to 8.

[Groundfire]

What Unknownz said.

[Artekas]

Ah gotcha, phew!

[AmPM]

Yes...because hordes of unupgraded units will be so scary...

I'm just saying, this supposed blob of Storm Schreks for instance at 300mu a squad...where will the rest of their army be, and will it also all be countered by some Jeeps or recons...

[Unkn0wn]

No one said hordes of unupgraded units are scary or problematic... The opposite actually, we want to allow people to run lots of unupgraded elite infantry in a company if they feel the need to. It's not problematic.

What is problematic is blobs of upgraded elite infantry.

Anyway, you're really just arguing the availability system now. This is not the place for it. If you want you can make a new thread about it.

[Artekas]

Also, I remembered something I thought was a little off. Recon Tommies and Sappers both take up 6 infantry pool, and while I've only played Brits twice that bugged me a lot. Recon aren't exactly elite infantry - they're the scouts for the faction, while all other factions have scouts that are very cheap pool-wise. Now obviously Recon Tommies are not like your other scouts, but rather the mix of mainline infantry and scout - not as good at either role but it can do both. Nonetheless, I think that 3 or 4 pool would be more appropriate.

Sappers are the only infantry anti-tank the British get, and they cost more pool than comparable anti-tank infantry (Grens with Panzershrecks and Tankbusters).

Any particular reasons for having both of these at 6 pool?

(6 pool... never thought I'd be saying that term outside of Starcraft contexts )

[EliteGren]

Actually the British get Boys AT rifles, which are tied to a doctrine though. Recons cost alot of pool because Recon spam has been very effective in the past.

[Unkn0wn]

Maybe we should consider making the marksman shot a MUN upgrade and then giving the upgrade a + pool cost. That way the base unit could be made to cost less pool.

[NightRain]

Why not give them turn on and turn off ability of Recon. If you turn on Recon's Recon ability it'll walk like in VCoH But it's LoS Recieves a massive buff. And it can be put on and off at will like Tiger's Commander. Due to lack of Jeeps (All non-commando) it'd be a nice ability for recons to give brits a proper recon unit

[brn4meplz]

Snipers already completely destroy British players, we are not giving them walk speed in any capacity

[NightRain]

Snipers already completely destroy British players, we are not giving them walk speed in any capacity

It is an ability to give them massive los Bonus that can be toggled on and toggled off. Not a permanent slow motion movement thing

[TheLastArmada]

its not LOS recon tommies really need
The the radius of their detection that needs a buff