[PE] PzGren Changes

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[BigDick]

maniac i  give u the advise to spam incendiary assault on vanilla pgrens now and let them die while doing so

thats the only way u can reliable kill/make retreat something before ur dead

[TheIcelandicManiac]

i use tank hunters.

my mainline force was to use assult grens to take out atguns and then rush with hetzer but now that has been made useless i cant use tankhunters anymore.

[BigDick]

then spam pgrens with magnetic at nades and normal incendary nades and target their at and get out ur jagdpanther out midgame

[TheIcelandicManiac]

i have spammed magnetic grenades before and i liked it but i dont like to spam unlike gork.

[Killer344]

so you guys are gonna keep the change eh?

well then fuck PE due to now thir only mainline inf gets get raped by a single barsquad.

lol, you do realise that before the "buff/nerf", I don't care how you call it; they could be raped worse by more weapons? (anything that ignored their armor like flames, arty, nades, tanks, smgs)

[lionel23]

Raped worse?  They are being raped worse in their current state while being buffed against tanks... might as well add a modifier to put all PzGrens in red cover for the duration of the game.  It's getting way too easy as allies to roll axis infantry with constant axis nerfing.

[sheffer]

problem is that they are overnerfed vs suppression. soldier armor +  sergeant and old assault grens can break through the line. i think its only real problem with

"buff/nerf", I don't care how you call it

I dont think they are able to kill bar rifles now even without "bar instawin" button

[pqumsieh]

just a tip when playing PE. I use to put assault squads into half-tracks and search out infantry squads with little to no AT cover (which is not rare, trust me) and take them out in seconds.

On multiple occasions, I would engage Brit blobs (sometimes with a sapper or two) and take out 2 or 3 tommies + 1 or 2 sappers + LT with just 1 or 2 assault squads.

It requires you to be mindful of AT currently fielded and its position, but with some simple scouting you pretty much always win. They do so well its quite insane to be honest.

If you get buttoned, step out of the carrier until they focus back on you, then get back into the carrier. Rinse and repeat. Do not try and kill groups that are greater in number by 2/1. If there are 4 infantry squads, bring 2 assault carriers.

Also, do not be greedy. Sometimes you just run through for 3 seconds and continue forward, just enough time to either take 1 AT shot or move out of range of that readjusted ATG.

Final tip, in a previous game try and kill some infantry with your half-track in order to reach level 1. If you feel really crazy that day try and reach level 2. Once you couple the carrier with infantry, it will never lose its vet. Vet 1 will reduce inc damage by 15% and vet 2 usually gives you a speed/acc increase.

Hope that helps with infantry spam.

PQ

[NightRain]

Pq post replays of you using that tactic :p I want to see with my very own eyes

[sheffer]

yeah, just buy IHT for every assault gren and they are ok  

[smurfORnot]

free halftracks for everyone 

[kwiatekkek]

Pq post replays of you using that tactic :p I want to see with my very own eyes

and me

[pqumsieh]

you will have to wait for TH to come out. its a super effective tactic, I really dont run any offensive infantry without a halftrack. Whether they be TB's or AG's, the half track is like a health and movement speed buff you really shouldn't go without.

PQ

[cloud234]

you will have to wait for TH to come out. its a super effective tactic, I really dont run any offensive infantry without a halftrack. Whether they be TB's or AG's, the half track is like a health and movement speed buff you really shouldn't go without.

PQ

I think people would prefer more options to play PE. I like foot sloggers :p

lol, you do realise that before the "buff/nerf", I don't care how you call it; they could be raped worse by more weapons? (anything that ignored their armor like flames, arty, nades, tanks, smgs)

Yes, you are right that everything else kills PzGrens better previously but bear in mind that gameplay and company build has ALREADY been adapted for that style of play. I already "avoid" flames, arty, nades, tanks and smgs because those will kill pzgrens hands down. Don't tell me you fight off rangers or commandos with KCH on wehr! You bring a MG42 or a tank! Right counter for the right job.

Essentially you're asking people to "re-think" the PE play style. Even with this new "nerf/buff", I will still run my PzGrens  away at the first sight of those units. You've also effectively reduced their performance against the most common enemy unit, Rifles and BARS. In a recent replay posted (Magnetic AT Mines), I've shown you that a single BAR Rifle squad single handedly beat off almost 4-5 squads of PzGrens. How is that not broken???

[Groundfire]

Essentially you're asking people to "re-think" the PE play style. Even with this new "nerf/buff", I will still run my PzGrens  away at the first sight of those units. You've also effectively reduced their performance against the most common enemy unit, Rifles and BARS. In a recent replay posted (Magnetic AT Mines), I've shown you that a single BAR Rifle squad single handedly beat off almost 4-5 squads of PzGrens. How is that not broken???

I watched that same replay and did not see this at all, or anything that looked like a fair fight. I saw some Bar squads beat up 4-5 half dead, 2-3 man no upgrade pgrens, but if you could get a video of 1 full health BAR squad beating 4-5 full health pgrens in a direct engagement, then that would be most appreciative.

But what I did get out of that replay was this:


Basically shows the base relationship between rifle and pgren is still intact, even with the supporting squad in the back popping off a few shots. Base relationship is good, and upgrades make the unit scale, which is how it should be.

Ultimately, I think Shockcoil and Panda would've done better that game if they hadnt LoLcharged every vehicle/sherman with their AT grenade Pgrens and properly supported them with an earlier jadg or panthers. They exhausted themselves too quickly instead of playing smart. City side of Neunen didnt see any action all game. It was all muscle.

Tbh, were the PE changes not in effect, then this could've gone very wrong for you cloud. But what I saw was that when Pgrens played in cover, rifles died. When rifles played in cover, Pgrens died and the unit exchanged dmg at a more acceptable rate, and BARs became useful instead of the least cost effective option rifles have vs. PE.

[spinn72]

lol, you do realise that before the "buff/nerf", I don't care how you call it; they could be raped worse by more weapons? (anything that ignored their armor like flames, arty, nades, tanks, smgs)

I'm not in any place to voice my opinion considering I know nothing about statistics, all I can say is that from experience, BAR's are now nastier than before, and a lot more allied players are fielding more BAR's in their companies rather than spending the MU on shermans or M8's.

If you think that pgrens are weaker, then I'd strongly suggest for any PE players to employ IST's/Armoured Cars for AI and tank busters for AT. Use fuel as an AI measure, MU as an AT measure (50mms) and use pgrens as bait. There, you just changed your company to adopt to the meta game, that wasn't so bad now, was it?

I still don't have an answer, why were PzGrens changed at all?

[bayarea510]

MG rip pg to pieces now...

[cloud234]

But what I did get out of that replay was this:


Basically shows the base relationship between rifle and pgren is still intact, even with the supporting squad in the back popping off a few shots. Base relationship is good, and upgrades make the unit scale, which is how it should be.

I actually did that charge deliberately to test the effect to see how "survivable" they are with gren HP.

I watched that same replay and did not see this at all, or anything that looked like a fair fight. I saw some Bar squads beat up 4-5 half dead, 2-3 man no upgrade pgrens, but if you could get a video of 1 full health BAR squad beating 4-5 full health pgrens in a direct engagement, then that would be most appreciative.

1 BAR Rifle = 200 MP 80 Munition.

4.5 squads of 66% health PzGrens (averaged out) = 4.5 x 0.66 x 215MP = 638.55 MP

You're telling me a 638.55 MP worth of unit should not win a 200MP 80 Munition unit? When they surround them on all sides with some of them in cover?

granted the equivalent will be 3 full squads of volks against 1 rifle BAR squad.

I don't have xfire. Could you put up the replay of that engagement specifically so that I may critic it better?

[NightRain]

If The PE infantry has to behave like Grens then make their Suppression resistance the same as Grens and give them medkits of some sort. Without them they just CAN'T Survive. MGs tears these guys to pieces in 10 second. Suppresses with one silly burst.

[cloud234]

If The PE infantry has to behave like Grens then make their Suppression resistance the same as Grens and give them medkits of some sort. Without them they just CAN'T Survive. MGs tears these guys to pieces in 10 second. Suppresses with one silly burst.

Interestingly, the only difference between Grenadiers and PzGrens is the suppression recovery rate of 0.008 and 0.007 on COH Stats. Does this make a world of difference? Perhaps?

http://picly.us/coh/basics/suppression.html