88s

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[RikiRude]

I know it looks that way, but it's actually just an anecdote from a game a few days ago. It was a prime example of a player who isn't normally terrible falling to pieces at the sight of an 88.


There is just something about 88s that can drive people to panic. The best way to fight them, though, is to just keep calm and work with your team. Interestingly enough, most 88's can be used as a hindrance for your enemy rather than something to be feared.


-Wind

the 88 is like any other fear, to over come it you must understand it, and use it. 88s barely phase me because ive always used them as a defensive player, i know their strengths and weakness, before you ask for an 88 nerf, play with them for a while.

[Poppi]

88s arent really a problem to overcome.
Most trouble they caused is b/c players single handed rush the thing and get gibbed by its high accuracy vs everything (which i dont think makes sense).
Instead use the other flank and avoid it, or coordinate attack. unfortunately there are times where 1-2 88s can cover the whole map.And all axis has to do is fortify it with whatever and it turns into 1 shitty ass game if allies didnt bring arty.

[TheWindCriesMary]

before you ask for an 88 nerf, play with them for a while.

I can only assume this comment is directed towards the people in the thread suggesting nerfs and not me?

-Wind

[Vermillion_Hawk]

However, sometimes on maps like Tanteville where there are wide open spaces in parts of the map, 88s can lock down a massive portion of the map. Especially dangerous when scouting units are used in conjunction. The other problem is that in other maps, even if there are hedges blocking vision for the 88, chances are some player will bring out a heavy crush unit to flatten the area and create the perfect staging ground for the gun.

Coupled with the massive range any flanking assault is going to be a cramped one, which could be disastrous depending on the circumstances. The only sort of nerf I think the FlaK should recieve is maybe make it so that the FlaK has less accuracy towards the edges of its range against non-vehicular targets (it's still insanely accurate up until then), and maybe make it so that it takes 10 or 20 seconds to switch from "gun mode" to "artillery mode" and then back again.

[Tymathee]

I love when 88's come on the field, cuz before long i take 'em and use 'em against them cuz usually when u snatch an 88, the axis team will rush it to either take it back or destroy it and if they dont, you rape their vehicles so eventually they come after it and you just sit back and kill everything that comes near.

Best way to use an 88 in my opinion is to use it to bait the other team and close off a side of the map and attack elsewhere but a lot of players put up the 88 and protect it like it's the allspark

[tank130]

Well, I have taken 88's in 3 occasions very simply using my AB company.
Drop AB rifles & AB hmg on 88 location. Wait until timer is down to about 10 secs and the rifles & hmg are about to land. Run a recon to get LOS, drop a bombing run.
Bombing run de-crews it, AB rifles land & re-crew, AB hmg keeps it covered.

The one and only time it has not worked was in my game with the resident whiz kid.
What I did not see until it was too late was:
1.) the enemy had built trenches around 88 and had them full of flamers.
2.) while I was waiting for the timer, whiz kid made a push and pushed all the enemy units back to the flak while at the same time the enemy had just pulled on a new call in of infantry. The map was Chateau and the 88 was set up by the house nearest the SW spawn.

Of course, if whiz kid was listening to vent instead of giving lectures in chat, He would have waited until I seized the flak to make his push.

So far I have beat the 88 - 3 out of 4 times using this strat. But be warned, strat doesn't work if you are drunk, stoned, or playing with the Whiz kid.

[RikiRude]

I can only assume this comment is directed towards the people in the thread suggesting nerfs and not me?

-Wind

yeah, just the other was directed to go along with what you were saying about the fear the 88 puts out.

[TheWindCriesMary]

The one and only time it has not worked was in my game with the resident whiz kid.
What I did not see until it was too late was:
1.) the enemy had built trenches around 88 and had them full of flamers.
2.) while I was waiting for the timer, whiz kid made a push and pushed all the enemy units back to the flak while at the same time the enemy had just pulled on a new call in of infantry. The map was Chateau and the 88 was set up by the house nearest the SW spawn.

LOL

I love the world this guy lives in!

the 88 is like any other fear, to over come it you must understand it, and use it. 88s barely phase me because ive always used them as a defensive player, i know their strengths and weakness, before you ask for an 88 nerf, play with them for a while.

Yeah Riki I definitely agree with you. It's all about fear with the 88. You have players who can't process that the 88 isn't something they need to all out attack immediately without communication or team work. I think the biggest hurdle is getting them enough experience to realize "hey wait a second, the game isn't going to end in the next 2 minutes so I don't need to blow 1000 MP attacking it immediately without telling anyone. I can stop, take a moment and co-ordinate a major strike with combined arms or move somewhere else and force the enemy to play on our terms."

Once you can get them to see reason  (and of course it's not always easy because you're going to get hotheaded, very emotional teammates from time to time) you can get them slow down, and think about the actual strategy that can win the game for your team... then the game is really your oyster.

For those who believe the 88 needs a nerf, I think what needs to happen instead is the creation of some kind of anti-flak tutorial. If I get a moment I'll see what I can throw together... It would definitely help to have a few less people going ape-shit bananas the second they see an 88 set up hehe.

-Wind

[RikiRude]

also i dont think people realize, 88s are not very cheap, 2x 88s = a panther + gren squad pretty much on top of being immobile 8 pop.

[tank130]

One 88 is not really a problem unless it is a small map and it pretty much covers everything. But that is pretty rare.

Things get a whole lot hairier when the second one goes up. With both covering each other, you have a big issue on your hand. Not UN-defeatable, but it's going to cause you some serious grief.

Some people here suggest taking all of your army, and your teammates army to the other side of the map to "bring the battle to you" or "on your terms". This can work in many cases. But if doing so is going to leave the big open field in front of the 88 wide open for the enemy to build another, then you are making a big mistake.

Keeping pressure on your opponent and stopping them from advancing into the open field would be the smart play. It is the only position on the map that would be beneficial to another 88. Of course, this is a map dependent situation. Once again confirming that theory crafting can only take you so far in a game of complete randomness.

On the other hand, eliminating a threat early, and stopping any advancement would also be a logical solution.

[Demon767]

88s are to easy defeated tbh.

[NightRain]

88s are to easy defeated tbh.

+1

Every allied player has the tools necessary to defeat this. They don't need a automatic "IWIN" Button vs 88s. 1 second artillery is already that. 88s weakness is it being static and lack of LoS.

[Demon767]

I'm gonna get trolled by ignorant allied players, i just know it.

[CafeMilani]

YOURE WRONG

do i fullfill my role properly?

[Dnicee]

Do not nerf the 88... jesus are you guys crazy!?

[Demon767]

you have fulfilled your purpose splendidly.

[Hicks58]

Still holding to the point that the only real issue with 88's is the fact they can go multi-role with Artillery.

Otherwise, they are a counterable unit just like any other if you bring the right tools.

[WildZontar]

Who wants the 88 nerfed? Seems like no one wants it changed except for those who want its artillery role gone.

[Tymathee]

the arty is fine imo. its only what, 3-4 shells and has 105 cooldown. also, while its firing its highly suseptible to anything, i mean ANYTHING assaulting it, including tanks.

ii've run in 2 95's on an arty firing 88 and destroyed it.

[Hicks58]

The arty is 3 shots with 88 grade damage and pretty good accuracy, which means you can wtf-pwn infantry and support teams that dare to stand still for a moment.