Wher tanks are NOT specialized (panther)

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[nikomas]

So lemme get this straight, the panther is worth it and is a TD, yet now has trouble fighting off the new m18 and also fireflies? And it costs 130 fuel more? Awesome TD ability lolwhut?

[SnoOp]

So lemme get this straight, the panther is worth it and is a TD, yet now has trouble fighting off the new m18 and also fireflies? And it costs 130 fuel more? Awesome TD ability lolwhut?

[DarkSoldierX]

So lemme get this straight, the panther is worth it and is a TD, yet now has trouble fighting off the new m18 and also fireflies? And it costs 130 fuel more? Awesome TD ability lolwhut?

Except it fights off pretty much every other tank, and only has problems with the firefly when the CW player is outsmarting him, and only gets beat by the M18s because they are now a bit OP.


Nikomas, dont become nubnub #2

[Vermillion_Hawk]

So lemme get this straight, the panther is worth it and is a TD, yet now has trouble fighting off the new m18 and also fireflies? And it costs 130 fuel more? Awesome TD ability lolwhut?

The Panther was more than worth it before - it was the obvious choice, all other armor units for the Axis, excpeting the doctrinal units, were nothing compared to it. It was an incredibly useful unit in the EiRR environment, it excelled in a game of attrition, as opposed to the Allied tanks, which are inherently "disposable", as per the original Company of Heroes' play style. As I also said earlier, the lack of a "tech up" system in-game in EiRR made the Panther a little too powerful, in spite of various Allied countermeasures. This balance change is not to make the Panther worthless, but to make diversified Axis armor viable. The Panther simply had to be brought in line.

This is not to say that perhaps the changes as of now are perfect - I'm certain that as the development cycle wears on these changes will be revised and edited, but as of now the Panther is being normalized for EiRR's unique environment, and I think this is the right decision.

[GORKHALI]

kinda hate to see u guys turned this game upside down inorder to balance things and now ally r winning games easily then before,...

[Vermillion_Hawk]

It's just a matter of adapting strategies - one can no longer rely on the Panther for everything anymore, and this is good.

[Shabtajus]

So lemme get this straight, the panther is worth it and is a TD, yet now has trouble fighting off the new m18 and also fireflies? And it costs 130 fuel more? Awesome TD ability lolwhut?

all was needed just reduced acc panther has vs inf and atgs crew but not to build super AT destroyer

[Hicks58]

The Panther is still more than capable of taking on both Fireflies and M18's in the right hands.

Fireflies are admittedly difficult when used in competent hands, but it is still possible. The key is closing the distance enough to fuck his reload, or simply letting something else take the fight.

As for the M18... It has a 67% chance to penetrate you at it's max range of 45. You have a 100% chance to penetrate it at a range of 47.5. Speedy the M18 might be, but it has to be in your range to fire it's round, and WILL take a round back unless there is micro failure on the Panther user's part.

Couple that with 500 health (M18) vs 742 health (Panther) as well as 140.625 damage (M18, does 112.5 damage but has a 1.25 damage mod against PIV armour and above) vs 137.5 (Panther) and the only way you should be losing a Panther to a M18 is through total micro failure or chronic stupidity.

That's 4 rounds to kill the M18 and 6 rounds to kill the Panther btw.

[CrazyWR]

panther is now a very good unit if used properly, as opposed to a very good unit even if used retardedly.  Thats called balanced.

[hans]

wow, after a while i could convince myself to start reading this topic from the first page on.

Well, panther is no pure AT and should not be in that role alone for its current price. That the hellcat needs 4 and panther 6 shots to kill each other is with the current price legit although if u dont get in range panther sill has good advantage.

I think to get back to nikos first post, we see a clear difference between british and wehr tanks. British tanks as already mentioned seem to have very clear roles, while certain wehr tanks does not. Also common mentioned u dont have the stug as AT but as a inf support tank that can also deal good damage against sherman. It still has not the fully AT capabilities to deal with real TDs as m10 or m18. P4 has mostly an AI role and still can deal good amount of damage against any medium or easy vehicle. Cromwell as AI only tank cant. And yeah the panther in the end. Also no pure AT TD simply because of pricing. Such a big investement cant be as useless against inf as a lower priced object like the firefly.

In the end, i think personally, that panthers are well balanced as they are right now + the accuracy nerf was also in the line of the proper balance.

Giving them pure AT only capabilities just cause and have to cause price decrease and the lose of a very special and interesting unit.

In the end u have to actually look very close and different on certain factions and units in EiRR. Not every unit can be compared to counterparts very clearly and many units have different special roles. Just to put every unit in certain schemata doesnt work.

[Hicks58]

Come to think of it, if we take penetration averages into account and assume 3 bounces occur (67% penetration, 6 penetrating hits required) then you'll on average need 9 rounds that hit the target to destroy the Panther.

[hans]

Come to think of it, if we take penetration averages into account and assume 3 bounces occur (67% penetration, 6 penetrating hits required) then you'll on average need 9 rounds that hit the target to destroy the Panther.

while u still need 4 to kill the m18, right?