Thoughts on balance?

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[jackmccrack]

StuH spam is unbalanced, because last patch made them too accurate.

[pqumsieh]

They are being addressed.

[chefarzt]

Dunno its a doctrinal unit, buffed by doctrine. It should hit hard. Maybe just make it a bit more expensive.

[Tachibana]

General question. What was so wrong with the StuH before that led to it requiring a 25% accuracy buff in the first place?

[tank130]

General question. What was so wrong with the StuH before that led to it requiring a 25% accuracy buff in the first place?

If you want to discuss the StuH specifically, please start another thread.

[aeroblade56]

Puma spam vs the brits. a nightmare Piats cant hit button doesnt work well on pumas 17lbr is to slow to react.

[NightRain]

Puma spam vs the brits. a nightmare Piats cant hit button doesnt work well on pumas 17lbr is to slow to react.

17Pdr isn't good vs Light vehicles nor is it meant to be used versus Light vehicles in the first place. That's what the 6 Pounder and AT Rifles are for. If I recall correctly 17Pdrs accuracy was lowered versus any light vehicle in the past when it was introduced as a mobile support weapon.

After Leo's post modified more.


Buff 17Pdr by giving it that lovely extra 5 range or Larger arc of Fire. If I recall its reload is longer however it will penetrate almost every single shot...but needs extra damage. exactly like the Pak40!

[LeoPhone]

17pdr is actually shit vs almost everything.

it hardly outDPSes a 6pdr vs a KT.

[aeroblade56]

17pdr is actually shit vs almost everything.

it hardly outDPSes a 6pdr vs a KT.

I thought it has same damage only you have a massive chance of penetration.

So is the pak 40 superior?

[pqumsieh]

Pak 40 is far superior.

[aeroblade56]

Why is it far superior? Allies dont even have super heavies. And to boot its already in a doctrine that has a big ass 80 gun(flak)

[Hicks58]

I thought it has same damage only you have a massive chance of penetration.

So is the pak 40 superior?

17 Pounder has higher pen, same damage, slower RoF.

The Pak 40 compared to the Pak 38 has higher pen, massive damage and slower RoF.

Tbh, the Pak 38 can do most of the jobs you need... The Pak 40 is really there as a big FU button against Pershings or Croc spam. Using Pak 40's against standard armour would be considered overkill, but it would most certainly do the job.

[3rdCondor]

The only argument that could support the pak 40 being superior would be taking into account that the axis is using it to attack generally weaker tanks for the most part. Allies have to worry about jags, tigers, king tigers, and panthers. Jumbos and pershings are the only problem tanks I can think of from an axis player's perspective. Maybe a churchill croc.

[brn4meplz]

There is a pretty big damage discrepancy between the 17 and the Pak 40. You can equalize them by using the APDS rounds for a temporary boost. Then again the 17 is a Tier 1 unlock and the 40 is a Tier 3 currently.

Once the 17 gets vet the APDS rounds can nearly 2 shot a Panther and thats always satisfying.

[aeroblade56]

40 has 187 damage, 17 has 150 (187.5 with AP)
40 has (1.5, 1.75, 2.0) penertration at LMS, 17 has (0.85, 0.9, 1.25) x5 with AP
40 has (0.85, 0.9, 1.0) accuracy, same for 17
40 has fire arc 80, 17 has 60
40 has 75 turn speed, 17 has 60
40 has 3.0 moving speed, 17 has 2.5

However, this does not take into account the target table where the 17 has a bunch of bounuses added to it (the 40 does not have such bonusses). Also the 17 gets AP rounds.

But the pak40 gets a officer bonus on damage. SO id say the pak is far superior in everyway.

[Tymathee]

Pak 40 is far superior.

Agreed. similar pen, higher damage, larger cone of fire, faster turn radius, moves faster and has the ability to be buffed via officer and better possible defense.

Then again it's a tier 3 and the 17pdr is a t1.

[NightRain]

But the pak40 gets a officer bonus on damage. SO id say the pak is far superior in everyway.

That is optional, not every PAK40 is supervised by an officer.

[Smokaz]

 

[Malgoroth]

Very few units are unbalanced as they are. I don't really think the stuh is even OP. If you could only have 4 in your company then they're easily manageable. But you can have 7. That's where the problems come from.

I have 19 elite armor grens in my company, 12 of which have shrecks. All of them have medkits and half have nades for a whopping 4 pool. Then I have 7 double repair stuhs, a handful of recrew volks and a handful of motorcycles. I can do all that because the pool system isn't working like it should and there's an obscene amount of resources with the warmap.

If you want to balance the mod as it is currently then start with little pool/resource tweaks. For instance... don't eliminate ranger lmgs... just make them have a pool cost like they do on AB squads. 5 pool for a double lmg ranger squad is stupid.

Almost anything that is spammed is OP. Fix the spam and you fix the problem. For some units hardcaps may be the way to go.

[pqumsieh]

good notes mal