Churchill MK6

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[aeroblade56]

I have tried using this tank and i just cant actually think of a reason to bring this thing for many reason.

1. its to slow infantry flee the tank a damaged engine crom is faster, and thus it takes alot of extra pak shots.

2. This tank gets rocked really hard against p4s, and p4s being so cheap are just killers of these things had a vet 3  get murdered today, i believe it has around 80% to penetrate the churchill? with heatrounds. While the 75mm gun does fuck all to the p4 even at vet 3.

Shit tank is shit you have to use tank shock to make all units actually die since u cant catch up to them.

17lbr is also to slow as well to properly support vs the heavier tanks, its a unrealistic weapon currently since its slower then a spotted jackal.

Discuss.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHf0AvpQblI&feature=youtube_gdata

Also i hate storms.

[tank130]

If it is such a shitty tank, how did you get it to vet 3?

[ALLiDOisWIN]

Its called bringing it on and being careful. how else to you get vet 3 shit? i can get a vet 5 jeep...

[Tymathee]

thats my question, he got it to vet 3 by it killing stuff, he must've lost a vet 3 churchill.

every tank has it strenths and weaknessess.

the mk6 is slow, has a sherman 75mm gun, so it sux at penetrating armor and no hmg

however, it has real tough armor and costs the same as a sherman, maybe less so whats the probleM?

[CrazyWR]

its not there to avoid damage, its there to soak damage while the rest of your shit kills everything.  Oh, and the gun doesn't suck either.  Last time I saw you use one it had 35 kills...

[aeroblade56]

Why am i the only one with churchills mk6 this says something. i even asked rifle what he thought he said" what the shit churchill or the croc?"

THE GUN misses 2-5 shots which is aggrevating. when trying to kill the last guy on a MG team and he doesnt die and supresses your entire army as a mortar drives a stake into your heart.

Without ablative it is not near effective.

[pqumsieh]

All of your evidence is anecdotal. In fact, the stats really say otherwise. The Mk6 should actually fair pretty well versus the Panzer 4. I have faced a P4 many times with this tank and have wrecked it pretty hard. The gun is a duplicate of the Sherman 75mm, so it misses no more or no less than the M4.

Nothing needs to be done to it at this time.

[aeroblade56]

i had someone look up the corsix for me. it is essentialy a carbon copy of the sherman but as far as i was told the P4 has a nice 0.85 modifier or something against churchill.

Here is what i ask then.

Name the reason that you would take a churchill over a cromwell, or a croc. You have overlapping roles on 3 different tanks. Just like the m10 and m18s had similiar roles and people wanted a change. so does the churchillmk6 and the churchill croc.

Currently there is no reason to take a churchill and AVRE over a Croc.

Everything they can do the croc can do better. Brits is all about the combined arms with the piats and button and stuart and staghound recieving very different roles now.

Without ablative plaiting they are very slow. I can get 20 kills average on a cromwell and even the p4 kill if its from a less competent player. With flank speed i can easily flank ATGs without taking  a shot and just kite it.

[jackmccrack]

Should have stood and fought those Stormies while facing front armor. You could have one-shot them.

[aeroblade56]

Should have stood and fought those Stormies while facing front armor. You could have one-shot them.

I Did. i splashed damaged them. but there was a p4 and i went boxing with it and thats how i ended up

[pqumsieh]

The Mk6 has significantly better AT than the Croc for one, it cost less, is lower pool, and has relatively similar durability.

[Hicks58]

MK VI has 700 HP. That's 64 more than a Sherman.

Croc has 900 HP. That's 90 less than a Pershing.

For the MK VI, the 6th round from a pak can do enough damage to put it into red health and crit it. For the Croc, it will take the 8th round to kill it.

That's two extra Pak rounds worth of durability. There's also 3 PIV rounds worth, 2 Panther rounds worth (5th round can crit the MK VI, 7 solid rounds are required for the Croc), 2 extra PanzerShrecks, the list goes on...

Long story short, the durability difference is quite noticable.

The 6 Pounder of the Croc has 0.4 penetration against the PIV whilst the 75mm of the MK VI has 0.58 penetration. Anything bigger than that and either weapon will struggle to a very large degree to the point it's barely worth mentioning the differences. There are two disparities between the weapons for weaker units than the PIV however. First, the 6 Pounder of the Croc does 1.5 damage against Marders whilst the 75mm does 1.0 (Both weapons do 87.5 damage). Secondly, the 6 Pounder has 0.67 penetration against Ostwind armour with the 75mm having 0.97.

The lower cost and pool I cannot argue with, the claim that it has significantly better AT and is similar in durability?...

Well, unless your explicitly Ostwind hunting, I'd rather have a Croc for AT considering how much better AI is paired with it. You even get to put the hurt on Marders too.

If the MK VI had a Sherman 76mm, I'd see the appeal of it. As it stands... It's nothing more than a stop gap until you unlock Crocs.

[aeroblade56]

Thank you Hicks for clearing that up for us.

[AmPM]

I would like to see it go up a tier in HP, possibly 800 total.

[aeroblade56]

its 64 more then a sherman. that doesnt seem a whole lot.

[pqumsieh]

They have the same armor, hence relatively similar durability. Really what I'm getting at with the durability remark is they have the same armor type and hence the only difference is the 200+ HP of the croc; lets not get too complicated here.  The 75mm performs better than the 6 pounder in almost all instances; it also has a slightly faster rate of fire.

It really just boils down to cost and availability. The Mk6 is available before the croc, cost less, and can perform a good mixture of AI/AT. With the new RE company, the Mk6 will really shine.

[Hicks58]

The very definition of durability is how much punishment something can take.

The Croc is capable of taking significantly more punishment.

M10's and M18's have the same armour, yet the M18 has 500 HP over the M10's 400 HP. That's an extra pak round, an extra shreck, an extra PIV round...

It's a significant difference. It allows the unit in question to have a greater field presence.

The 75mm does in fact perform better than the 6 pounder in almost all instances, this cannot be denied. However, the difference against appropriate targets is that small that it's not worth sacrificing the flame-thrower of the Croc and the extra durability to gain those advantages. 0.58 Penetration against a PIV is great... But a little math and 0.4 Penetration combined with 200 more health means you'll end up being more or less just as efficient - Except you have a rather bitching flame-thrower to boot. Yes, the 75mm AI capability is sound. The previously mentioned bitching flame-thrower is better though, and you'll keep the 6 Pounder to perform the 75mm's AT role.

I'm fairly certain no other unlock unit is made redundant by a higher tier one. Not one.

Oh, and on a lighter note, you're asking the statistically driven guy not to get too complicated. lol.

[aeroblade56]

So hicks Tell us what would you do to bring the Mk6 to light what would you do to make it appealing.

I have field tested this thing extensively I still prefer a double repair Cromwell over it. Even tank shock is derp it takes forever to supress a volksquad and or feels like.

[TheVolskinator]

Give it Croc HP and 42.5 range. Churchills were found to be excellent gun platforms because of their squat frame and extreme stability, and could fire against targets at slightly longer ranges then British cruiser tanks. No, not 45 range. 42.5 so it can get a first shell advantage (assuming it has a spotter and LoS).

[Hicks58]

So hicks Tell us what would you do to bring the Mk6 to light what would you do to make it appealing.

I have field tested this thing extensively I still prefer a double repair Cromwell over it. Even tank shock is derp it takes forever to supress a volksquad and or feels like.

What would I do?

Personally, I would do as I stated in my initial post. Hand the MK VI the 76mm Sherman gun. This way, it is capable of competently engaging PIV's, StuG's, Hetzer's, and anything below. It also retains the AI capability of said Sherman gun but without a suitable .50cal to assist it meaning the Croc is still leagues ahead in AI performance.

With 700 HP and a 76mm Sherman gun, you won't be taking on Panthers (Too low damage and penetration in comparison to the Panther's gun) but you will make any medium armour or assault platforms piss off. For the price tag of 260 FU (The same as an upgunned Sherman) which it has, it'd be fairly appropriate. This would lead to two distinct variants of Churchill with distinct roles.

If you want mid power AT and staying power for an affordable price, go for the MK VI. If you want high level AI and staying power for a higher price, go for the Croc.