Julian Assange

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[AmPM]

Has there ever even been a case where a leak like this has gotten a serviceman assassinated by an insurgent? To be honest, I don't think they even care who they kill - they're just trying to kill as many of you guys as they can. The leak of a secret document probably wouldn't change anything to the Taliban or Al Quaeda. It's not like it was a secret to them, they were the targets.

Yes, troop movements, material movements, etc can tell you the routes planned etc.

This leads to more dangerous routes, better prepared insurgents, and more deaths and injuries all around.

If the enemy does not know what you are doing you can pull it off without them hitting you. If they know about it then you are fucked.

Sort of like map hacking in EIR, only with real lives.

[nikomas]

Would post link to that vid of apaches gunning down "Insurgents" that was leaked two years or so ago, but I bet it's been seen already.

Not for the faintest of heart... Actually, here it is!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rXPrfnU3G0

And this is why Wikileaks is a good thing, fuckin' trigger happy fools...

[Vermillion_Hawk]

Yes, troop movements, material movements, etc can tell you the routes planned etc.

This leads to more dangerous routes, better prepared insurgents, and more deaths and injuries all around.

If the enemy does not know what you are doing you can pull it off without them hitting you. If they know about it then you are fucked.

Sort of like map hacking in EIR, only with real lives.

But has there been a recorded case of it? An insurgency likely knows about troops movements and supply trains anyways, there's a reason why occupying under an insurgency is so difficult, because the enemy is literally everywhere.

[nikomas]

And sure, accidents do happen, but before you tell me off, I want to add... "Come on, LET ME SHOOT" and "Got the bastards", "Come on, all you need to do is pick up a weapon!" yay for self control huh?

Mistakes happen, but if the military cant owe up to them, we need others to do it for them.

[brn4meplz]

Has there ever even been a case where a leak like this has gotten a serviceman assassinated by an insurgent? To be honest, I don't think they even care who they kill - they're just trying to kill as many of you guys as they can. The leak of a secret document probably wouldn't change anything to the Taliban or Al Quaeda. It's not like it was a secret to them, they were the targets.

There are friendly locals all over the world who just want a better life for their families.

Sometimes that means helping western forces. Alot of the actionable intelligence in conflict zones is gather by HUMINT(Human Intelligence) which is boots on the ground, and talking to people who live in the area. They know better then anyone when something is different or out of place.

Despite what people think, UAV's and drones can only see so much and alot of it isn't the whole picture. Just look at the video Nikomas posted. The video had to use a zoom greater then the gunship had to show the children in the van, how is a combat gunner supposed to spot that stuff. Well, he can't and thats unfortunate.

all the HUMINT sources eventually get reported and collated into documents, thats how information is passed. and when those documents get released to the internet it's real easy for Enemy forces to then find out HOW they got bumped when preparing an ambush. Or how NATO knew there was an IED or mines on a route. Because Grandfather's been talking to us. Then he has a really shitty day.

[Vermillion_Hawk]

I'm well aware that these documents could put the lives of civilians at risk, but that doesn't answer my initial question of whether it has been documented or reported that someone implicated in said documents was killed.

It also doesn't change the fact that the documents reveal some information that is very different from the information people are supposed to believe. Drastically different.

[brn4meplz]

The most you'd ever get is

"-Name- has not reported in some time. Asset discontinued"

If even that. The information just stops, no one trusts you and no one will help you again.


We'll have to wait for Wikileaks to leak the document reporting how many people Wikileaks got killed.


Also, I didn't feel like making a new thread and this one has gone into the same sort of vein so enjoy some pictures.
http://www.globalpost.com/photo-galleries/planet-pic/5718451/life-and-death-aleppo-photos

[Sachaztan]

The most you'd ever get is

"-Name- has not reported in some time. Asset discontinued"

If even that. The information just stops, no one trusts you and no one will help you again.


We'll have to wait for Wikileaks to leak the document reporting how many people Wikileaks got killed.


Also, I didn't feel like making a new thread and this one has gone into the same sort of vein so enjoy some pictures.
http://www.globalpost.com/photo-galleries/planet-pic/5718451/life-and-death-aleppo-photos

Are they real? Kinda hard to tell, to me they look like bad special effects.

[Baine]

Because Hollywood is overdoing things so much that people forget what really is real.

[brn4meplz]

The second photo definitely gave me pause. The chair on the left side of the frame especially. In the first photo it's sitting there, in the second photo it's still there(not the big black wheely chair, the small table chair) It's obscured by smoke but you can still see the bars.


While I've never stood on the receiving end of a tank shot I've seen alot of explosives go off. This clearly isn't a sabot round, and HE rounds push the environment alot. Like the sandbag on the right side. It doesn't even flap with the force of the blast.


I'm wondering if they got a photo of the blast expanding and it just didn't expose properly(alot of light) so maybe they touched up what they had?

[PonySlaystation]

Would post link to that vid of apaches gunning down "Insurgents" that was leaked two years or so ago, but I bet it's been seen already.

1) They were in the middle of a combat zone during a firefight close to where american troops were reported to be pinned down by insurgents.
2) They were not wearing orange press vests that journalists are required to wear to prevent these kind of things.
3) They had large camera equipment that looked like weapons.

It was basically a recipe for disaster.

Then again, remember TPB? They were certainly in the grey area of swedish law, but the site itself didnt break it... Remember how that went? Also, remember how supreme court (they exist for the most difficult cases) refused to take it? Also remember how the fines and jail time was ridiculously high compared to REAL crimes?

Then ask yourself, why is it hard to have faith that everything will go fairly?

Except that Copyright Infringement is a crime under Swedish Law, the Wikileaks organization is not. The TPB case was bullshit, yes. The judge was not objective and was a member of the Swedish Copyright Association and the Swedish Association for the Protection of Industrial Property. The jail time wasn't that long. The founder got one year and the rest got a few months.

[AmPM]

The second photo definitely gave me pause. The chair on the left side of the frame especially. In the first photo it's sitting there, in the second photo it's still there(not the big black wheely chair, the small table chair) It's obscured by smoke but you can still see the bars.


While I've never stood on the receiving end of a tank shot I've seen alot of explosives go off. This clearly isn't a sabot round, and HE rounds push the environment alot. Like the sandbag on the right side. It doesn't even flap with the force of the blast.


I'm wondering if they got a photo of the blast expanding and it just didn't expose properly(alot of light) so maybe they touched up what they had?

Looks like it's expanding, the sandbags are preventing the same level of expansion near the ground. Means the blast will be hitting those guys pretty much in the face.

[nikomas]

1) They were in the middle of a combat zone during a firefight close to where american troops were reported to be pinned down by insurgents.
2) They were not wearing orange press vests that journalists are required to wear to prevent these kind of things.
3) They had large camera equipment that looked like weapons.

It was basically a recipe for disaster.

As I said earlier, accidents certainly do happen for sure, you know what the bigger problem with that one was? One is the fact that nobody is willing to owe up to it and as stated the military refused to give out information they had to what had happen, the second is that the gunners clearly just wanted any excuse they could get to shoot, if I wasn't looking properly I'd think he thought he was playing call of duty.