HVAP

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[Smokaz]

Opening a discussion on this.

I think that as T4 goes, this one is unpopular. This may be inaccurate. I rarely see them or hear about hvap being discussed. It certainly does not make your company able to rely purely on HVAP buffed units for AT. Goodthing, badthing?

Don't really know what would be done, throwing out some ideas:

- Add some HP to tank destroyers with this T4 (+100 hp for instance)
- Add some kind of bonuses for 2 and more tank destroyers working together (aura they give each other, and only each other)
- Is the general buff always being on such a good idea, was the old activated ability system better?

[NightRain]

Doesn't it nerf pershing splash?

[aeroblade56]

Doesn't it nerf pershing splash?

No some patches ago they made it so Pershing still has infantry splash with HVAP.

Problem with HVAP is it just sucks.

T3 crew efficiency:  gives 6m sight to Sherman and Pershing (not tds) and ability to fire while repairing at 80%.

Which is actually pretty weak by itself.

T2 Combat engineers: rifleman can build stuff and engineers can build 50% faster and -15% received accuracy for engineers (another doctrine unlock).

Nothing in the actual doctrine buffs tds specifically aside from some minor 25% accel after ambush(Hellcat) or 6m sight after sitting still for 5s( m10)

So with the dual T3 and t4 more geared towards the pershing no wonder why no one takes it

[ick312]

try it!

it defnitly does NOT suck.

YOU DEMAND an unlock that gives you the option to rely on tanks on anti tank duty! This is nuts. Companies with APCR/HEAT also cant rely only on tanks, they need atgs/marder & Shreks besides their Tiger/Panther.

Btw just compare the numbers to the Axis Equivalent.

Personally i am not using it, cause i <3 bot t4 even if i suck with it and would be better off with HVAP.

honestly you guys need to stop your fanboyism! The armor doc is one of the best balanced doctrines in eirr and HVAP is a good choice.

EDIT: on the AoE as far as i remember: the AoE of the Pershing was 5,3 and with HVAP 5,0

[aeroblade56]

try it!

it defnitly does NOT suck.

YOU DEMAND an unlock that gives you the option to rely on tanks on anti tank duty! This is nuts. Companies with APCR/HEAT also cant rely only on tanks, they need atgs/marder & Shreks besides their Tiger/Panther.

Btw just compare the numbers to the Axis Equivalent.

Personally i am not using it, cause i <3 bot t4 even if i suck with it and would be better off with HVAP.

honestly you guys need to stop your fanboyism! The armor doc is one of the best balanced doctrines in eirr and HVAP is a good choice.

EDIT: on the AoE as far as i remember: the AoE of the Pershing was 5,3 and with HVAP 5,0

Nice. no wonder its hard to get things balanced around here.

[shockcoil]

What's the status on doctrines? Are they getting redesigned or balanced as is?

[Smokaz]

Nobody is "demanding" anything. There's a thread and you can post your opinion.

Let's try to stack on topic: HVAP

[ick312]

yes you are right. Sorry for my aggressive undertone.

From my experience HVAP did a great Job on Pershings.

I think the argument that something is not often used is invalid. Some Choices simply offer more play fun, then others and thats why they are used. Ofc there are pure powerplayer but i think the majority is playing for fun.

[rolcsika0128]

honestly you guys need to stop your fanboyism!

fanboyism
fanboyism
fanboyism
fanboyism

lol ick, that sentence coming from you made me chuckle a bit..

on topic:
I'd rather support Smokaz on this one. HVAP is not bad, but could use an overhaul.

[Hicks58]

The problem with HVAP is that it doesn't particularly let you do much more than you could originally.

It lets the TD's be a bit more lucky from the front with a little extra damage and it completely overhauls the Pershing's penetration tables to be effectively not junk.

However, TD's usage is limited strictly to enemy tanks (You don't really see the HVAP benefits vs vehicles) and the Pershing doesn't get to engage any new targets that it could not before with the exception of the Tiger (It does get a substantial buff vs the Panther, but the Panther has always been able to simply range the crap outta the Pershing, and the Pershing would always win in close range anyhow so the status quo is kinda unchanged).

The problem is that super heavies are still going to kick 7 shades of shit out of the Pershing even if you've got HVAP, so you can't directly engage them, and trying to damage soak 165 damage weapons is pretty suicidal with 990 HP.

So basically, the TD's and Pershing play EXACTLY the same way that they did before HVAP. Yes, they've got the extra penetration and the extra bit of damage vs tanks which is statistically impressive, but they don't effectively play any differently. USK lets armour turn into pretty good damage soaks by combining it's damage reduction with vet 1, and Mobile Warfare gives you massive flexibility by letting otherwise sluggish units be very manoeuvrable.

TL;DR: HVAP is effectively a T4 that lets Pershings take on Tigers, nothing else is game changing from it and the other T4's will give you much more flexibility or focus.