Pak cloak an annoyance!...again!

[Guest]

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever

Login with username, password and session length

[AlcapwneD]

yea i know im reviving an old topic discussed back in the EiR days, but i just can't stand pak cloak, its just another cloaked A.T sniper in the game and its ability is free and very effective when used correctly or in ambushes. 57's get nothing but AP rounds which at endgame is decent but at a cost of 50mun. Since 57's get easily bum rushed by shreck squads its pointless purchasing one unless its defended but when defended its counterable with mortar/sniper/bum rushing duel shreck squads - US MG team doesnt even do much to suppress and they either get mortared in open cover.

Now the pak on the other hand, JUST HAS CLOAK PERIOD. They cannot get bum rushed by a regular rifleman squad which doesn't have bazookas. Stays hidden all the time and shielded from sniperfire which the 57 lacks.


So my Idea is, Paks when captured can be cloaked by Allies, or cloak in cover (just like hetzer). Ive played both sides good enough to know that the PAK wins in EVERYTHING since allied armor can be penetrated with ease. and the 57 just wins with AP rounds....

[RikiRude]

50% chance for AT guns to miss has not stopped pak sniping one bit. I think pak should get 2 shots, not three til it gets uncovered.

[DuckOfDoom]

Pak is a little overpowered at the moment (not HORRIBLY overpowered like some people like to believe), but I believe it should keep its cloak since it is priced higher then the allied atg. What would make the difference, is how many shots a pak fires before uncloaking, it shouldn't be 3 in my opinion. 1, and then maybe another one at vet 3 is an acceptable solution. Here is my reasoning:

1)Axis already have a dominant hand-held anti tank weapon, probably the most efficient anti tank weapon in the game (panzershrek) which is also shockingly accurate against infantry (for an at weapon).

2)Axis have superior tanks, meaning that their tanks are capable at platforms on their own.

3)All other cloaking units in the game only get 1 shot off before uncloaking - Hetzer, Piats (while ambushing), Snipers, Storm Troopers (ie. trowing a grenade), so why should the Pak get extra shots?

Another good idea would be to allow the allied atgs to hold fire, and to improve the number of ap shell shots an allied at gun gets (1 use is a bit silly).

However, I want to point out that with tomorrows advent of off-map artillery, paks wont be as nasty as they are now.

[Tymathee]

tomorrows? we're gettin off maps tomorrow?

[DeadlyShoe]

3)All other cloaking units in the game only get 1 shot off before uncloaking - Hetzer, Piats (while ambushing), Snipers, Storm Troopers (ie. trowing a grenade), so why should the Pak get extra shots?

The Pak gets extra shots because its performance was subpar in vanilla, compared to 57mms hitting AP when they saw an enemy.

[Smokaz]

Pak was never subpar in vanilla, in fact its still the crucial support unit for wehr T4 against an american with lots of at guns and all T2 builds included a pak. It warded off the M8 and provided support for the shreks which alot of T2 terror players would get 1 of on every gren squad. T3 was partly considered weak as you had no pak. T1-T4 was considered tough to pull out with only storms as at, because of the pak missing.

[DeadlyShoe]

so why was it buffed then 

[rai0]

Another good idea would be to allow the allied atgs to hold fire, and to improve the number of ap shell shots an allied at gun gets (1 use is a bit silly).

 if i underst. correctly:    50mun. 4 one AP round charge ?
   ur maniak DEVs 

r

[stumpster]

Another good idea would be to allow the allied atgs to hold fire, and to improve the number of ap shell shots an allied at gun gets (1 use is a bit silly).

 if i underst. correctly:    50mun. 4 one AP round charge ?
   ur maniak DEVs 

r

Which, as I've said before, was an unintended change.  It was supposed to be ported directly from EIR, but somewhere along the line we lost the second use.

[DasNoob]

          

[TheDeadlyShoe]

Ahh, that explains it.

[EscforrealityTLS]

Reather than nerfing the shit out of PAK guns I propose a suggestion:

On the premiss that PAK guns pay for "Cloak" through their initial price why not add 20 munitions to the 57mm ATG initial cost and give all of them "Armour Pricing rounds" on a cool down. So when the ATG is re-crewed by an American player the ability remains. But the initial cost and a balanced cool down for the ability will be needed.

Look at it this way, Wehr re-crew a PAK they get its ability back, American re-crew a 57mm they don't. Not exactly fair.

So in short: Change "Armour Pricing rounds" to a cool down ability that all American ATGs can get and pay for it with the cost of the gun.

[Mysthalin_Axis]

I personaly believe that a lot of the annoyance from paks comes not from only the fact it can cloak... it also has extreme sight ranges. You heard me right - the sight range. It's second only to jeeps and motorcycles. If the pak cloak was changed to such, that it would reduce the sight range on the pak, a lot of the problems of the pak would just go away. It would not be a very direct nerf to it, especially not to people that support their paks - they wouldn't notice any change, but it would fix pak sniping of emplacements, it would fix tanks getting sniped by something not even within the LOS, and paks could actually be FLANKABLE! Right now, even if you manage to get a flank on a cloaked pak, it will see your tank first - no matter you knowing where it is, the pak will turn and get shots off. Even if you just headlong charge - the pak sees you before you can even imagine to see it, and that's where a big part of the problem with paks comes from.

So, please make paks have their current LOS only when uncloaked, and give them less-than-normal, or even less-than-standard-infantry sight range once the pak is cloaked.

[Mgallun74]

meh, remove all cloaking, this is a ww2 game, no Star Trek with Klingon Birds of prey flying around.

[EscforrealityTLS]

I never noticed that line of sight thing before, that does however sound like a reasonable solution though. Good call.

[Mgallun74]

Or you could just give me Cloak on my 57mm and Rangers.. k thanks.

[rai0]

nice Mysthalin !
 princip of snipin IS range.



  the best solution 4 DEVs ??

 r

[Dragon2008]

It's an ambush AT.Thats the whole point of a pak is to ambush tanks thats why it cloakes. i could say the same for PAIT ambush but I don't cos thats what its ment to do and used for.

Why nerf LOS jus cos its cloaked???
(german gunners see they r cloaked and decide to put an eye patch over on of there eyes so give allies a chance ).  HELL NO!!!

[rai0]

snipin is ambush Dragon?

[PPLA]

Pak's are slightly over powered. I personally believe that they should be lowered in price but they should only get one shot before they uncloaked.