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[Lemures]

http://www.filefront.com/14079535/Boobaka%20mrneb%20newguygame.rar

The guy had been waiting a long time (hours) for his first game since none of the 10+ axis idling would play him or take him through a game.

Eventually I got Boobaka and Mrneb to jump in with me as his partner so thanks to them. However these are two near fully vetted people and the guy hadn't known about his training points but did very well, imo.

Unfortunately he left with a very BAD impression of EiR due to the discrepancy of Vet units and the inability to effectively kill them.

Though we did manage to get a few...some were ran over by their own tank, my personal High moment.

I think the community as a whole needs to take a look at itself, since we're supposed to be welcoming NEW players. Not bullying or ignoring them. I expected to lose but the guy seemed to feel totally outmatched.

[EIRRMod]

Also, coming in to a new game, in a war thats extended past its usual 'End date' - would compound this.

There are 1v1s for this specific reason, and we are making Mentor accounts to alleviate the situation.

The *main* problem is that most of these people do not contact a Dev or a Mod for assistance.  We'll try to make this information more available.

[Lemures]

The guy was pretty well informed, had his Battalion made up and had been asking in the Launcher for a LONG time.

I had also asked the axis players present to 1v1 him and none would, they all just went about making their own games and ignored him, which is what pissed me off. Although it's obviously best to have vent it should not be a necessity for a single game to be played, especially if they are not going to be on your team.

[EIRRMod]

Indeed, a bit sad to hear about.

The game isnt for the light hearted

[KommandoWolf]

That seems to be the way for quite some time here... would be good to have more mentors.

[Akranadas]

Having mentors doesn't stop the problem of new players being stomped. Then it begs the question, if the mentors sole purpose is to help the new players level up their companies, what is the point in the mentor program? Teaching people how to play can only go so far before your simply playing to game the systems.

[boobaka]

i didn't want to play that game, i was in another game waiting too. but if he says he waiting that long so i jump in. didn't know grenny was going to. but what can i do?

[EIRRMod]

Having mentors doesn't stop the problem of new players being stomped. Then it begs the question, if the mentors sole purpose is to help the new players level up their companies, what is the point in the mentor program? Teaching people how to play can only go so far before your simply playing to game the systems.

Then you are missing the spiritual reason for having mentors in the first place.

Teaching them the system, getting them used to it, and having certain parts (that they may miss) explained.

Some people play games for fun, some to 'play the system' as you mentioned Ak, and considering I saw you run a 3x CCT company before we changed it, are you in the latter group?

[gamesguy2]

Are 1v1s still bugged or have that been fixed already?

That maybe have been the reason no one wanted to 1v1 him.

[EIRRMod]

Are 1v1s still bugged or have that been fixed already?

That maybe have been the reason no one wanted to 1v1 him.

I wont know till someone plays

I'll do some in depth testing of 1v1s later.

[EIRRMod]

After thinking a bit more about this post, it comes down to this:

EIR is, and always has been a competetive game.

Unless I hand out stickers for everyone who played saying 'IM A WINNER!' whether they win or lose, theres not a lot that can be done.

People who have played longer, will always have vet, unlocked units and other bonuses for the time theyve invested, thats the POINT of having a persistant environment - this is broken atm, as this current war has run twice as long as intended, so, the newer player will have better odds of a more 'fun' game earlier on.

There are some small bonuses for players who are just starting, but bottom line is, unless they start at the start, they will take a while finding lower players to play.
Why penalise the players who DO play the mod - to appease the ones who play once or twice?  No.

Edit:
Just as a side note, I am trying to make different aspects of the mod more friendly / easier on Newer players - just Im making people aware that long time players will have an edge, as theyve earned it.

[NCOIC]

Hmmm

Ok I gotta weigh in on this. As a newbie I was generally treated well. I am still a noob qualitatively while I've been playing a bit now. Just check my score   What I think may need some addressing is more a nudge than a hard shove. Competition is nice but eventually you'll have no one to compete against if people play one game and leave. The EIRR mod is a cool thing for people tired of Vcoh or just like me want something more accurate in their WW2 game. So when ya get all fired up on discovering this great mod and really wanna play but get kinda burned/spurned then you will only want to play one game and foxtrot uniform charlie kilo the buggers who aren't willing to put in some time to help someone and ya quit

I am playing this game more because I am a confirmed masochist than anything else but I really do see the potential of EIRR to really make CoH worth playing. But you need fresh players though to keep things happening. Old ones drop out fer many reasons so you need new ones to take up the slack. Life, school, kids, jobs yadda yadda yadda just being a few reasons. So there may be enough players now but eventually yer gonna need more and nurturing newer players is best for ALL in the long run. In my case I do get frustrated sometimes by my lack of knowledge of the peculiarities specific to EIRR. There are all kinds of little oddities on how EIRR models things that if yer not aware of and no one tells you about might discourage people and have them stop playing. But I have been given some help and am slooowly discovering some of the tricks to this mod.

So it is somewhat disheartening to hear that new players get discouraged and end up leaving because of a perceived lack of interest in playing or teaching newbies. So mebbe that's where people might wanna improve things. Lend a hand, play a game or two even explaining how yer kicking their asssses in a nice way instead of being dismissive or boastful. BTW most players here have been ok but some have been snotty and frankly unlike some here I have actually commanded a squad of straight leg/light infantry, (11B/11C SGT E5 10th MTN NYARNG '86-'96) driven a tank, been a gunner on a tank, (NTC VISMOD M551 Sheridan light tank) carried and fired an M60 machine gun as well as the M249SAW, M16A1, M16A2, M29 80mm mortar, M203, Frag grenade, fired LAWS rockets, air assaulted in Hueys, Blackhawks and been OPFOR at the NTC three times the last during the first desert storm, I don't need to hear some schmoo talk sierra hotel india tango at me.

So I think where possible peeps might try and be more accessible to new players...they are the future!

Ok nuff fer now

[Akranadas]

Having mentors doesn't stop the problem of new players being stomped. Then it begs the question, if the mentors sole purpose is to help the new players level up their companies, what is the point in the mentor program? Teaching people how to play can only go so far before your simply playing to game the systems.

Then you are missing the spiritual reason for having mentors in the first place.

Teaching them the system, getting them used to it, and having certain parts (that they may miss) explained.

I understand the reasoning behind it; teach a new player the ropes on the finder points of Europe in Ruins and what is different between Company of Heroes to Europe in Ruins.

The problem as I see it is, end game companies at a such a high advantage to beginning companies that the newbies are utterly thrashed in game and as such will become disheartened as they most likely do not know that the wars end and reboot. This then result in a higher than normal turn over of newer players coming and going. There isn't a problem with people not wanting to help players; but people thrashing newer players to such a level that they don't get enjoyment out of the game; enjoyment is what hooks players into games. No one enjoys watching everything you do fail, even when it works in the standard coh game.

It really won't matter how long the war goes for; because it will continue to happen when players decided to join in mid way or to the end of a war. I think we need to readdress some issues with new players vs seasoned players.

Some people play games for fun, some to 'play the system' as you mentioned Ak, and considering I saw you run a 3x CCT company before we changed it, are you in the latter group?

I wasn't playing the system with my 3x CCT company; I was having fun. If I was playing the system I would have used it far more than the 3 games that I played with it. It was an experiment.

[spinn72]

its hard for new guys to really get into EIR, because the player skill level is generally very high.  Really all you can do is get them to team up with experienced players and play against a reasonable opponent on a simple map.  I remember my first game was on Convent and it was all over the place lol (especially when it has 100 support weapons unmanned)

I think people should just ask a player if they are new and give them a chance while playing, extend some sympathy so you can gain more vet off him in the long run.  The worst thing to do is bring out your sniper and set up your doomfort and rack up 30 kills with the sniper, just retreat units that have 20+ kills and give them a fair go.

[EIRRMod]

Ok I gotta weigh in on this. As a newbie I was generally treated well. I am still a noob qualitatively while I've been playing a bit now. Just check my score   What I think may need some addressing is more a nudge than a hard shove.

<SNIP>

So I think where possible peeps might try and be more accessible to new players...they are the future!

Ok nuff fer now

Thats exactly it NCOIC!

The number of players now, compared to when we began is quite high, but the retention of players is comparitively high.

When the WarMap comes in, there will be major benefits to working with New players (Thats the PLAN anyway)

[Nevyen]

I haz the secret shiflin planz in hand!!!!!!

[Smokaz]

Uh I thought getting stomped by high vet companies by better player was the official EIRR baptizing? My first game of EIR was against Schultz/Draken defending on RTC.. and look at me here today. I wouldn't have done it any differently. Bide your time and take merciless revenge once you gots nicer toyses then they have.

[EIRRMod]

Uh I thought getting stomped by high vet companies by better player was the official EIRR baptizing? My first game of EIR was against Schultz/Draken defending on RTC.. and look at me here today. I wouldn't have done it any differently. Bide your time and take merciless revenge once you gots nicer toyses then they have.

Yes, but trial by fire tends to leave a lot of charred corpses rather than veteran stayers ;p

[Tymathee]

Uh I thought getting stomped by high vet companies by better player was the official EIRR baptizing? My first game of EIR was against Schultz/Draken defending on RTC.. and look at me here today. I wouldn't have done it any differently. Bide your time and take merciless revenge once you gots nicer toyses then they have.

Yes, but trial by fire tends to leave a lot of charred corpses rather than veteran stayers ;p

I'd have to agree in some ways, but at the same time, those who have the fortitude to stay will stay and those who don't will leave anyway. We just have to try and be gracious I guess. Whenever I play new guys I try and take an account I dont normally play, like I have reserved my brit account for playing new people cuz i suck with brits so it wont be a total boome

[Smokaz]

Getting boned by dishonest ambush leaves a hole in your heart only revenge can fill.

Take notes, mentees. I believe this can be sorted under "motivation". Exam can be any day now, when that level 1 account with all lowercase characters and numbers at the end of the name joins your game in utmost silence.

Also, there's the observation that you either play casually and not very often, or you are a diehard eirr fan it seems. The latter have more fun, and become part of the gang, crying foul at stack, lol at vet dying and bloody murder in the balance forum. We got such a great thing going on here, and new players that stay in the trenches realize this fast and become wolves among wolves all the quicker, their teeth growing long and their stomach getting hungry for the juicy flesh of their previous captors.