[WM] Reasons to take an Ostwind?

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[LeoPhone]

Ostwind: 400mp 175 fuel 10 pop

Puma 20mm: 280mp 40 fuel 6 pop


i have checked the stats of these two units, and the result is that ostwind SUCKS.

ostwind accuracy vs inf:
short:  0.675
medium: 0.5625
long: 0.2625 (will only be firing from this range if it wants to live)

puma 20mm accuracy vs inf:
short: 0.75
medium: 0.75
long: 0.5

both have x0.5 accuracy while moving + x1.5 cooldown when moving.
the only downside of puma20mm is that it has 0.6 accuracy and dmg vs heroric infantry.

damage of ostwind is 40
damage of puma is 27.5 average (x0.6 vs heroric)

it does seems the ost has a bit more firing speed though. too tired to calculate exact bigger firing speed.

health of ost is 400, health of puma is 310.
ostwind get's always penetrated, puma gets always penetrated but hardly ever hit. so you could say puma survives more bullets.

speed of puma is also 7 while the ost's speed is 5.


so really.. what is the point of getting the ostwind if the 1000 times cheaper puma does like the same dmg while it's faster and dodges all bullets?
only advantages ostwind has is that it's a bit better vs rangers and light vehicles. but it can harldy stand guard to a staghound.
not to mention that if your enemy is standing in heavy cover the ostwind will NEVER EVER EVER hit 1 bullet.

video: http://www.xfire.com/video/2c02fe/

[Mysthalin]

It's a good point, leo.

In fact, I've been thinking of posting a general comparison of light vehicles with tanks myself - it seems that with the massive improvement in micro from most players light vehicles have been becoming far too cost efficient when compared with their bigger brethren. They have similar DPS, only marginally less health, their armour type allows them to dodge at pretty much the same rates tanks are allowed to bounce shots off and they're fast... Really fast.

All this on top of being tons cheaper and far less popcap intensive.

I do believe this should be subject for review.

[Pak88mm]

It's a good point, leo.

In fact, I've been thinking of posting a general comparison of light vehicles with tanks myself - it seems that with the massive improvement in micro from most players light vehicles have been becoming far too cost efficient when compared with their bigger brethren. They have similar DPS, only marginally less health, their armour type allows them to dodge at pretty much the same rates tanks are allowed to bounce shots off and they're fast... Really fast.

All this on top of being tons cheaper and far less popcap intensive.

I do believe this should be subject for review.

with the amount of stag and t17 spam yeah this has been going ever since those two bastard children have been introduced into EIR.

[CafeMilani]

ostwind overpriced or not - how comes there are so many gripes from you about the faction you currently play?
i think its priced just fine btw

lower the price and it will be spammed by mysthalin, i promise

It's a good point, leo.

In fact, I've been thinking of posting a general comparison of light vehicles with tanks myself - it seems that with the massive improvement in micro from most players light vehicles have been becoming far too cost efficient when compared with their bigger brethren. They have similar DPS, only marginally less health, their armour type allows them to dodge at pretty much the same rates tanks are allowed to bounce shots off and they're fast... Really fast.

All this on top of being tons cheaper and far less popcap intensive.

I do believe this should be subject for review.

with the amount of stag and t17 spam yeah this has been going ever since those two bastard children have been introduced into EIR.

and who are these? XD

[Sach]

dont ostwinds outrange all man packed AT and pumas don't? Or is that only with blitz?

[Smokaz]

The world of the ostwind is a complicated one, and the world of the 20mm puma a simple one. You bring the ostwind out when there's a lot of annoying light vehicles parading around, and not pure infantry. I also think the ostwind can be way deadlier than the puma against infantry, but its a correct observation that it can't handle much more fire back.

It's more or less fine, and in this comparison its more a issue of the 20mm puma being so awesome gaining incredible veterancy and the ostwind not being that über for cost and not gaining suitable veterancy.

[CafeMilani]

they dont. and they dont suck.
and t17s are op

[Sach]

just checked CoH Stats - assuming its right.

Ostwind range 40
RR range 35
Zook range 35

Thats why I use Ostwind. Elite allied inf killing with impunity.

[CafeMilani]

sry i misread ur post. thought u meant ATGs lol

how awkward 

[Smokaz]

just checked CoH Stats - assuming its right.

Ostwind range 40
RR range 35
Zook range 35

Thats why I use Ostwind. Elite allied inf killing with impunity.

Impunity is a strong word. It takes what, 1.5 seconds for infantry to move in against a non-moving ostwind from 35 to 40 range? And if you're kiting, the horrible long range accuracy, moving accuracy and reload comes into play. Its way more dangerous for the ostwind to come within handheld at range than it is for a ranger/rr squad to come within the range of a ostwind..

[Sach]

You underestimate it. Ostwind + bike is lethal to elite infantry spammers. It brought me through the raid assault days. Play smart and you don't even take a hit.

[CafeMilani]

osts are only a *bit* dangerous for AB since its almost dead after 1 volley. ABs might lose 1-2 men though

[CafeMilani]

You underestimate it. Ostwind + bike is lethal to elite infantry spammers. It brought me through the raid assault days. Play smart and you don't even take a hit.

what if there is a doctrine ability that gives RRs +5 range again? oh snap!

[Sach]

you're missing the point aloha. Ost max range is 40, RRs is 35. Use a bike for sight and then kite them, kite them in to an hmg if you can but don't get in range. It will frustrate them and they will make a mistake.

[Sach]

You underestimate it. Ostwind + bike is lethal to elite infantry spammers. It brought me through the raid assault days. Play smart and you don't even take a hit.

what if there is a doctrine ability that gives RRs +5 range again? oh snap!

what if lightning came out of my ass and rainbows from my penis?

[EIRRMod]

what if lightning came out of my ass and rainbows from my penis?

You'd be part of the Dev team.

[CafeMilani]

you're missing the point aloha. Ost max range is 40, RRs is 35. Use a bike for sight and then kite them, kite them in to an hmg if you can but don't get in range. It will frustrate them and they will make a mistake.

yes i get the point, i know what 'outrange' means lol. but still, this will most likely never happen because a competent player always backs his units with at least 1 ATGs up, no matter if he already has 2 ABs

[Sach]

then this conversation is pointless since the puma would get fucked too. So the answer to Leophones question is neither, get some KCH.

You're theory crafting Aloha.

I have pointed out a powerful use of the ostwind. When the fotm is for AB or Ranger spam it is very powerful. I know this from experience. Will it kill panthers? no. Will it kill multiple AT guns? no. Will it defeat any number of theoretical situations you can come up with? No.

But if we really have to go down the theorycraft route then pairing it with the bike should save the worry over AT guns.

[Smokaz]

Its not awful, but its not superb either? Compromise?

[brn4meplz]

there are times i'd rather have a ostwind then anything else.

Played a 4v4 the other day where ostwinds WRECKED the game. a 3 Puma's would not have done what those 2 ostwinds did. Especially once the pesky ranger jumped in buildings. Garrison combat is a no go for Puma's

shit i use Wirblewinds instead of AC's as PE and that just suicide compare those 2 units.