Power of Pervitin Pills (Broken T4, Replay)

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[Demon767]

If HEAT rounds + improved barrels was reimplemented i would do the same

[Malgoroth]

But Positive/Negative skills are for the most part bad. It's easier to just remove the skill.

Not necessarily. If the buff a skill gives is really good and geared towards one end (pure damage) then throwing in a debuff could be helpful in maintaining the balance.

Like - pervitin pills epic 25 second burst damage would be balanced by an inspired assault style received accuracy nerf. The damage and speed makes the skill extremely useful in several situations, but the debuff would exist as a way to ensure it isn't totally abused.  

[nugnugx]

improved barrels

I would love again to see stuh with + 5 range.

[Demon767]

Lionel needs to accept the changes like we did a year ago when all our favourite t4 doctrines were obliterated. TR was the only left untouched.

[Mysthalin]

Marksman shot has a 4 minute cool down. I really don't see the problem with it. Nor do I see how being able to snipe something once every 4 minutes with a gren squad counts as having a mini sniper... but that's just me. Call it what you want. I call motorcycles 'unstoppable killing machines', so whatev ya know?

You fail to understand me. I don't give a flying fuck about marksman shot. Pervitin pills allows grenadiers to be de-facto snipers at long range because they become able to consistently kill an enemy soldier a volley at this range.
They may be a bit shorter range and suffer penalties against buildings/cover - but they still fire 5 times faster. And, if we're comparing the grenadiers to the kommando karabineer sniper - they actually have a BETTER chance of killing an enemy squad member with each of their volleys than the sniper does.

As far as your point about tanks goes : pervitin pills allows shreks to fire 0.455 long range accuracy shots that deal 156 (195 assuming the validity of shrek close range splash theory) a pop. A sherman dieing in 4 shots?  Fun times. With vet 3 the potential would exist for 3-shot kills.

[BigDick]

That sounds like it would be more of a nerf to the Grenadiers than a buff through the ability.

that is how people like tym or volskinator want to see it
the best change for them would be something like 50mun recon upgrade...makes 3 men of grens to spotters and give last men snipe ability on 10 minute cooldown

according to pills it would be something like:

80 mun investment +T4 turns grensquad in a suicide bomb that makes squad explode and deals grenade damage

Kinda like Recon tommies.

recon tommies have more sight and much more detection and the most important point is that they don't need a wasted T3 for that

[Mysthalin]

Kinda like Recon tommies.

But Positive/Negative skills are for the most part bad. It's easier to just remove the skill.

(Recon Tommies have almost 0 combat value. What they do have is the Snipe and Detection once thats done they serve no purpose)

Remember when we doubled recon tommy pool? It wasn't because they were utterly useless at combat that this happened . I would know.

[brn4meplz]

It was because we buffed their Marksman shot, their detection and gave them access to a doctrine selection that cut their cooldown on Marksman shot by a significant margin. We're seeing almost identical patterns in Marksman shot on Grenadiers, albeit in slightly different forms. Available on relatively abundant unit with a cheap cost and the unit is one of the best at general combat duties. Icing on the cake currently is Pills and access to additional upgrades.

if we essentially made Marksmen shot turn grenadiers into Recon Tommies their usage would decline so sharply it's inclusion as an unlock would be moot.

[Mysthalin]

Nope, it's because with a lieut they'd still become more than just "capable" at general anti-infantry duty.

Marksman shot just let you take out storms and the then prevalent zeal-grens fairly well(and MG42s ofc).

[EliteGren]

Not to mention when rangers Fire-up, they cannot shoot while moving yet the Grens can use their own version of fire-up and chase down the rangers at Fire-up speed and still shoot while they move.

No infantry running at 4 speed (sprint) can shoot while moving, it's just not possible.

Keep marksmen. Put them on a 240 second cooldown timer

Marksman has a cooldown of 240s

[8thRifleRegiment]

Derp ^

[Tymathee]

it's not that marksman shot makes grens so powerful, because if it were a separate upgrade like the lmg is to the schreck, you probably wouldn't' see it much but it's because you can have marksman shot + lmg or schreck and nades is what makes it so good on grens.

so, the suggestion for a gun nerf isn't because of the marksman shot itself but because of the potential it has + other upgrades. Like i keep saying, either lock it out and make it a separate upgrade onto itself, make a new unit like the recon tommy or nerf it somehow, i'm tired of seeing this + p pills abused.

[TheIcelandicManiac]

Herpedy derpy derp derparoo

[Jodomar]

O good lord, leave marksman shot out of this for it is not the problem. I like mals idea just turn perv pills into an inspired assault like ability. They need an incoming accuracy modifier and that will be enough. If you add munis to it, if you nerf it to  much, then it will be useless and no one will ever use it.

[smurfORnot]

after seeing pills in action other day from my friend,I do agree that they need some small nerf or longer cooldown,only 1 green squad got +20 kills easily.

[Tymathee]

O good lord, leave marksman shot out of this for it is not the problem. I like mals idea just turn perv pills into an inspired assault like ability. They need an incoming accuracy modifier and that will be enough. If you add munis to it, if you nerf it to  much, then it will be useless and no one will ever use it.

sounds kinda like tank reapers :p

[CrazyWR]

you mean the best t4 infantry has?

[nugnugx]

imo it's ok  , tank reapers provide 25% buffs  to like 5 units which are permanent.

pills provide 30% which are activated and not permanent.

It's not any crazy numbers like it was before with TRs 70%

[lionel23]

TR does NOT provide 25% buffs to 5 units.  The Jumbo one is a joke and so is mines, just the devs adding more to make it seem substantial, which it isn't.  Bazookas got hit the hardest with being shit terrible in accuracy still and penetration wise and damage wise (their buff is only like 12%, not 25%. If it were 25% I wouldn't complain) still bounce off the rears of tanks and takes way too many hits to stop a light vehicle if they can hit.  Operation Overlord is the only T4 worth getting for US inf at the moment for the 1s sherman buff, cover bonus, and fire-up recharge.

[Demon767]

omg lionel QQ more im sick of hearing you whine about TR

Get over it, countless times we have told you that TR was the last untouched T4 OP doctrine, we've all dealt with the doctrine changes destroying our favourite eirr memories, now its time for you to do the same.