1v1s possible in future EIRR?

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[Smokaz]

This game says yes. I think its both fun and it could help sort out some of the e-penis problems we've always had, and the stacking. I mean there's just no excuse to pull when you know the other guy will take you on 1v1 as well.

I think it could be viable, but starting pop would have to be looked at. It should probably be a starting pop of 35, going up to 50.

Level 5 companies, some smurf british with a lot of democharges and tetrarchs. Edit: It was EvilNRG. On semois.

Gives people a extra avenue to build companies for. What works in a team game won't always be so good in 1v1. Lolling around in a big vehicle blob without armor capping for instance, will be harshly punishable.

If this could be done for next patch it would be awesome! I'll start playing 1v1s. The maps are fine for this purpose. Dont need xp or pp for it, sometimes you just want to play a game.

[Unkn0wn]

Why can't you play 1vs1s currently? 25 Pop start should be more than sufficient.

Though personally I'd like to see 1vs1s have Victory Points on the map like they do in vCOH, gives you a little more to focus in a game.

[Smokaz]

Obviously we can play 1v1 (we just did  ), but it stands to reason that players would want to play with higher popcap in a 1v1

So you could still have tanks out combined arms, with a healthy infantry presence

having for instance a KT out in a 1v1 would mean autolose

See what i mean?

[Unkn0wn]

Why would they though? With 25 - 40 pop you don't have less units on the field than you do on average in a 1vs1 in vCOH.
I just don't think pop is the issue when it comes to 1vs1s.

Besides, raising pop would also require more resources, because else you'd be burning through your units very quickly and the games would be really short.

I still think if anything there needs to be a 1vs1 gamemode that starts you at 10 pop and gradually increases to 25 over time, with VPs. (Or even 2vs2/3vs3 with like 16 - 30 pop or something)

[Mysthalin]

The main problem with 1v1s is that there aren't enough units over the width of the map to have proper intense battles.

Adding extra popcap would go a long way in helping solve that.

[Unkn0wn]

The main problem with 1v1s is that there aren't enough units over the width of the map to have proper intense battles.

Adding extra popcap would go a long way in helping solve that.

This is neither the case in vCOH either, rarely do you have enough troops to really fight over multiple sectors at a same time. Not to mention that there's only so much you can micro. And why would you even fight over the entire width of a map in EIR? What 1vs1s really need are 'focal points' like in vCOH. (I.e VPs or sectors of specific importance) IMO.

[Mysthalin]

This is neither the case in vCOH either, rarely do you have enough troops to fight over multiple sectors at a same time

Except you do. In CoH you are much more able to push across multiple points as, in the off-case you get suppressed/pinned or are taking losses you can just quickly press T, reinforce, and come back again.

You don't really need to concentrate all your troops in one place in vCoH (if anything, doing so is deathly) - whereas with EiRR's caping system it's a lot easier to just have all your troops at one focal point on the frontline where the enemy is not really going to be willing to engage you.

10 popcap raising to 25 popcap? really? I'll just go start with a mobility urban survival kits M8. I can cap, and i will kill everything you have. Unless you knew it was going to happen and brought a shrek + pak.. In which case - dual rifles with BARs to be brought on upon losing the M8(or just run around in circles back-capping you since you're slower).

US armour would be retardedly OP in a 10 popcap start environment.

[Smokaz]

Well for semois, focal points are built into the map.

If you had a higher popcap for 1v1s only, perhaps selectable, you would have enough units.

"There's only so much you can micro", I definitely know the feeling. And it comes with being used to regular 40 pop gameplay. Once you play with early 35 and max 50 a few games you'll notice that you man up for it. You'll either use units in pairs etc or manage otherwise.

[skaffa]

1vs1 is too slow last time I played
its also best to get like mass tanks, then mass inf etc, if opponent has a balanced army he will prolly lose vs such spam tactics.

[Unkn0wn]

Except you do. In CoH you are much more able to push across multiple points as, in the off-case you get suppressed/pinned or are taking losses you can just quickly press T, reinforce, and come back again.

You don't really need to concentrate all your troops in one place in vCoH (if anything, doing so is deathly) - whereas with EiRR's caping system it's a lot easier to just have all your troops at one focal point on the frontline where the enemy is not really going to be willing to engage you.

Because in vCOH you can also just 'push up' with just a riflesquad or even an engineer squad. In EIR due to the lack of a tier escalation mechanic such tactics just get punished, you can only really push (and thus have fights) with both AT & AI being present. Which is why gameplay should NOT resolve around the entire width of a map and capping like it does in vCOH, it should resolve solely around those 3 (could just even be 1) victory points, with pop not being sector based (so you'd just climb to 40 pop over time), which would add a lot more excitement to the games. (1vs1s tend to feel a little too overwhelming because there's simply too much map and too little units to cover it with)

What I would like to experiment with in EIR 1vs1s is a 'push gameplay' sector system. Where basically you get ONLY one row of sectors from one swap to the other (narrow rectangular map). The area left and right of those sectors is just there for some flanking to take place. The maps would be even narrower than your average narrow rectangular map, which would allow the combat to be really straight forward and direct. (With the capture game playing a marginal role)

But like skaffa said; ultimately, as long as you don't touch some of the core aspects of EIR's gameplay 1vs1s are likely going to remain largely infeasible. (Because balanced companies can be hard countered by one type of spam, in 2vs2s and upward this is at least mitigated somewhat)

"There's only so much you can micro", I definitely know the feeling. And it comes with being used to regular 40 pop gameplay. Once you play with early 35 and max 50 a few games you'll notice that you man up for it. You'll either use units in pairs etc or manage otherwise.

I don't think you were around when EIR HAD 50 instead of 40 pop as a max. We did extensively experiment with all kinds of population values and it was deemed then that 25 - 40 was the most ideal setup. (We never experimented with pop below 25 though)

[Smokaz]

Whats so wrong with having to keep some AI options and AT together? It's like betting: you bet that he wont send something that a shrek and a volk faust can fight off. In this game I often did that, send out squads that I hoped could contain a threat to the point that it at least could fight without just having to retreat.

[Unkn0wn]

Whats so wrong with having to keep some AI options and AT together? It's like betting: you bet that he wont send something that a shrek and a volk faust can fight off.

Nothing's wrong with it, but it doesn't allow you to really fight on multiple fronts since it requires a larger amount of population dedicated to every important sector. But more population wouldn't be the solution to that, making 1vs1 maps smaller and resolve less around capping would IMO.

[Smokaz]

I dont see how "less about capping" shouldn't be done for regular games too. Its not specific to 1v1s.
It's just the popcap that forces your company into not having a lot of high pop units or callins.

[Mysthalin]

Less about capping automatically means "more about support spam" tbfh.

[Smokaz]

Well the way I see its preferable to one team just suiciding all their units to the stat-win. P-E-R-S-I-S-T-A-N-T suicide anyone? It's just a win on paper many times where the core intention of the gameplay is more or less avoided.

[PonySlaystation]

Unknown you are fighting a losing battle. Popcap is indeed the main problem with 1v1s.

[EIRRMod]

Unknown you are fighting a losing battle. Popcap is indeed the main problem with 1v1s.

While I usually agree with Unkn0wn on most points - I have to agree, pop is too low for 1v1.

I might toy with 35 - 50 pop

[Unkn0wn]

Can we toy with a 16 - 30 pop gamemode for 2vs2s as well?

[tank130]

2v2 is not broken, why would we try to fix it?

[nugnugx]

2v2 and 3v3 are ok


Maybe 15-20 pop for 4v4 so its not such a spam fest ?