Gay Marriage

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[Sachaztan]

I'm not trying to draw you into another trap Tig. What I'm trying to say is that all this talk about getting the overall picture and message of the bible doesn't really apply to you if you haven't read it. All you can really do is looking at individual quotes and see what they say, quotes that wind has been more than happy to provide. And if you look at these quotes the message is very much a unambiguous anti-gay one.

It could be that with dedicated study and reading the entire bible you can deduce that the bible is pro-gay or something. Without this you are reduced to either trusting those more knowledgeable than you (as is customary in Islam) or just looking at individual quotes. And like I said the quotes speak their clear language.

Thankfully as a catholic you neither really have to care what the bible says as there's so much about Catholicism that has absolutely nothing to do with the bible, and you also have a highly knowledgeable authority that you can ask: the Magisterium. But considering that the Magisterium has a completely different opinion than you it is clear that you haven't done this...

[omgNiko]

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[PonySlaystation]

In fact in Babylon, Egypt, Greece and Rome it was an accepted part of every day culture.

Opinions back then were varied. There are many accounts of laws and persecutions against pederasty.

You are a bigot and you are disgusting.

Most people in this thread have already said that they are repulsed by the idea of two men having sex, but that they don't care, most people frown upon it. The only difference is that I'm not passive, it would be like helping suicidal people commit suicide. Sure, it's what they want, but what about all the people who must suffer for it?

[Sachaztan]

Exactly, which is why picked and chose pro-equality quotes from the bible well, what i view as being pro-equality. Just because more quotes in it say otherwise doesn't mean anything when i can cover my eyes and ears and go "lalalalalalalalala".

Also, the only view i have different to the Magisterium is on that of Human Rights, which i am allowed to do cos i'm not a herratic for doing so.

So all in all, i am an awesome Roman Catholic cos i believe same sex marriage is fine! yay! Took forever for you to reach the conclusion that i am awesome didn't it? You had put me in traps and all first to test my awesomeness.

Ok, ok. I admit that it is partially true. But here's an idea, base your stance on gay marriage on something else than the bible because at least on a superficial level it doesn't support it.

But I am a bit sad that there isn't as much wiggle-room for abortion. It seems that you get an instant excommunication for doing one.

I'm also sad about your opinion of contraception. Do you have any idea how much damage the catholic church's opinion on contraception does around the world?

[Sachaztan]

Most people in this thread have already said that they are repulsed by the idea of two men having sex, but that they don't care, most people frown upon it. The only difference is that I'm not passive, it would be like helping suicidal people commit suicide. Sure, it's what they want, but what about all the people who must suffer for it?

No that would be like allowing people to commit suicide if they want, whilst your stance would be like stoning everyone that tries to commit suicide. Real helpful mate.

[PonySlaystation]

No, I didn't say kill all gays. I said that I want to help them and cure them of their sickness.

[Unkn0wn]

The bigotry is reaching disgusting levels in this thread, I see.

[TheWindCriesMary]

Opinions back then were varied. There are many accounts of laws and persecutions against pederasty.

False. Provide evidence or please kindly stop making up bullshit. It was not only a commonplace practise in Egyptian, Greek and Roman society... it was actually seen as essential to a well-rounded male adult lifestyle in the case of Greece.

In some societies it was not well received, but in others it was. Arguing that "in the past" it wasn't acceptable is not only factually wrong, it's also an idiotic argument because so many ridiculous things were/were not illegal in the past any way.

Most people in this thread have already said that they are repulsed by the idea of two men having sex,

You don't have to like two men having sex. But you do have to realize that what you like means absolutely nothing. You have absolutely zero right to infringe your preference upon two consenting adults.

I don't like smoking, but it's not "wrong" for people to smoke just because I don't like it. The very idea of putting toxic smoke into your lungs repulses me, but you have every right to do it. I have zero right to tell you you're immoral for doing it.

Homosexuality on the other hand doesn't even have a bodily harm aspect to it, unlike smoking.

The only difference is that I'm not passive, it would be like helping suicidal people commit suicide. Sure, it's what they want, but what about all the people who must suffer for it?

You have no right, no science and no logically based reasoning to take your dislike of homosexuality anywhere.

And the best part?

You're losing. Human civilization is leaving bigots like you in the dust. In developed countries homosexuality has already stopped being persecuted. Bigots like you are increasingly becoming relics of a savage and primitive past.

You are on the wrong side of history, and your grandchildren will be embarassed when they remember that they had an ancestor who still clung to hatred and ignorance when it was already abundantly clear that those days should have long been past.


Have fun being on the wrong side of human progression.

[TheWindCriesMary]

The bigotry is reaching disgusting levels in this thread, I see.

Pony is a disgusting human being. It's ridiculous.

[Sachaztan]

You're losing. Human civilization is leaving bigots like you in the dust. In developed countries homosexuality has already stopped being persecuted. Bigots like you are increasingly becoming relics of a savage and primitive past.

Yeah well except in the USA. States like Kansas aren't exactly known for being down with lgbt-rights...

[Sachaztan]

I base my stance on gay marriage by the fact that i don't think there is anything wrong with it because there is nothing wrong with it.

Yes, it does a lot of damage, but i'm not black and white you know, i gave you my opinion based on how i would live my own life. I have nothing against others using it because they believe it is right. In fact developing countries need it in order to empower women, which is a vital part of development. I won't talk further on that though, i could talk for hours about World Development.

Much better!

But what do you feel about the whole abortion instant excommunication thing? Sounds a bit harsh to me.

[PonySlaystation]

Again, most people don't approve of homosexuals but they don't care because it doesn't affect them. But the people who are affected; friends, family are always worse off.

[Sachaztan]

Again, most people don't approve of homosexuals but they don't care because it doesn't affect them. But the people who are affected; friends, family are always worse off.

Again, you are talking out of your ass.

[Sachaztan]

"Being excommunicated from the Catholic Church is widely misunderstood: It doesn't mean that you're banned from church and stripped of your Catholicism. Rather, excommunication is a strong, remedial penalty meted out with the hope that it'll wake you up and move you to true repentance — and back into full communion with the faithful. In short, it's reversible.

Excommunication is the most severe form of ecclesiastical penalty and is used only as an absolute last resort. Excommunicants remain Catholic because of baptism and still obligated to attend Mass, but they are deprived of all sacraments (except for the Sacrament of Penance). For example, you can go to Mass but not receive the Holy Eucharist. The excommunicated are forbidden from employment or holding any position of authority in a diocese or parish. They are also deprived of a Catholic burial.

The local bishop has the authority to remove most excommunications, but many bishops delegate this power to all their parish priests when it involves a penitent confessing the mortal sin of abortion. This way, the person going to confession can simultaneously have the sin absolved and the excommunication lifted. This is to make it easier for people to go to confession and reconcile themselves with God and the Church, especially after a very emotional, personal, and serious matter, such as abortion."

It's harsh because abortion is considered murder by the Catholic church, yet murderers are not excommunicated. If murderers were excommunicated then it wouldn't harsh because it's not too hard to have the excommunication lifted.

Abortionists are excommunicated but not murderers? That doesn't make any sense at all, especially since the grounds for excommunicating those who perform an abortion is because it's considered murder. Oo

[TheWindCriesMary]

Again, you are talking out of your ass.

It's freaking ridiculous. The guy makes up the most absurd BS based on absolutely nothing lol

[TheWindCriesMary]

You sometimes make arguments that I would define as bad, but you don't strike me as a bigot or a racist.

Pony is just a disgrace

[omgNiko]

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[omgNiko]

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[XIIcorps]

Why on earth would people want to refrain from having sex is beyond me, especially until your married.

Sex is Fucking awesome

[ROCKETRANGER]

Kojak got a Partner. I prefer Sex Dolls.