AB mortar OP replay

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[UndeathWrath]

full health volks squad in green cover annihilated with one AB shell 12:05

Almost full health pak crew annihilated and pak gun nearly destroyed with one AB shell 22:56

oh btw volks squad is vet1 and pak38 vet 2 so both had -15% rec dmg. Keep that in mind. Which means the AB shell did at least 69 dmg to the volks in green cover (unless cover reduces rec dmg which I think it only reduces rec accuracy?).

[TheWindCriesMary]

I once saw a vet 0 AB mortar kill a full health gren squad inside a medium/large house.

It was lolz

[LiquiDeath]

no, no,  the "stats" guys will never believe it, fake. deal with it, l2p....


or just give it up already



i hate arguing with stats persons,  they will repeat their mantras ad infinitum.

i like WYSIWYG guys more, who actually play game, but they are never trusted...

[NightRain]

As far as I remember Mortars do have damage multiplier vs garrison cover which makes it possible for AB Mortars to wipe out a unit from a building with one shot.

[nikomas]

As far as I remember Mortars do have damage multiplier vs garrison cover which makes it possible for AB Mortars to wipe out a unit from a building with one shot.

Yes, and I changed this multiplier to 0.5

[NightRain]

Yes, and I changed this multiplier to 0.5

Are you sure it works as intended? I'm curious about that because if it works it shouldn't near instant wipe out a unit from a garrison.

[Mysthalin]

The yellow health (40% and below) critical tables for the airburst are the same as for the normal mortar :

50% death
50% life

Which means that a full health volks squad, even with full health and vet 1 is within this bracket when being hit by the shell in the close-range splash and is thus subject to the critical roll. It's a 3.125% chance to lose the entire full-health squad from one shot, but it's there.

A vet 1 gren squad at full health is not subject to the critical roll (just slightly out of bounds.. Damage each guy with a rifle-shot and it will be), but a vet 0 gren squad is from the get go.

Pak crews even with vet 1 are also subject to the roll.. Realistically only a 12.5% chance not to lose any guys after being hit by the airburst mortar shell head on, 37.5% chance to lose 1 guy. 50% chance to lose 2 or all 3 men from the mortar hit.

HMG crews are always subject to the roll (except inside a house, but only at full health marginal damage would put them back into the danger zone).

So yeah, the critical rates mixed with high damage and splash radius are very dangerous, stats wise. Perhaps if the damage and splash radius is kept the yellow critical chance should be changed to only be 25% of creating casualties?

[tank130]

i hate arguing with stats persons,  they will repeat their mantras ad infinitum.

So you hate arguing with logic?

With out stats, we would be trying to balance a game based on dice rolls and personal skill levels. Following your Mantra, jeeps are OP because we have a video of one destroying a KT.

Perhaps instead of bitching about the guys using facts for their arguments, you should take that time to learn the stats and become better educated at arguing balance.

[ick312]

So you hate arguing with logic?

With out stats, we would be trying to balance a game based on dice rolls and personal skill levels. Following your Mantra, jeeps are OP because we have a video of one destroying a KT.

Perhaps instead of bitching about the guys using facts for their arguments, you should take that time to learn the stats and become better educated at arguing balance.

Tank,

if you argue with logic, they pick the one point where you might have done a mistake. But the overall stats issue stays the same, even if you gave 1 wrong value. The best example is the FJ hp compared to ranger hp.
OR they will just try any strange argumentation and personal offenses to harm your point, without thinking about it.

If you argue with game experience, then comes either: "give me the replay" (even if you post about sth. that happens almost each game) or "the stats tell sth different".

Yes stats are need to balance things, but as much as stats are needed is also experience needed.

No offense but the devs should either play more or get some good players and interview regularly about the balance.

PS: i tried to express the issues based on game experience with stats arguments. well you see the outcome.

[Spartan_Marine88]

Tank,

if you argue with logic, they pick the one point where you might have done a mistake. But the overall stats issue stays the same, even if you gave 1 wrong value. The best example is the FJ hp compared to ranger hp.
OR they will just try any strange argumentation and personal offenses to harm your point, without thinking about it.

So you get upset because people tell you to check your stats after you make mistakes and get your values wrong, and then get pissy because people tell you to check your replays because you didn't notice that you were sitting on a mine when the airburst went off?

Also its tiring that even though most of us understand the ability is to powerful without the stats in mind one can not understand how overpowered it really is and how to properly adjust the stats so that it can actually fit into the game.

[nikomas]

Are you sure it works as intended? I'm curious about that because if it works it shouldn't near instant wipe out a unit from a garrison.

You tell me, any reason this should be incorrect?

[ick312]

So you get upset because people tell you to check your stats after you make mistakes and get your values wrong, and then get pissy because people tell you to check your replays because you didn't notice that you were sitting on a mine when the airburst went off?

spartan,

 i have problems with guys who get personal and who are not open to another opinion. let a single stat be wrong, but that doesnt change what you have experienced nor does it that certain units are are too strong/ weak. Also its a question of words with which you correct/ comment the issues.

and concerning the replay thing. Yes you are right, it should be retought if the circumstances of the situation made it look like its op. Thats why shouldnt post instantly after the match, stay cool, think about it, play more games see if it repeats. mmmkay?

concerning the airburstthing. it honestly doesnt matter if they where standing on a tellermine. i experienced thes same with several different sqauds.

[clonetroopers]

With out stats, we would be trying to balance a game based on dice rolls and personal skill levels. Following your Mantra, jeeps are OP because we have a video of one destroying a KT.

Can you post the link, I know there is one where a bike kills a Pershing

[Groundfire]

Suppression tools are only useful if you have the appropriate killing tool for direct support, which does not gel well with indirect fire weapons.

This is why we changed the nebel, yes you could suppress stuff but you couldn't really get to the suppressed troops to kill them.

[aeroblade56]

Suppression tools are only useful if you have the appropriate killing tool for direct support, which does not gel well with indirect fire weapons.

This is why we changed the nebel, yes you could suppress stuff but you couldn't really get to the suppressed troops to kill them.

Now you just get suppressed and sit in fire as your mens die.

[skaffa]

It prolly shouldnt pin so u can atleast crawl away with micro.

[LiquiDeath]

following your mantra, houses designed by you are either nice or functional? but i want to live in a nice house which also happens to be pleasure to walk through...

or do you agree, good design is synergy of form and function?

i am not bitching nor whining, on the opposite I am most grateful for your work.  what i hate most is 'armchair' generals, and sure I have tons of thing on my mind but I would not dare to insult your work. What saddens me is so negative approach to any feedback, why so defensive?

ick's reply exactly represents my thoughts and it is not meaning as argument.


we just like this mod very much, and we are giving our opinions to improve it


...so in the end I dont want perfectly symetrical house in which i always bump my head going through the some doors, almost everybody knows it, yet it will not be dealt with, cause you now - on paper - measures are perfect and government condoned too! i kindly ask for house to be happy in


so why after playing 3 years should I argue with 'stat guys' that something is clearly visibly broken. my jagd is regurarly penetrated by bofors (lie, show replay, stats say otherwise), now mortar 2 shots almost everything, yet they will deny it... I actually play the game a lot u know, I dont get it why I would lie about it? am i 3 days fresh registered troll/noob or what?

All I ask is open minded view perhaps sometimes at least? Or do you want this to stay closed VIP club game of geekdorks playing games perfectly balanced with upgrade that actually in reality nobody uses, but heya they seems balanced.  arguing things like efficiency of puma, flamenwerfers, stuka, PE etc. statwise for 2 years before some desired changes happen...

Anyway, I repeat, very many thanks for patches and all the work. In the end I can deal with it, its free mod. Just want more playability and players!

So you hate arguing with logic?

With out stats, we would be trying to balance a game based on dice rolls and personal skill levels. Following your Mantra, jeeps are OP because we have a video of one destroying a KT.

Perhaps instead of bitching about the guys using facts for their arguments, you should take that time to learn the stats and become better educated at arguing balance.

[nikomas]

so why after playing 3 years should I argue with 'stat guys' that something is clearly visibly broken. my jagd is regurarly penetrated by bofors (lie, show replay, stats say otherwise), now mortar 2 shots almost everything, yet they will deny it... I actually play the game a lot u know, I dont get it why I would lie about it? am i 3 days fresh registered troll/noob or what?

It's not about being open minded, simple fact is you and some others are very clearly wrong on some of the points you don't believe in the stats on, like the jagd vs bofors for example.

http://www.twitch.tv/edraii/c/2381539

While the AB mortar is still iffy I simply do not see how your jagd could repeatedly be penetrated by a bofors when not only the stats say otherwise but this video here says the same thing.

[Mysthalin]

Now mortar 2 shots almost everything, yet they will deny it

No, we will deny the Airburst mortar will always one-shot everything. It has a chance to against some things, but it's not guaranteed. Noone will deny that 2-shots will generally kill any infantry unit there is, though.

[I2ay]

It does fire more than one round each time its used and the spread is small enough that most units hit by the first air burst round will be hit again and die. Not like there's much time to run after your hit the first time...