Immobilised

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[BradAnderson]

is leaving an enemys immobilised tank on the field a tactic or an exploit give me your views please...

[fldash]

Tactic.  Although some may think it lame...  Avoiding an immobilized tank severely cripples the enemies pop-cap.  It isn't like the tank can't be repaired or worse, blown up by the own team to keep regain the population...

[Apex]

It is a tactic. A cheap exploiting of game mechanics tactic.

[Lai]

I want details. Who did what to piss whom off?

[Thtb-Ally]

Its a cheap tactic. I also allowed a phanter with destroyed engine to crawl around for 5 mins before i fnished it off.

It shows that you need many different units to be ready for evry situation. Pio´s help.

[slowzo]

well, when the tank is behind their lines, and they've set up a defensive line in front of it, and you've been at a 9 pop cap disadvantage since the beginning of the game, its hard to repair or kill it.

[Apex]

Some players do everything to win. They don't know that this is about much more than winning.

[CommanderNewbie]

well, when the tank is behind their lines, and they've set up a defensive line in front of it, and you've been at a 9 pop cap disadvantage since the beginning of the game, its hard to repair or kill it.

That would be what's called a "trap."  I voted bananna phone.

[Ackbar] "It's a trap!" [/Ackbar]

[Thtb-Ally]

Other; "Cheap&weak, but no exploit"

[BradAnderson]

lol i knew you would

[scrapking]

If its cheap and lame, or an expoit, then so is pointing your at guns at my tanks, or deploying mines, using goliaths & demo charges to one shot vet units,  etc.  Its just another tool in the toolbox.  I also don't destroy damaged engine / main gun tanks if they are far enough from their spawn for the same reason.  It puts your opponent at a disadvantage to cap territory.  It is not an exploit because you are supposed to be at a disadvantage with crippled units.  Crippled IS a worse fate tha death in this game, and when it happens its really just bad luck. 

Lots of other bad luck happens to a player, and you don' expect your opponent to "let it by".  How many of you have killed airborne which land in trees?  Or pio / engy / inf which wire themselves in?  Do you take shots at your opponents' tank rear when AI reverses direction through a narrow opening?  There is plenty of misfortune to happen to a player, and to not take advantage of (in-game) misfortune is just foolish.  For that matter, how many players will volunteer to abandon a game if someone drops 10 - 15 minutes in? 

Off the top of my head the only thing I think IS an exploit, is running a jeep / bike through the attackers spawn just as he is about to deploy, landing spawn arty on him.  That is an exploit because the arty is meant to protect spawns, not be a free weapon platform.

This sounds to me like another gripe against MCP, in disguise.

[Kolath]

It is a hilarious tactic!  I love when I get the rare chance.

[Apex]

There is a difference between the above described situation and pointing your gun at tanks.

Its quite interesting to get to know who thinks its a tactic and who thinks its an exploit.

There is some things you just dont do. What those things are is different for every character, and his attitude towards the game and his fellow players.

Some may consider spawn arty harrassment with jeeps a valid tactic, others may think players who shoot medics are completely without honor.

Everybody has to decide himself whether its just another tool in the box or a line he will not cross. This will affect what other players think of him. Thats all.

[scrapking]

There is a difference between the above described situation and pointing your gun at tanks.

Its quite interesting to get to know who thinks its a tactic and who thinks its an exploit.

There is some things you just dont do. What those things are is different for every character, and his attitude towards the game and his fellow players.

Some may consider spawn arty harrassment with jeeps a valid tactic, others may think players who shoot medics are completely without honor.

Everybody has to decide himself whether its just another tool in the box or a line he will not cross. This will affect what other players think of him. Thats all.

OK, explain to me in what bizarro-world logic how it makes sense to destroy an immobilzed tank?  I'm supposed to think "my what a spot my opponent is in with his popcap, let me be a sporting fellow and let him out of it?"

Because that same line of thinking can be applied to EVERY situation in game where you gain an edge on your opponent.  Why not apply it to "my what a spot my opponent is in with his precious vet 3 stormshrekers, caught in the open on a road, let me be a sporting fellow and let him out of it."

Or...  "my what a spot my opponent is in, his tank is coming into my nest of AT guns, let me be a sporting fellow and let him out of it".

It applies to everything.  You are just personally deciding that THIS instance deserves being called an exploit.  Exploit means that it abuses a game mechanic which isn't intended for that purpose.  Or abusing something which is a bug in the code or design.

How is an immobilzed vehicle a bug or unintentional game mechanic? Is it a bug?  Or is it popcap which is being abused?

Now, if I had the ability to immobilze your vehicles at will, I might agree with you, but it is simply a "bad dice roll".

[Ranger_Spam]

or let me be a sporting fellow and free up his pop cap by destroying his 3 vet KT

[Forefall]

The reason this legitimate tactic is considered cheap, is because it doesn't play as EiR was likely meant to be played.  No one (hopefully) will argue that one intended strategy of EiR was to injure tanks and "capture and defend" them to hamper your opponents pop cap.  However, it is part of the current game and a legitimate strategy.

I would recommend everyone do this, but everyone complain about it too, and then hopefully the development team can address this and improve the competitive environment.

[Kolath]

I'm not sure why folks are getting bent out of shape on this.  Is it cheap?  Hell yes.  But how often does this really happen?  Pretty rarely  as far as I can tell.  Most immobilized tanks are either destroyed in short order or manage to be repaired.  Only one one or two occasions have I ever seen one team immobilize a tank and then actively defend it to hurt popcap. 

[scrapking]

The reason this legitimate tactic is considered cheap, is because it doesn't play as EiR was likely meant to be played.  No one (hopefully) will argue that one intended strategy of EiR was to injure tanks and "capture and defend" them to hamper your opponents pop cap.  However, it is part of the current game and a legitimate strategy.

I would recommend everyone do this, but everyone complain about it too, and then hopefully the development team can address this and improve the competitive environment.

I do understand your point, but where is it written "how EiR was likely meant to be played"?  Isn't that to some extent self-defined?  Or at least somewhere in the cobwebs inside FL-'s head?

If the complaints are to be made, I support everyones' right to complain about the mechanic, but not about the players who do not live up to the "self defined ruleset", at least in a public manner. (and I'm not suggesting anybody has)  Maybe "immobilized" can be taken off the combat table.  But then "damaged engine" with "main gun destroyed" is almost the same thing.  And I might be going out on an ignorant limb, but I doubt adjusting combat tables is something that FL- is going to view favorably, judging from past discussions.  I suppose another option is removing immobilized vehicles from current popcap totals?  But then it starts to feel more like a blessing than a curse (unless its your vet 3 KT maybe).

I really can't help but view this as part of the "competitive environment", if not an unpleasant one... like so many other unpleasant rolls of the dice.  Again, I see it as just a manifestation of bad luck.  And honestly, probably not even among the top 5 worst bad dice rolls you could have.  There are alot of situations which will one shot an entire squad, or multiple squads, that personally I feel are far worse than this.

I guess my point is that none of these are under a players control to cause them to occur.

[scrapking]

I'm not sure why folks are getting bent out of shape on this.  Is it cheap?  Hell yes.  But how often does this really happen?  Pretty rarely  as far as I can tell.  Most immobilized tanks are either destroyed in short order or manage to be repaired.  Only one one or two occasions have I ever seen one team immobilize a tank and then actively defend it to hurt popcap. 

I agree with you entirely, except for it being cheap.  (But we are entitled to define cheap as we see fit, its a personal thing) Simply because the situation cannot be reliably created by any player.

[Steinmarder]

hm yeah.. but as u guys know i hate unrealistic stuff in games.

If fl- could add "implement abandon vehicle button" to the far end of his to-do list (wich i guess is quite long) i would be really happy, cause thats what one would do if your tank is immobilized far behind the front lines. Just get the hell out of there and try to join up with your forces and crew another tank, instead of sitting around in it smoking weed until someone comes by and either captures or just kills you..