Why are american soldiers the best?

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[lompocus]

Technically thats true because Vietnamese and Korean's fought a gorilla war much like Iraq right now so to fight an actual military engagement was impossible. And Public oppinion > all in the USA you should know that. Also, are you kidding? If we had world war 3 there would be nothing left.

Uh. So much for that BA in history. Korea was a conventional war. We completely annihilated North Korea's military. It was the chinese that drove us back into a stalemate. And THAT wouldn't have happened had Truman not stepped in to stop MacArthur from bombing the chinese army as it moved towards the border.

The chinese were also annihilated, at least the forces they had placed in Korea were. They were actively fortifying their frontlines facing Korea in response to the highly possible chance that the US pushed up.

[stumpster]

Technically thats true because Vietnamese and Korean's fought a gorilla war much like Iraq right now so to fight an actual military engagement was impossible. And Public oppinion > all in the USA you should know that. Also, are you kidding? If we had world war 3 there would be nothing left.

Uh. So much for that BA in history. Korea was a conventional war. We completely annihilated North Korea's military. It was the chinese that drove us back into a stalemate. And THAT wouldn't have happened had Truman not stepped in to stop MacArthur from bombing the chinese army as it moved towards the border.

The chinese were also annihilated, at least the forces they had placed in Korea were. They were actively fortifying their frontlines facing Korea in response to the highly possible chance that the US pushed up.

Yeah, annihilated...that's why they pushed UN troops back to the 38th Parallel?  I'm not saying they didn't take more losses than the UN forces did, but they weren't annihilated.

[salan]

the best conspiracy theory is covered by JERICHO..


scary!

[Draygon]

Ok Ive been reading this thread for a few days now, and while it has pissed me off quite a bit, I didnt respond, until now.

Ignorance is bliss to those that dont want to see both sides of the argument.  Stein, you are one of the most ignorant people I have ever seen, on ANY of the forums I read.  Michael Moore tried proving this, and basically did nothing but skew his data to make things look better for him (same thing for Al Gore's "An Inconvienant Truth")  Keep in mind when someone doesnt want to see things from both sides, you will do what it takes to make people believe what you want them to believe, that means skewing data, or leaving out important facts, etc...

Its no theory, its   i m p o s s i b l e   to destroy a building like that (yes... i even studied the construction plans of the wtc..) with a FIRE. Its like setting a fire on top of the Eiffelturm and make the whole thing collaps from it.

Nothing is impossible, they proved that the heat from the jet fuel did infact cause the structure to fail, that combined with the number of floors that were on top of it was just too much weight to hand, so when it failed completely where else did it have to go but down?  Once it started coming down, the weight of all the falling debris was too much to handle for the rest of the building, and so you have what happened.  You havent seen the pentagon footage have you?  

Above that, Murphy is a bitch, Murphy's law pretty much governs anything and everything that you think may not ever be possible, or that wont happen.

As FL said, if for some reason our government wanted to use it to get us into war in the middle east then why be stupid and not complete the task?  Finish the links, find the WMD's, etc...so really the way I see it is all of you with your conspiracy theories keep them to yourself because the general population of the US could give a rats ass what you think.


NOW with all of that said, politics, theories, etc..are the leading cause of forums/communities going to shit, so IMO I think that talking about such things should be avoided at all costs, Im not telling people you cant speak your mind, but for the good of the community lets let it die.

[Wraith547]

^agreed

lock PLEASE

[lompocus]

Technically thats true because Vietnamese and Korean's fought a gorilla war much like Iraq right now so to fight an actual military engagement was impossible. And Public oppinion > all in the USA you should know that. Also, are you kidding? If we had world war 3 there would be nothing left.

Uh. So much for that BA in history. Korea was a conventional war. We completely annihilated North Korea's military. It was the chinese that drove us back into a stalemate. And THAT wouldn't have happened had Truman not stepped in to stop MacArthur from bombing the chinese army as it moved towards the border.

The chinese were also annihilated, at least the forces they had placed in Korea were. They were actively fortifying their frontlines facing Korea in response to the highly possible chance that the US pushed up.

Yeah, annihilated...that's why they pushed UN troops back to the 38th Parallel?  I'm not saying they didn't take more losses than the UN forces did, but they weren't annihilated.

You don't say over 1 million deaths is annihilated? Oh yes, this is china. 1 million is like nothing to them.

They were taking losses at a sufficient rate and the military situation was such as to warrent them building up LIKE MAD in southern china.

Don't lock. We're not done saying how kickass the US is!

*edit* and to the inevitable "china would kill you", here's a preemptive response: An army with the first two lines armed with weapons and the next 48 lines running naked and picking up the weapons of those in front of them isn't an army at all.

[salan]

russia was still classed as an army

[roflmao]

Oh no, not 9/11 truthers!!! D:.

Its no theory, its   i m p o s s i b l e   to destroy a building like that (yes... i even studied the construction plans of the wtc..) with a FIRE. Its like setting a fire on top of the Eiffelturm and make the whole thing collaps from it.

A building's steel does not have to melt for it to collapse, it just has to lose its structural integrity.

www.debunking911.com completely owns all the theories behind loose change and controlled demolitions.

Or more specifically :
http://www.debunking911.com/firsttime.htm

I mean, this might be/sound harsh, but how much of a nutcase do you have to be to see 2 huge airplanes packed with jet fuel SLAM at 500 MPH right into two towers, causing a massive hell/inferno that went on for 6 straight hours, and then come up with the question "well what if that didn't cause the collapse".

I really do recommend anyone who belives that 9/11 was caused by controlled demolitions to read the articles presented on that website. I am sorry for being a bit hostile, but I just finished "debating" this with some truthers so the whole subject makes me a little "edgy".

I mean yeah, maybe if it were just the fire then it would be a bit "improbable", but these theories rapidly forget, or try to forget that the buildings were hit by 200 ton pseudo-missles. At 490 MPH

[TheDeadlyShoe]

Rofl - yet you'll believe the WMD conspiracy theory without any evidence for it. :p

An army with the first two lines armed with weapons and the next 48 lines running naked and picking up the weapons of those in front of them isn't an army at all.

China has plenty of weapons and equipment.  In fact there is a lot of yelling going on in the Navy about a Russian supersonic anti-ship missile that the Chinese acquired, as it would force carrier groups to stay pretty far out.

[stumpster]

Technically thats true because Vietnamese and Korean's fought a gorilla war much like Iraq right now so to fight an actual military engagement was impossible. And Public oppinion > all in the USA you should know that. Also, are you kidding? If we had world war 3 there would be nothing left.

Uh. So much for that BA in history. Korea was a conventional war. We completely annihilated North Korea's military. It was the chinese that drove us back into a stalemate. And THAT wouldn't have happened had Truman not stepped in to stop MacArthur from bombing the chinese army as it moved towards the border.

The chinese were also annihilated, at least the forces they had placed in Korea were. They were actively fortifying their frontlines facing Korea in response to the highly possible chance that the US pushed up.

Yeah, annihilated...that's why they pushed UN troops back to the 38th Parallel?  I'm not saying they didn't take more losses than the UN forces did, but they weren't annihilated.

You don't say over 1 million deaths is annihilated? Oh yes, this is china. 1 million is like nothing to them.

They were taking losses at a sufficient rate and the military situation was such as to warrent them building up LIKE MAD in southern china.

Don't lock. We're not done saying how kickass the US is!

*edit* and to the inevitable "china would kill you", here's a preemptive response: An army with the first two lines armed with weapons and the next 48 lines running naked and picking up the weapons of those in front of them isn't an army at all.

Well, first, I have no idea where you're getting the one million deaths idea.  China has a distinct tendency to cover up actual deaths, and the US Gov't estimation is only 400,000.

Second, the Korean War has the distinction of having the longest constant US retreat in American military history, not exactly something that would happen if it was an 'annihilation'.

Third, after the Chinese became involved, it was an American retreat, a push back to the 38th Parallel, and then a stalemate to the end of the war.  Really, the only ones who truly got annihilated were the North Koreans after the Battle of Inchon and the subsequent push north.

[roflmao]

Rofl - yet you'll believe the WMD conspiracy theory without any evidence for it. :p

Wha, I thought you were the one with the conspiracy theory xD. I belive the official story the government presents, which is, "our" intellegence sucked. You are the one who belives that they lied to us, and that bush is evil or whatever (ok, thats going too far, but). .

[lompocus]

Rofl - yet you'll believe the WMD conspiracy theory without any evidence for it. :p

An army with the first two lines armed with weapons and the next 48 lines running naked and picking up the weapons of those in front of them isn't an army at all.

China has plenty of weapons and equipment.  In fact there is a lot of yelling going on in the Navy about a Russian supersonic anti-ship missile that the Chinese acquired, as it would force carrier groups to stay pretty far out.

The question is, will anyone attack us? Would they have a frozen rat's chance in hell if they did?

Answer: No. Besides, we have anti-missile weapons being developed for naval vessels to counter that threat. Alternatively, mount railguns on all navy ships and bombard china from afar.

I'm surprised no one has though of mounting a bunch of nukes on a satellite, place it in orbit, put a big US sticker on it, and say "Do anything bad and it shoots."

[Wraith547]

Rofl - yet you'll believe the WMD conspiracy theory without any evidence for it. :p

An army with the first two lines armed with weapons and the next 48 lines running naked and picking up the weapons of those in front of them isn't an army at all.

China has plenty of weapons and equipment.  In fact there is a lot of yelling going on in the Navy about a Russian supersonic anti-ship missile that the Chinese acquired, as it would force carrier groups to stay pretty far out.

The question is, will anyone attack us? Would they have a frozen rat's chance in hell if they did?

Answer: No. Besides, we have anti-missile weapons being developed for naval vessels to counter that threat. Alternatively, mount railguns on all navy ships and bombard china from afar.

I'm surprised no one has though of mounting a bunch of nukes on a satellite, place it in orbit, put a big US sticker on it, and say "Do anything bad and it shoots."

The star wars program

turned out to be inefficient, overly costly and pissed off a good portion of the world. Turns out the fact that any one of our Trident missile subs contains the firepower to bring about the apocalypse

[Draygon]

yea I have to say....no one really realizes how much firepower one trident sub has on it.

Lets get real here though, if we or anyone else started tossing nukes around, the world as we know it would quickly end, all it takes is one, then everyone will start launching.

[lompocus]

Rofl - yet you'll believe the WMD conspiracy theory without any evidence for it. :p

An army with the first two lines armed with weapons and the next 48 lines running naked and picking up the weapons of those in front of them isn't an army at all.

China has plenty of weapons and equipment.  In fact there is a lot of yelling going on in the Navy about a Russian supersonic anti-ship missile that the Chinese acquired, as it would force carrier groups to stay pretty far out.

The question is, will anyone attack us? Would they have a frozen rat's chance in hell if they did?

Answer: No. Besides, we have anti-missile weapons being developed for naval vessels to counter that threat. Alternatively, mount railguns on all navy ships and bombard china from afar.

I'm surprised no one has though of mounting a bunch of nukes on a satellite, place it in orbit, put a big US sticker on it, and say "Do anything bad and it shoots."

The star wars program

turned out to be inefficient, overly costly and pissed off a good portion of the world. Turns out the fact that any one of our Trident missile subs contains the firepower to bring about the apocalypse

Nah, SW just shot down nukes. It wasn't even a weapon.

It was funny, though, the protests. As I was coming back from santa maria back into lompoc one day I saw a bunch of people around the entrance to vafb protesting SW. It was a few years back.

I still don't get it. We build things that shoot down missiles. Is that really that bad?

Fine. Don't put nukes in orbit. Put uraniam-tipped wrenches into orbit, put little thrusters on them with little guidance systems, and when a threat emerges a bunch of them fly down to the target and blow it to hell on kinetic force alone.

[TheDeadlyShoe]

Star wars - if it worked, and it was projected that it wouldn't - would have destabilized the deterrence relationship that kept the Cold War from going hot.  Russia conceivably could have tried a first strike in order not to fall behind.  Therefore, besides being a complete waste of taxpayer money, Star Wars was a terrible, destabilizing idea. 

The militarization of space (ie missile satellites) is seperate from what is now considered to be the Star Wars program, but at the time they were often lumped together.

Wha, I thought you were the one with the conspiracy theory xD. I belive the official story the government presents, which is, "our" intellegence sucked. You are the one who belives that they lied to us, and that bush is evil or whatever (ok, thats going too far, but).

No, you believe the WMD conspiracy theory in the first place, despite a complete lack of evidence. It was not in fact the government's opinion, just Bush, the Cabinet, and some of their appointees. Despite claiming to be read on the subject, you still can't come up with any piece of evidence that was not debunked or considered unreliable before the start of the war.  Neither can anyone else. 

They were rather successful in forcing the silence of other government officals.  The Plame affair wherein the administration disclosed top secret compartmentalized information and spread various lies and smears was a rather graphic example to everyone else.

Bush & co did not in fact care whether the WMD theory was true or not, which is why I termed it the purest form of bullshit.  It's the very definition of it.  The objective was starting the war.  Why? I'm not psychic.  But there are numerous reasons that can be deduced from the evidence.  Neocon 'New American Century' theory.  Opportunities for corruption involving everyone from Halliburton and Neil Bush to think tank interns. The lumping of all 'enemies' under one common banner, regardless of their actual relationship.  Belief that a short victorious war would cement a new Republican majority.  Opposition to diplomatic solutions. Preference for force. Anti-Saddam sentiment on the part of Bush Jr.  Cheney's "One Percent Doctrine", which only applies to wars of course. 

[lompocus]

Star wars - if it worked, and it was projected that it wouldn't - would have destabilized the deterrence relationship that kept the Cold War from going hot.  Russia conceivably could have tried a first strike in order not to fall behind.  Therefore, besides being a complete waste of taxpayer money, Star Wars was a terrible, destabilizing idea. 

First off it would have worked, and at the least it would have been a deterrent for any missile fire from the ussr.

where did you see anything depicting projections the project would fail? To the best of my knowledge it made no sense not to launch it, at least secretly (mebbe in the last titan 4 or some other rocket).

[TheDeadlyShoe]

where did you see anything depicting projections the project would fail

Anyone with any amount of relevant expertise who was not in the Reagan Administration.

Let's put it simply. PATRIOT missiles - whose effectivness is questionable - are like shooting a bird with a rifle.  SDI missiles are like shooting a bullet with a rifle.  A bullet that can create fake bullets and split into many bullets.   Furthermore, maybe the other guy can just send you a bullet in the mail, and that bullet will kill you just as dead.

[Jedi1]

Oh no, not 9/11 truthers!!! D:.

Its no theory, its   i m p o s s i b l e   to destroy a building like that (yes... i even studied the construction plans of the wtc..) with a FIRE. Its like setting a fire on top of the Eiffelturm and make the whole thing collaps from it.

A building's steel does not have to melt for it to collapse, it just has to lose its structural integrity.

www.debunking911.com completely owns all the theories behind loose change and controlled demolitions.

Or more specifically :
http://www.debunking911.com/firsttime.htm

I mean, this might be/sound harsh, but how much of a nutcase do you have to be to see 2 huge airplanes packed with jet fuel SLAM at 500 MPH right into two towers, causing a massive hell/inferno that went on for 6 straight hours, and then come up with the question "well what if that didn't cause the collapse".

I really do recommend anyone who belives that 9/11 was caused by controlled demolitions to read the articles presented on that website. I am sorry for being a bit hostile, but I just finished "debating" this with some truthers so the whole subject makes me a little "edgy".

I mean yeah, maybe if it were just the fire then it would be a bit "improbable", but these theories rapidly forget, or try to forget that the buildings were hit by 200 ton pseudo-missles. At 490 MPH

Well I'm no expert on buliding desing so I couldn't comment on the hole collaps thing but that still dosn't explain all the other strange things that happened.

[Steinmarder]

excactly, theres just too much odd. Its the sum of the little things.


why did building 7 collaps?

why were there no plane parts at the pentagon or in pensilvania, only smoke fire and craters? Every other plane crash site in the history of human flight looks different.

why did some people and some firefighters who made it out alive report a "series of explosions" (one firefighter also said he had a clear view from ground zero up to the tower and it was like "bam bam bam every floor with an explosion")

why did the buildings come down with the highest possible speed like a controlled demolition. if it destroys itself because of material fatigue and than the weight, there needs to be some energy going into the continuing destabilization, thus reducing the falling speed at least a bit.

why was all the concrete pulverized and didnt pile up at the bottom. thats again too much energy required to come from the weight (+height) energy of the towers mass (donno the exact english term for that type of energy, its basic physics)

[this is how it looks if you destroy a building with highly efficient explosives, pulverizing the concrete, which required 10x the energy of a casual demolition charge http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6wpU6OGM68 just watch that closely and remember how it looked in NY]

all these little things sum up to a pile that you can talk 3 hours straight with no interruption about it, and stuff like that we do in politics classes in germany..

Dont want to step on any toes here, really not. I just want to encourage you guys to think a bit more outside the box, and question stuff you get told before you just believe it.