The Humble Marder

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[BigDick]

Is the fuel your problem really ? What will it change rather than getting more light vehicles perhaps. In practice will it give more you more AT, will you lose your marders in action because of the reason morka mentioned above.

fuel is really the problem...your AT guns costs round 200 fuel each and are limited to 3 means 600fuel for AT guns

PE has to rely onto all their specialized fragile paper halftracks because their basic infantry 3 men without upgrades suck

the 3 men pe grens are more like engineers without upgrades..so pe can have 12 engineers and 4 assault inf....the way they are meant to be played is using halftracks which cost all fuel

for example a basic us build has 5 shermans and 3-4 at  guns (consider that at guns are very often remenable by cheap rifles or engies)
that is much more AT then a PE player can bring in....and he can protect his AT by using hmgs against infantry

[UnLimiTeD]

Pe has awesome at, even with only engine damage, ATHTs are very effective, halftrackprice is a joke considering you got a moving MG on it, with double lmg supression.
Marders are so far the Strongest ATG in the game.
Only their Infantrybased AT choices aren't that viable.

[panzerjager1943]

You can have 2 US AT guns for every Marder, that's much more damage output than a Marder.

[MannfredvonRitter]

Why don't you read the calculation which proves that a sherman defeats the marder in a slug fest. But no, PE have the most powerful AT in the game.

Pray tell what AT do they have which is so 'powerful'.

Is it the Marder?
The Tank Busters?
The Panther?

The TB are overpriced badly and highly susceptible to everything with their shit as all hell health.
The Panther is not cost effective as a stand alone AT unit.
The Marder has already been proven to be drastically overpriced and overpop'd
Perhaps an 88? But that's hardly useful in the majority of situations and with the availability system mortars are drastically more common now than previously, rendering emplacements less than useful.

You know it, I know it, hell everyone who plays PE knows it, they lack AT, at least give them a chance to get a few more vehicles to attempt to make up for it.

But no, it's just because I'm adjusting to the team and I need to l2p.

This is a joke, everything I said would happen is and it gets proven with every single fucking game, yet no one listens to a single word. So far, every complaint posted I mentioned BEFORE release, but I was just theory crafting, I was a noob blah blah blah. Certainly the pp system wouldn't result in avoidance of good players would it? Hahaha now look. More smurfing and stacking than ever before.

[Skaevola]

Marders three shot shermans. That's not enough AT? Not to mention instant imobilization AT hts. Honestly, you should not have ANY problems with AT with PE.

[MannfredvonRitter]

Marders three shot shermans. That's not enough AT? Not to mention instant imobilization AT hts. Honestly, you should not have ANY problems with AT with PE.

You're a fucking retard, read my first post.

636 health for a sherman, tell me what 636 is divided by 150
Then tell me what the penetration chance against a sherman is, just because you blob tanks and can't micro doesn't mean marders are epic. Do you even bother to read the first post in the thread or just randomly post without checking?

[Skaevola]

150 (damage of marder) * 1.5 (bonus against sherman check the target tables) * 1.1 (sited main gun, not to mention penetration buff)

636(health of a sherman)/247.5

~2.5

So shut the fuck up. Don't call me a retard when you don't know what the fuck you are talking about. Marder is extremely powerful, and I play exclusively PE, so I'm not asking them to be nerfed because I don't like them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14V_glROYJ4

In game proof, that my math is correct.

[MannfredvonRitter]

150 (damage of marder) * 1.5 (bonus against sherman check the target tables) * 1.1 (sited main gun, not to mention penetration buff)

636(health of a sherman)/247.5

~2.5

So shut the fuck up. Don't call me a retard when you don't know what the fuck you are talking about. Marder is extremely powerful, and I play exclusively PE, so I'm not asking them to be nerfed because I don't like them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14V_glROYJ4

In game proof, that my math is correct.

They don't get a damage buff against shermans anymore. They also don't have APCR in EIRR currently, so the bounce chance is quite high.

In addition, that Marder is being repaired whilst fighting by a horde of infantry, it also clearly has APCR and isn't taking into account the damage nerf from Marders to Shermans.

FAIL

[Skaevola]

150 (damage of marder) * 1.5 (bonus against sherman check the target tables) * 1.1 (sited main gun, not to mention penetration buff)

636(health of a sherman)/247.5

~2.5

So shut the fuck up. Don't call me a retard when you don't know what the fuck you are talking about. Marder is extremely powerful, and I play exclusively PE, so I'm not asking them to be nerfed because I don't like them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14V_glROYJ4

In game proof, that my math is correct.

They don't get a damage buff against shermans anymore. They also don't have APCR in EIRR currently, so the bounce chance is quite high.

AFAIK EIR doesn't change stats. I don't know why they would.

Penetration is 92.1% which is not alot at all, plus once ACPR rounds are implemented that will go even higher!

Even if one shot bounces, 3 shots will leave a sherman at 18 health, enough to be finished off by a lucky grenade.

[Skaevola]

In addition, that Marder is being repaired whilst fighting by a horde of infantry, it also clearly has APCR and isn't taking into account the damage nerf from Marders to Shermans.

FAIL

Yes, the guys micro is shit, you use Marders at long range, but the point still stands that Marders 3!!!!!!!!! shot shermans!

[MannfredvonRitter]

You really are fucking dense, so let me show you just how dense

Marder long range penetration: 0.805
Marder Penetration Versus Sherman: 0.614
Total Penetration: 49%

Site Main Gun:
x1.35 penetration
=66%

Congrats, I like to see that.

Didn't you read? The damage is 150*1.1 sited,

THERE IS NO DAMAGE BUFF TO MARDERS ANYMORE AGAINST SHERMANS

[Skaevola]

Why would they remove that?

[MannfredvonRitter]

The 25% is out of date, there's no buff to damage versus shermans. How many times do I have to say this?

The sherman in that video you had was damaged before the fight, it's proof of nothing, the Marder had the damage buff and APCR clearly.

I give up, go use a marder in EIR and enjoy your 3 shot kill lol.

[panzerjager1943]

The damage bonus vs. Sherman and M10 Armour was removed. As it was in the Beta.
We implemented some changes from the Beta before it's going to hit retail.

Also you're waaay off:

1.5 (bonus against sherman check the target tables)

Damage bonus WAS 1.25 before I removed it. Not 1.5.

[MannfredvonRitter]

[Skaevola]

The 25% is out of date, there's no buff to damage versus shermans. How many times do I have to say this?

The sherman in that video you had was damaged before the fight, it's proof of nothing, the Marder had the damage buff and APCR clearly.

I give up, go use a marder in EIR and enjoy your 3 shot kill lol.

Erm..? No it wasn't. I will keep using my marder, combined with my ridiculously OP AT HTs to rape allied armor. Its extremely easy, I'm surprised you can't do the same? Maybe too used to your OP Pak guns, and not having to worry about AT or anything else killing it?

[Skaevola]

The damage bonus vs. Sherman and M10 Armour was removed. As it was in the Beta.
We implemented some changes from the Beta before it's going to hit retail.

Also you're waaay off:

1.5 (bonus against sherman check the target tables)

Damage bonus WAS 1.25 before I removed it. Not 1.5.

and yes your right I was looking at the damage bonus against the PIV XD. Marders do 3 shot in retail, and they certainly do not need a buff now. Amazingly, like every other army you cannot just use one piece of AT to defeat all enemy armor.

[panzerjager1943]

Yes but this piece of AT costs twice as much pop as standard, and so is harder to support.

[Skaevola]

Why would they remove that?

[MannfredvonRitter]

The damage bonus vs. Sherman and M10 Armour was removed. As it was in the Beta.
We implemented some changes from the Beta before it's going to hit retail.

Also you're waaay off:

1.5 (bonus against sherman check the target tables)

Damage bonus WAS 1.25 before I removed it. Not 1.5.

and yes your right I was looking at the damage bonus against the PIV XD. Marders do 3 shot in retail, and they certainly do not need a buff now. Amazingly, like every other army you cannot just use one piece of AT to defeat all enemy armor.

Did I say I use one piece of AT? Here comes the predictable l2p comment, I back up my AT, but Marders are weak enough that they rarely survive an engagement with the enemy even when backed up, unfortunately they have 4 shermans, you have 3 marders. They also have 3 ATG's.

ATG's easily kill Marders, shermans can kill marders, rangers can, riflemen with BARs can. Marders are easily destroyed. I would much rather an ATG. I won't even go into the tactical situation, the Marder is a vehicle, with a specialised purpose which is doesn't do well at. It needs to be cheaper.

In retail the Marder costs 40 fuel, the Sherman costs 90, this means two marders per sherman.