the heavy tank thread

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[Rayze]

Also since we have a nice and interesting mix crossover of american units getting buffed by brit ones, i promote the idea of a new unit - The Command p4 or tiger. Basically reskinned p4 or bergetiger with bonuses....
Theres so many obvious inbalances and injustices to this area, you cant have good vet for one faction and crappy for the other. You cant have additional bonuses that wasnt originated even for vcoh  given to one-sided and everythings ok, without giving additional care to provide for the other side of the game.

Then of course you would be all front for the balance ratio of Heavy units then?

Instead of it being Axis 3 - Allies 1 it would be "Fair" as you say to even the odds and we are talking soley aromour here, not tryna take the piss but putting up your argument creates other factors mate.

[CafeMilani]

as i said: heavy tank should get (nearly) same vet
KT  maybe faster turrest rotation at vet1 or 2 and 3 like now (15% is a bit poor^^)

[Mysthalin]

I want 4 man airborne squads that have beefed up BARs and can ambush from heavy cover insta-gibbing any enemy squad, because the axis have that.
I want an offmap that instagibs any support weapon I look at.
I want a recon run that doesn't announce to the enemy "I'm reconning you!" and reveals the whole map.
I want my 50 cals to instasuppress.
I want my riflemen to have an ability that makes them ignore suppresion and throw nades every 2 seconds.
I want, I want I want.

Stop requesting for mirror balancing in units themselves, it's pointless and un-needed.

Vet should be standardized, but also take into account what's the "base" of the thing getting buffed with vet. A unit with 100 base damage will benefit from a 20 percent buff a lot more than a unit with 50 base damage...

[CafeMilani]

when the pershing gets 20% more dmg at vet3, a tiger should also get 20% more dmg at vet3 and then u see how awesome the pershings vet is..
(same vet requirements)

[Hicks359]

I can agree the Pershing vet requirements are off by a tad... In one game i got 86 exp with it, the one after i probably should of had an equal amount owing to a near equal amount of kills the second round. Instead i got capped at 99.

The Pershing in the right hands can be as deadly as any other Axis heavy tank, but it will never out perform any of the heavy armour of the Axis pound for pound.

Imo, the Pershing is aimed at supporting your other teammate and dealing with light-medium armour quickly, whilst being a damage soak and prime target for the heavier Axis armour.  Buffing Axis vet and nerfing Allied vet will skewer that and make it worse in it's role.

As mentioned by EliteGren, as far as we know, the CCT is being dropped from reinforcements all together with the next patch... So any "vet nerfs" now to compensate for the presence of a CCT, are going to quickly become void - Perhaps leaving the Pershing in a worse state than it needs to be.

Imo, raise the vet requirements of the Pershing, but i'd consider thinking about what lowering the actual benefits will do to the tank when you compare it against other Axis armour by itself.

[CafeMilani]

it can be much more deadlier because its also awesome against infantry and with CCT which doubles the rate of fire+ u can buy 2 in supply...

[Hicks359]

Did you not read my post?

CCT is getting removed soon enough - and IF they implement any vet changes in this thread, it will most likely be at the same time of the CCT's removal.

If you think that being able to buy two Pershings is an issue, make an American Armoured company and try it yourself.

Pretty much all of your fuel down the pan, with probably just enough to keep a light armoured unit or two, and 17 pop a piece, meaning you get 6 pop to work with if you field both at once, and thats late game, IF your winning.

[Schultz]

Mysta i was being ironic, what do you want big flushy colors and letters to figure it out.

[Warlight]

I want 4 man airborne squads that have beefed up BARs and can ambush from heavy cover insta-gibbing any enemy squad, because the axis have that.
I want an offmap that instagibs any support weapon I look at.
I want a recon run that doesn't announce to the enemy "I'm reconning you!" and reveals the whole map.
I want my 50 cals to instasuppress.
I want my riflemen to have an ability that makes them ignore suppresion and throw nades every 2 seconds.
I want, I want I want.

Stop requesting for mirror balancing in units themselves, it's pointless and un-needed.

Vet should be standardized, but also take into account what's the "base" of the thing getting buffed with vet. A unit with 100 base damage will benefit from a 20 percent buff a lot more than a unit with 50 base damage...

Calm Down you.  I'm sure you could of made your point in a less, i don't know, stupid way.  

This thread isn't about buffing all the axis units.  I've been watching this thread, and I thin its been pretty much people repeating the same sentament for a while now.  

Either:
A: Increase the Pershing Vet Requirments, reduce the cost of the Jagd, reduced the XP needed for axis Heavy tanks, and MAYBE modify the vet bonuses for the heavy tanks.

B: Reduce the XP requirments for Axis tanks, but leave everything alone untill we see how the Pershining without the CCT preforms.  
But do somthing to help the Jagd.  Theres a very good reason its leading the Vet boards, Because it get babysat alot, and only used in curtain situations.  I've escorted it (Shultzz's Jagd)  on the field before, it wrecks shermans sure enough, but its an awful expensive AT Gun.


Other then that, I don't think anyones brought up any new solutions since page one.

[Rayze]

I honestly think the only change needed here to make things "fair" is maybe increase the Experience needed to gain Vet on the Pershing.

[Mysthalin]

Warlight, I wasn't exactly being pissed off in that post . I was just making a remark towards schultzie's extremely witty "irony".


Schultzie - irony/sarcasm fails on the interwebs, and your statement wasn't particularly reaking of it either. Plus, I don't think anything you say applies anyways, seeing as you claim that shrek blobs don't exist. Could be why you're sucking if you're not using them .


Noone said that the axis need an all-out buff, and noone implied that they did.
I will agree to the fact the jagd is pathethicaly useless, and needs cost decreasing ASAP, and the pershing vet requirements need to be tuned for now, whereas the vet bonuses should stay as is for now - as I said, vet needs to be standardised, but only after taking into account the "base" that's being buffed.

[VariantThirteen]

Awww guys, let's look at some changes to the KT, pleeeease ?

[Tymathee]

the jagd costs as much as the TA because it has 2,000 health points and more armor and it has 100% penetration vs every tank but the pershing but it has 120% accuracy and 83% penetration chance. It's THE tank killer.

Also, because it is a bit faster than a normal panther and it's bigger, it does a very effective job of running over infantry much like the m10. Maybe later i'll post what the vet does to the heavies and see how unfair it is but atm, i just dont wanna.

[Tymathee]

Okay I actually did it, does this help in the debate on vet to see what needs to be changed?

Pershing:
Rec Dmg -15%
Pene +10%, Acc +15%, Health +20%,
Rec Pene -20%, Dmg +20%

Health 990 to 1188
Max Speed 5
Rotation 25
Gun Damage 137.5 to 165
Gun Pene LMS .9/.95/1 to .99/1.045/1.1
Accuracy LMS .75/1/1 to 0.8625/1.3/1.3

Rec Dmg/Pene vs
Tiger 1/.7 to .85/0.54
KT 1/.881 to .85/0.7048
Jagd 1/.881 to .85/0.7048

Tiger:
Rec Dmg -10%
Pene +10%, Acc +15%, Health +20%
Rec Pene -20%, Turret Speed +10%

Health 1064 to 1276.8
Max Speed 4
Rotation 23 to 25.3
Gun Damage 137.5
Gun Pene LMS .835/.92/1 to 0.9185/1.012/1.1
Accuracy LMS .75/1/1 to 0.8625/1.3/1.3

Rec Dmg/Pene vs
Pershing 1/.5 to .85/.4

King Tiger:
Rec Dmg -10%
Acc +15%, Health +10%, Spd +15%
Rec Pen -10%, Speed +15%

Health 2000 to 2200
Max Speed 3 to 3.45 to 3.9675
Rotation 20
Gun Damage 165
Gun Pene LMS .8144/.9156/1
Accuracy LMS .75/1/1 to 0.8625/1.3/1.3

Rec Dmg/Pene vs
Pershing 1/.5 to .85/.4

Jagdpanther:
Rec Dmg -5%
Acc +15%, Health +10%, Spd +10%
Rec Pen -10%, Health +10$

Health 1600 to 1760 to 1936
Max Speed 5.4 to 5.94
Rotation 32
Gun Damage 165
Gun Pene LMS 1.099/1.235/1.35 to
Accuracy LMS .75/1/1 to 0.8625/1.3/1.3
Rec Dmg/Pene vs
Pershing 1.1/0.4

I couldn't find tiger ace stats on coh-stats, so i didn't include them.