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COH: Europe In Ruins
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EIR Main Forums
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Balance & Design
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Powerful doctrines
Poll
Question:
Back to powerful doctrines?
Yes, they were fun!
15 (62.5%)
No, I like them now.
9 (37.5%)
Total Voters: 24
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Topic: Powerful doctrines (Read 9859 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Mysthalin
Tired King of Stats
Posts: 9028
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #20 on:
May 29, 2014, 05:08:47 pm »
Quote from: Smokaz on May 29, 2014, 04:15:22 pm
Was it really that good? Sick!
Yeah, me and misten tested it once. Was firing at the back of a sherman from point blank with a shrek. It would heal up ages before I'd reload to fire again.
Logged
Mister Schmidt
Lawmaker
Posts: 5006
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #21 on:
June 09, 2014, 01:10:01 am »
The people have spoken.
Logged
Quote from: xez0 on August 29, 2014, 10:57:01 am
and 6th " Main Thing " is you have to Chant " hare krishna hare krishna krishna krishna hare hare hare rama hare rama rama rama hare hare ".
Quote from: Smokaz on November 22, 2011, 09:01:38 am
"Seeing Bigdick in his full sado mask attire, David couldn't help but feel a tingle in his special place.."
Bear
EIR Veteran
Posts: 903
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #22 on:
June 09, 2014, 04:54:48 am »
can eirr be again like last year summer?
all was fine and balance, I said it many time before.....
now I think axis was op in the month at beginn this year without docs and allied be now op with the docs...
«
Last Edit: June 09, 2014, 05:18:39 am by Bear
»
Logged
Brothers stand tall!
Erst die Heimat, dann die Ferne.
Erst die Erde, dann die Sterne.
Shabtajus
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2564
The very best player of one of the four factions.
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #23 on:
June 09, 2014, 09:25:11 am »
yea good old doctrines.
The real question is when new patch is coming?
Logged
Quote from: TheWindCriesMary on April 08, 2013, 11:10:04 am
I feel like if Smokaz and Shab met up it would be a 50/50 tossup to see which one of them robbed the other first.
Quote from: Hicks58 on May 04, 2013, 01:59:39 pm
Tries to convince people he's a good guy,says things like this. Scumbag Shab.
TheIcelandicManiac
Resident forum troll. Fucked unkn0wns mom
Posts: 6294
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #24 on:
June 09, 2014, 11:05:35 am »
I wonder if people remember why the "good old doctrines" were changed, anyone here remember the fun times when you had to deal with Carbines? TRs? old SE?
Terror officer? Fuck if anyone here remembers Passive sprint Lighting war.
The problem was that it wasnt just OP vs OP makes a game fun, It would just make something so strong that even tough youd play the best you could do youd have no chance of winning because Youd get raped in a head on combat, Sure people would say just kite them or flank em. Well in the end it never worked out as youd just get shoved up the ass by a 250 dam ATG or LMG DPS riflemen.
Fuck you have to Miss Bob and his Allied fanboyism.
«
Last Edit: June 09, 2014, 11:07:12 am by TheIcelandicManiac
»
Logged
Quote from: Grundwaffe
Soon™
Quote from: Shabtajus on May 18, 2013, 02:16:45 am
gj icelandic i am proud of u
Quote from: aeroblade56 on June 21, 2013, 11:47:37 am
Sometimes its like PQ doesnt carrot all.
Work Harder
NightRain
EIR Veteran
Posts: 3908
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #25 on:
June 09, 2014, 12:34:52 pm »
Very few remembers the old powerful doctrines Ice. TR used to be 70% health, damage, penetration on every anti tank gun on field. What it is now is pansy in comparison.
Though powerful T4s should come back, but they do have to be viable and useful, and not make double T3s look weak in comparison either.
Logged
Quote from: Unkn0wn on June 05, 2011, 04:01:40 am
Because a forum post should be like a woman's skirt. Long enough to cover the subject material, but short enough to keep things interesting.
TheIcelandicManiac
Resident forum troll. Fucked unkn0wns mom
Posts: 6294
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #26 on:
June 09, 2014, 02:14:18 pm »
Quote from: NightRain on June 09, 2014, 12:34:52 pm
Very few remembers the old powerful doctrines Ice. TR used to be 70% health, damage, penetration on every anti tank gun on field. What it is now is pansy in comparison.
Though powerful T4s should come back, but they do have to be viable and useful, and not make double T3s look weak in comparison either.
Damn im happy i came in early 2010.
http://www.moddb.com/mods/europe-in-ruins/videos/tank-reapers#imagebox
Logged
narref
EIR Regular
Posts: 41
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #27 on:
June 09, 2014, 03:41:32 pm »
I just miss the old EIR Tank reapers doctrine. Watching your stugs 1 shot by a single 57mm round was so frigging annoying and impressing at the same time.
Logged
Mister Schmidt
Lawmaker
Posts: 5006
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #28 on:
June 09, 2014, 03:46:33 pm »
Quote from: TheIcelandicManiac on June 09, 2014, 02:14:18 pm
Damn im happy i came in early 2010.
http://www.moddb.com/mods/europe-in-ruins/videos/tank-reapers#imagebox
I wish I was there
Logged
NightRain
EIR Veteran
Posts: 3908
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #29 on:
June 09, 2014, 10:00:49 pm »
Honestly? None of you wish you were there. Then again Repair bunker spam was one common thing. Tigers that kept coming back since pios, engineers and such could repair vehicles even tho it was at slow rate.
There were doctrines that made units cheaper, like -30% off of grenadiers and volksgrenadiers, airborne and things like that. Every side certainly had a lot of things that simply made people weep. German Steel...damn I can't recall its buffs but it was around -35% less penetration -20% less damage. Those buffs on 2 King Tigers certainly rose hair on people's head, Fatherland Defence all units had 20% more health or so making panthers as HP buffed as Tigers. Zeal...making solo grenadiers so tough that you needed snipers to deal with them. Schrecks turned into semi automatic rifles. A lot of weird things to be fair!
Logged
TheWindCriesMary
The Ethics Police
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2630
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #30 on:
June 09, 2014, 10:51:31 pm »
In a 3v3 guys like St. Pauli's whole 3v3 gameplan was based around bringing repair bunkers and tons of pios and just playing with one tiger for like 30+ minutes of a game.
Logged
Quote from: EIRRMod on April 30, 2012, 07:08:25 pm
Vermillion Hawk: Do you ever make a post that doesnt make you come across as an extreme douchebag?
Just sayin'
XIIcorps
Donator
Posts: 2558
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #31 on:
June 10, 2014, 12:09:18 am »
If they came back we would essentially exterminate the playerbase bar the elitists who know how to exploit their doctrines to the full extent.
It would be a QQ fest.
And why would we undo all the progress we have made thus far.
Logged
Quote from: Heartmann on December 03, 2013, 11:20:45 am
some of My kids i work with shower me
Mister Schmidt
Lawmaker
Posts: 5006
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #32 on:
June 10, 2014, 12:12:14 am »
Strongly disagree, and what progress? Mod dies and gets replenished every year, it's a cycle
P.S I never said bring back doctrines exactly as they were, I said I'd like to see a return to doctrines that were stronger and better buffed
Logged
XIIcorps
Donator
Posts: 2558
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #33 on:
June 10, 2014, 12:54:24 am »
Admittedly some t4 or dual t3 combinations are lackluster compared to those that work.
But do we really want to go back to retarded OP days ?
And as for progress im talking about the semblance balance.
Logged
Mister Schmidt
Lawmaker
Posts: 5006
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #34 on:
June 10, 2014, 01:54:01 am »
I would happily forgoe balance for a while if we were to get fun doctrines back.
They have steadily and contiuosly been turned into boring, bland, lackluster and in some cases, weak choices over the past year or two, and I'm clearly not the only one who thinks so.
Logged
EliteGren
EIR Veteran
Posts: 6106
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #35 on:
June 10, 2014, 02:09:57 am »
If anyone will make doctrines powerful again it's Myst tbh, so we pretty much got it. Just a matter of time
Logged
Quote from: deadbolt on December 30, 2010, 09:14:16 am
i prefer to no u
Quote from: deadbolt on July 30, 2012, 08:08:48 am
Don't knock it til uve tried it bitchface, this isn't anything like salads version. Besides u said a semois conversion would never work, now look that's the most played map, ohgodwhy.jpg r u map lead
XIIcorps
Donator
Posts: 2558
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #36 on:
June 10, 2014, 02:31:41 am »
Quote from: Mister Schmidt on June 10, 2014, 01:54:01 am
I would happily forgoe balance for a while if we were to get fun doctrines back.
They have steadily and contiuosly been turned into boring, bland, lackluster and in some cases, weak choices over the past year or two, and I'm clearly not the only one who thinks so.
doctrines have barely changed over the last 2 years, besides the 1 or 2 abilities per faction.
Ie Airborne mortar, USK removing main gun. some of these actions made boring, others were nesicary
Logged
Mister Schmidt
Lawmaker
Posts: 5006
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #37 on:
June 10, 2014, 02:36:20 am »
lol, we had like 3 doctrine reworks the past 2 years or so
Logged
tank130
Sugar Daddy
Posts: 8889
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #38 on:
June 10, 2014, 07:49:59 am »
Quote from: Mister Schmidt on June 10, 2014, 02:36:20 am
lol, we had like 3 doctrine reworks the past 2 years or so
There was a rework 4 years ago when I first got on the Dev team and Firesparks was coding.
When PQ became balance lead we had half (not even half) of a rework but Leophone refused to code the remaining docs claiming it was a very complex job that required months.
Nikomas came on board and completed coding 2 of those docs in about 3 days...... The Dev team decided not to code the rest of the changes because it was obvious the rework was not done in a cohesive group and did not blend well.
There was a testing period of docs with Hicks as balance lead that resulted in some minor changes to docs.
So no, there absolutely has not been 3 doc reworks in the past 2 years. There hasn't even really been a total rework in 4 years.
You will also find numerous threads with people offering to rework doctrines, people claiming the Dev team should ask the community for help etc, etc, etc. These threads are then filled up with people claiming they created docs but the dev team ignored them.
What people fail to recognize is reworking the docs requires ALL OF THEM to be reworked as a group to ensure balance & consistency. You can't player "A" make one doc, player "B" make another with out them working together.
There are countless docs out there created by community members but everyone just picks the same 2 or 3 docs most often played & ignores the rest.
Reworking the docs requires balancing 252 abilities & unlocks....... Sure, you don't have to reinvent these abilities & unlocks, but the moment you change one of them, you must balance it against all the rest.
Logged
Quote
Geez, while Wind was banned I forgot that he is, in fact, totally insufferable
Quote from: Hicks58 on June 05, 2013, 02:14:06 pm
I'm not going to lie Tig, 9/10 times you open your mouth, I'm overwhelmed with the urge to put my foot in it.
tank130
Sugar Daddy
Posts: 8889
Re: Powerful doctrines
«
Reply #39 on:
June 10, 2014, 07:50:16 am »
Something that is often forgotten is that the current doctrine system is broken. Broken in that you do not have to earn your docs. The war is supposed to reset and it is supposed to take a while to build up your docs.
Overly powerful docs would create a massive gap between a new company and an established company. Even a veteran player creating a new company would be at a great disadvantage resulting in no one experimenting with other factions.
The only way to offset this imbalance would be to add a resource cost to these better abilities. That is what the dev team has designed for Eir2 giving them the ability to make any doc powerful but still have a balance mechanic.
Unfortunately this can not be done with the current launcher. Let me rephrase that - it physically can be done, but it would require an insane number of hours of work (150+) and Eirrmod does not want to invest that kind of time into a temporary fix. Can't blame him either.
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