Reset & Patch 0.7.3 released!

[Guest]

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever

Login with username, password and session length

[kwiatekkek]

are tank  huters  even implemented?

[3rdCondor]

Ive seen 1 17pd in the last 6 months, i highly doubt a small muni decrease will change that.

We also fixed its range, it was set to 64 (should have been 69).

Price Changes

*Churchill Croc from 320F to 300F

*Jagdpanther from 630Mp to 730Mp

I find this a little confusing. The Church is borderline OP already...now it's cheaper!!!!
The jagd already got nerfed to shit with the fuel increase....

The Church Croco also costs 13 pop now, "jagds nerfed to shit" lolz.

I gotta agree with tank: Why the decrease in price? Jags are also only really good against tanks so I don't understand the nerf there. I would, however, understand if the KT was nerfed.

[wildfire444]

so with the price increase, no more triple pershing

[Killer344]

so with the price increase, no more triple pershing

Exactly.

[BeRzErKeR]

I thought there were restrictions of heavies to 2 and super heavies to 1.

[Killer344]

Not *yet.

[BeRzErKeR]

Even though all factions gains minesweeper units, will the PE faction as well as recon sections keep their ability to detect mines?

[Killer344]

No.

[Two]

Good recon tommies detecting mines ftl.

[tank130]

Ive seen 1 17pd in the last 6 months, i highly doubt a small muni decrease will change that.

We also fixed its range, it was set to 64 (should have been 69).

Price Changes

*Churchill Croc from 320F to 300F

*Jagdpanther from 630Mp to 730Mp

I find this a little confusing. The Church is borderline OP already...now it's cheaper!!!!
The jagd already got nerfed to shit with the fuel increase....

The Church Croco also costs 13 pop now, "jagds nerfed to shit" lolz.

If this double posts....sry

Jadg got nerfed is the wrong choice of words. With this fuel increase, PE got nerfed. PE is the most fuel dependent faction in the game. By increasing the Jadg fuel, they lowered our ability to purchase other units. With the MP increase, they have hit us again.

The pop of the church is not the problem. It RAPES all infantry and handles itself damn well against most axis tanks. You only need one ATG on the ground with this unit to take out the front lines. Pop is not the problem.

[jackmccrack]

Well the Jag is twice as effective (in the right hands) as a KT and much cheaper.

[tank130]

Well the Jag is twice as effective (in the right hands) as a KT and much cheaper.

Well, a KT in the right hands is twice as effective as a jagd.
The unit balances should not be determined by the elite players, but by the overall average of the mod.
The devs are taking the stance that the jadg is OP and nerfed it by increasing fuel and MP. This has a crippling effect on PE as a whole. I have agreed in the past that the jadg is OP, but crippling the rest of the faction because of it does not make sense.
PE needs massive fuel. If you want to nerf the jadg with out nerfing PE, then change the units stats, or as a last resort, increase MP. I know the devs do not like to change units stats, but they have in the past and they will more thank likely do it in the future.

Just so I do not appear to be contradicting myself: I think the jadg stats should be changed or a MP increase. I do not agree with both a fuel and MP increase.

[Unkn0wn]

Just so I do not appear to be contradicting myself: I think the jadg stats should be changed or a MP increase. I do not agree with both a fuel and MP increase.

The jagdpanther didn't get a fuel increase...

[CrazyWR]

Tank, its a 100 MP increase, not fuel.  The Marder price went up 20, lord only knows why, since I rarely see them, but ya.

[tank130]

Just so I do not appear to be contradicting myself: I think the jadg stats should be changed or a MP increase. I do not agree with both a fuel and MP increase.

The jagdpanther didn't get a fuel increase...

It got a fuel increase the last patch before the tourni.

[Mysthalin]

The unit balances should not be determined by the elite players, but by the overall average of the mod.

You're wrong. No game has ever achieved balance by balancing on what the "average community" thinks. It's the elite player's input that has made starcraft as balanced as it is, and it is only after EiR has taken a turn to listening to the GOOD players has the balance started to shift. Or do you miss the old OBM? How about raid assault/air superiority? Ferocity ring a bell?

In every single case, every single unit or off-map or ability, you must think of what the good players could do with it. If a good player can do it, then an average player can one day learn to do it too. Give a noob a KT, it'll die with one rifle kill. Give a good player a KT, it'll single-handedly win the game.

Increasing the jagds cost is not a nerf to PE as a whole - only one doctrine has the bloody thing, and even then it's optional. If you chose to buy a jagdpanther, and it gets an increase in price - it's the jagd being nerfed. It loses it's much needed support, it loses it's capping capability. Those are two very important things to take into account. Remember - you build a company around a jag, not squeeze a jag into a company...

And you can't just buttfuck such a unit to uselessness in hopes of fixing it's balance within the metagame - superheavies are a VERY specific unit class that has no clear equal to compare to, and seeing as allies do not have any superheavies, we only have 1 other unit of the same class, which also happens to be on the same side of the conflict which makes stat changes an extremely sensitive and easy to screw up method. Don't forget that stat changes in general are something the devs try to avoid.

So yes - the nerfs on the jagd are well called for, and the route taken is great. Increase it's price - not make it an unwelcome purchase by making it a super-heavy stuart.

Marder price went up because the marder is just silly - just spam them and win over ATGs and tanks alike(not that I can say I'm good with them - try David, though).

[Groundfire]

Well the Jag is twice as effective (in the right hands) as a KT and much cheaper.

Well, a KT in the right hands is twice as effective as a jagd.
The unit balances should not be determined by the elite players, but by the overall average of the mod.
The devs are taking the stance that the jadg is OP and nerfed it by increasing fuel and MP.

Sry tank, i disagree with you here. In pretty much every game out there, if game balanced is not balanced at the highest level of play, then it is not balanced.

Example: I would not ask a person to dictate the price of a sherman if they did not know how to use it 100% right all of the time because then it would be priced disperportunatly compared to other tanks in the same class. Sherman ends up being cheaper that what it would be because the average guy thinks it's a below average tank, then the elite players spam shermans to deadly success because they handle their shermans better.

The jadgpanther was far too cheap for a superheavy. You should not be able to field 2 Jadgpanthers and a small army of light vehicles. Armies like this become nearly unbeatable because jadgpanthers have the capability of nutering every allied AT counter normally fielded, and unless you got a Firefly, allied armor is gonna bend over and take it as well.

Since very soon, PE will be limited to 1 Jadgpanther, the fuel increase is neglegeable, because you can only have one, and you are forced to spend the rest on your light vehicle complement or a panther anyways.

[tank130]

Well the Jag is twice as effective (in the right hands) as a KT and much cheaper.

Well, a KT in the right hands is twice as effective as a jagd.
The unit balances should not be determined by the elite players, but by the overall average of the mod.
The devs are taking the stance that the jadg is OP and nerfed it by increasing fuel and MP.

Sry tank, i disagree with you here. In pretty much every game out there, if game balanced is not balanced at the highest level of play, then it is not balanced.

Example: I would not ask a person to dictate the price of a sherman if they did not know how to use it 100% right all of the time because then it would be priced disperportunatly compared to other tanks in the same class. Sherman ends up being cheaper that what it would be because the average guy thinks it's a below average tank, then the elite players spam shermans to deadly success because they handle their shermans better.

The jadgpanther was far too cheap for a superheavy. You should not be able to field 2 Jadgpanthers and a small army of light vehicles. Armies like this become nearly unbeatable because jadgpanthers have the capability of nutering every allied AT counter normally fielded, and unless you got a Firefly, allied armor is gonna bend over and take it as well.

Since very soon, PE will be limited to 1 Jadgpanther, the fuel increase is neglegeable, because you can only have one, and you are forced to spend the rest on your light vehicle complement or a panther anyways.

Ok, You guys have convinced me on who should be calling the balance of the game. I guess the question to that is, who decides who the good players are. If we base that on tourni results, then only 2 people inthis mod should be calling the shots. We can't go by stats as those are easily manipulated by either stomps, stacks or players who really don't give a shit about stats and will play with newbs...... but this is all for another post 

I disagree that the fuel increase is negligible, as any fuel to PE is important. We only have hand held AT or vehicle AT. We all know how shitty hand held is, especially if there is a church on the field. That means we need fuel for AT.

Increasing the jagds cost is not a nerf to PE as a whole - only one doctrine has the bloody thing, and even then it's optional. If you chose to buy a jagdpanther, and it gets an increase in price - it's the jagd being nerfed.

I already said I agree to a price increase. I do not agree with a fuel increase. The fuel was increased just before the tournament. A further nerf is over kill. If you are having troubles countering a jadg, perhaps you should not be the one giving pointers on balance.

And you can't just buttfuck such a unit to uselessness in hopes of fixing it's balance within the metagame - superheavies are a VERY specific unit class that has no clear equal to compare to, and seeing as allies do not have any superheavies, we only have 1 other unit of the same class, which also happens to be on the same side of the conflict which makes stat changes an extremely sensitive and easy to screw up method. Don't forget that stat changes in general are something the devs try to avoid.

Perhaps "buttfucking" would be considered over kill. Perhaps we could suggest a less severe adjustment. Something simple like changing it's speed, or range or a multitude of things that would not be considered a "Buttfuck" and would not make it a Stuart. I am going to go out on a limb here and suggest that you may not be the best suited person to make balance suggestions. You seem to think the only way to change something is by making massive drastic changes.......

The fuel increase and MP increases made are not little amounts. Again I will say - Increase the MP, but not the fuel. Increase the MP by 200mp, but no fuel. This way it is still an expensive unit to have, but does not nerf the rest of your company.

[jackmccrack]

Well obviously the high skilled players are the ones who stomp and the low skill players are the ones who get stomped.

Remember it takes skill to stomp.

[Groundfire]

lets at least play with the patch before we go screaming that stuff is useless now.