M10 Spam

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[vivie5]

So Ive noticed a strong trend of M10 spam lately. Just 6-8 rolling over infantry, circle strafing tanks, bumping shrek squads.

These tanks move fast, hit really hard, can easily run over and kill infantry. Cheap throw away units that can pretty much go ahead and hunt down and kill anything they want.

In terms of survivability, they seem to do good armor wise. Sure a pak can hit them, but with the speed available to an m10 and the numbers, unless you have significant AT available its nonsense.

Beyond that, Recon Run's are so advantageous as a noob advantage.

What can be done to bring an M10 into line? It can kill infantry and tanks in numbers, and easily flank due to speed. They dont seem to miss much anymore either.

[NightRain]

Price increase or Pool increase. Nothing else you can do to M10. It is one of the best tanks out there as it can tackle every opponent because it IS a TANK DESTROYER

[BigDick]

good in combination with airbornes imho, use M10 as anti infantry and RR ABs as anti tank/anti  AT gun

if there is an AC or a puma the M10 can deal with it too

Price increase or Pool increase. Nothing else you can do to M10. It is one of the best tanks out there as it can tackle every opponent because it IS a TANK DESTROYER

M10s could be fixed if you remove human crush exactly why it is a TANKDESTROYER and no hardcounter to infantry

just my 2 cents

[kwiatekkek]

remove  human  crush and we're golden.

[Jazzhead]

remove  human  crush and we're golden.

+1
I've seen too many out of control m10s run over vet squads, or shrek squads run themselves into the tank when you tell them to attack *facepalm*

[Grundwaffe]

So Ive noticed a strong trend of M10 spam lately. Just 6-8 rolling over infantry, circle strafing tanks, bumping shrek squads.

These tanks move fast, hit really hard, can easily run over and kill infantry. Cheap throw away units that can pretty much go ahead and hunt down and kill anything they want.

In terms of survivability, they seem to do good armor wise. Sure a pak can hit them, but with the speed available to an m10 and the numbers, unless you have significant AT available its nonsense.

Beyond that, Recon Run's are so advantageous as a noob advantage.

What can be done to bring an M10 into line? It can kill infantry and tanks in numbers, and easily flank due to speed. They dont seem to miss much anymore either.

Ugh i know its hard man, what you could do as i do, call in a panther and manuever, you have to manuver really good as you want to avoid two flanking m10's but meh.
Works for me.

[seanconnery]

lol just don't stay near the roads, so tanks can't crush you as easily and form pak walls with shreks to back you up. Even learn to thread break and have at finish it off.  no big deal.  plus, once people start leveling up and unlocking doctrines there will be no problem to finish off these weak hp units.

[winisez]

while the m10 is cheap and a highly effective tank destroyer that is totally expendable, and great at cashing I think its fine. m10's are a vital part of allies AT and is often one of the components used by allied teams when coordinating attacks on Tigers and King Tigers, It also affords a fast and reliable source of anti tank to the allies, which without an m10 they do lack.

So the m10 certainly has it's place, and the argument that it is either too cheap is resources or pool is interesting. Lets look at some facts.

m10 pool is 3, for airborne that means you can only get 4, before going into reserve. The m10 is 300 manpower, 160 fuel and 10 pop, with a 30munition repair kit option ( often if bought not used, often not bought due to the disposable nature of the m10)

So all in all the m10 is a cheap yet formidable tank hunter, with the ability to handle unsupported infantry by crushing them. The key here is unsupported, almost any vehicle except the firefly can mess reasonably with unsupported infantry, using 50cals, or there normal guns. Crushing while annoying brings the tank close, to where you SHOULD have AT, there by exposing the m10 to retaliation, which it really cant take much of. The m10 has 400 hp, a Pak does 115 damage with each no cloaked shot. Even without ambush the pak will kill an m10 in 4 shots, thats roughly 6 seconds.


The basic m10 is a perfect example of the m10, and punishes axis players for making mistakes due to its high speed and damage potential, however when countered properly, it dies like a sack of shit.

A non balance issue I have with the m10 is its disposable nature in a mod focused on persistence, it is thrown away ( as is its nature) in order to kill other players vet, and I dont really like this concept in a persistence mod, but that is a gameplay view of things, not a balance one.

The issue I see with m10's is when they are combined with some of armour doctrine's intrinsic buffs, they get 500hp, a hardly insignificant amount more, and can become equivalent to 7 popcap, this is less pop than a stug, for a unit that now has 500 hp and is only marginally more fuel intensive.  The problem with these doctrine abilities, and indeed others is that units that are already solid choices, become even more cost efficient therefore they can start to become too cost efficient, which is the issue I see with m10's in the armour doctrine.

Sans armour doctrine I believe m10's are totally fine and priced correctly. They pack a punch but they are also easy to take down with properly positioned anti tank solutions. All of the m10's facets end up making it a gamblers units imo, it has amazing potential if your opponent makes  a mistake, but if you make a mistake with it, its going to die and do nothing probably.

[BigDick]

Ugh i know its hard man, what you could do as i do, call in a panther and manuever, you have to manuver really good as you want to avoid two flanking m10's but meh.
Works for me.

if you don't have extended sight and a lucky 5% 2 M10 will beat a panther from the front with no need for rear armor hits

[Grundwaffe]

Ugh i know its hard man, what you could do as i do, call in a panther and manuever, you have to manuver really good as you want to avoid two flanking m10's but meh.
Works for me.

if you don't have extended sight and a lucky 5% 2 M10 will beat a panther from the front with no need for rear armor hits

Infantry help me with the sight

[NightRain]

Armor coys can have nice ammount of M10s.

9 M10s. That'll outration every player unless it is a StuG company.

[BigDick]

Ugh i know its hard man, what you could do as i do, call in a panther and manuever, you have to manuver really good as you want to avoid two flanking m10's but meh.
Works for me.

if you don't have extended sight and a lucky 5% 2 M10 will beat a panther from the front with no need for rear armor hits

Infantry help me with the sight

2 m10 still win easy since its difficult to make use of 2.5 more range (45 vs 47.5) and M10s are faster and have a much much better acceleration

if your panther don't attack just one all the time both m10 will live

[Tamska]

remove  human  crush and we're golden.

+1

+2

Or give marder human crush

[vivie5]

Removing crush I think would put the M10 in line with the Ostwind. Ostwind is a decent counter to allied infantry, m10 without crush and still fight tanks. It's having 3 well micro'd m10's kill your tanks WHILE running over infantry.

I know ive lost more than 1 squad by giving an attack order and having all 4 guys just walk into tracks willingly. the Stop button or moving away is your only option.

[deadbolt]

spam tank traps gg.

[skaffa]

remove  human  crush and we're golden.

[CafeMilani]

you guys cant be serious 

[Calstifer]

Personally, it think the M10's are fine.

1: Reguarding crushing, most of the axis tanks have crushing power, including the panther (Good all round AT tank) and Stuh and Stug... The axis have only the M10 (in reguards to non docitne units). It levels the playing field a bit.

2: The M10 may be mobile, but 2 blast of an At can bring it to its knees. All you have to do is be smart and lure it.

[Mysthalin]

M10 is fine as a base.

It's onky when you stack all the buffs from armor coy on it that you go "lol wtf?".

[deadbolt]

BRING BACK KANGAROO CRUSH!