Add single bar to the specialist equipment

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[Draken]

Zook on rifles is really useless, when you can get rangers and double zooks for 80, I just wasted 2 unlocks points on that, ok but it's not the thing.

It would make infantry doctrine more neat, if specialist equipment would make rifles able to buy single bar for let's say 30 munis well you can argue about price, but that's most reasonable for start, being able to buy bars on rangers would be also cool, but I'm gonna get trolled to death by axis fanboyz orkz band, without even testing it.

[Mgallun74]

meh, depending on your company build and how u use stuff its not useless, only time its useful is if your taking the TR route thou..

i normally have in the past vetted up Rifle dorks with zooks and stickies, they are pretty useful.

[LCII^Bun-Bun]

Depends on what is done with suppressive fire, which is always a bit ummy (though I ain't saying there is lots of other ummy stuff in the game) but being able to use Suppresive fire with 30 mun 190(?) mp squad is a bit ummy imho :p

I personally would find it interesting to see to be honest.

Though I would also be a bit sceptical about a single bar, bit like the single mp 44, I wonder how much the damage output would change in a way it's worth a T2

though the bar on rangers sounds interesting (as long as it's not 4 of them, my gooood)

[lionel23]

No I agree and I've brought this up, Specialist Equipment is a terrible T2, and is more in line with a T1.

Single zooks at a MUCH higher price on a crap platform is ridiculous.  Get 3 riflesquads with a zook and watch an AC or Clowncar come by, suppress and then kill them all before they can fire a 2nd volley.  That was the sole reason I dropped that ability as it made me weaker against vehicles than running rangers, which can fight much longer, can stand against light vehicles and not lose a guy every shot, and should in the unlikely event get suppressed can use Fire-up to restore normal loading times on the bazookas or chase after vehicles.  Overall a much better proposition.

The Specialist equipment needs to make Riflemen carry MINUMUM two bazookas or give them the option to 'full pack' 4 bazookas or something.  The platform is still incredibly weak and could be easily stomped and you'd be paying a higher premium to get that many bazookas in it.

The other option is allow mixed weapons 'kits' to be purchased or more expensive kits for existing squads.  I'll list some examples.
Heavy Ranger Support Kit: 2 Bazookas, 2 BARs (no suppression)
Ranger Support Team: 4 BARs (no suppression)
Riflemen Support Team: 1 Bazooka, 2 Bars (no suppression)
Riflemen Anti-tank Kit: 2-4 Bazookas
Riflemen Anti-vehicle Kit: 1 Bazooka
Riflemen Support Kit: 4 bars (no suppression)
Riflemen Assault Kit: 1-2 SMG Thompson, 2 bars (no suppression)

Something like that would give a much greater emphasis on using the squads in a mix of roles as you want to customize the company.

1 Zook and smoke nades really don't cut it, the specialist grenades are terrible.  And if you get assault teams, they get those for free... so why get a T2 unlock when a T3 provides that same bonus WITH more weapon options and, IMHO, a better engineer squad (their riflemen squad is a seriously downgrade).

[Masacree]

If the zooks are so terrible why does everyone use them so much? 

[Nimitz]

I'm fine with all of that if I in return can get <=65 muni G43 upgrades on my wehrmacht grenadiers.

[EliteGren]

That would almost be totally worthless. It's like a 10% increase in dps for Wehrmacht Grenadiers.

[lionel23]

If the zooks are so terrible why does everyone use them so much? 

Because it takes many bazooka hits to effectively kill a vehicle, hence why a ranger squad or two are excellent against a puma (2-4 shots there on squads that will rarely lose a man to a puma) compared to 1 bazooka on a rifle squad that will be vaporized and/or suppressed due to crappy armor and having 'half' the AT firepower.

Oh and of course it's assumed by the packages would be priced accordingly to what would be 'proper' or balanced. No single BAR (that is useless when you get double Bars by default) and no single bar suppression (really, going to try to slip a cheap suppression in?).  I missed Salan's Infantry units and they jive more with providing some tactical options and not I-Win Buttons.  I wish I could use Bars are merely support weapons as they are designed, not for 'Hit Suppression mass suppress' ability.  But maybe that's just me, I also like fighting and duking it out with axis infantry in cover-cover fights with M1s too and not going all crazy with a zillion offmaps, heh.

[Nimitz]

Pro tip: Compare the DPS of the elite kars & G43s vs units in buildings.  

And, zaxis disagree's with you.

[EliteGren]

Wehrmacht Grenadiers don't use PE Kars.

[Masacree]

If the zooks are so terrible why does everyone use them so much? 

Because it takes many bazooka hits to effectively kill a vehicle, hence why a ranger squad or two are excellent against a puma (2-4 shots there on squads that will rarely lose a man to a puma) compared to 1 bazooka on a rifle squad that will be vaporized and/or suppressed due to crappy armor and having 'half' the AT firepower.

No, I meant why do people use zooks on rifle squads so much? The answer, of course, is that they own PE, and are quite effective versus Wehr light armor.

[Mysthalin]

That would almost be totally worthless. It's like a 10% increase in dps for Wehrmacht Grenadiers.

It'd be fairly worthless at long range - yes, but at short range you're getting a pretty damn good increment.

[lionel23]

Not necessarily 'own' PE, but its the only real option to fight vehicles with riflemen and its a doctrine unlock for US Armor who can lose all their vehicles quite quickly to PE.  Sticky bombs are more disablers than killers... and being priced at roughly the same price, I rather have a 'weapon' that I can keep using than limited uses with cooldown ability like a sticky bomb.  Riflemen vanilla and riflemen with bars do the exact same things = fight only infantry.  With the bazooka they are able to at least put up some fight against a vehicle.

Forgot whose thread it was that was mentioned, but someone fought a game with a Universal Carrier in their opening and wiped out an Axis Wehr player's opening call in cause it had zero anti-vehicle fighting capability... *shrug*.  There isn't really any better options for riflemen.  US Infantry would get variety (and they get more through rangers) and armor.. well their only variety is bazooka or bars.  One bazooka is fine for armor as a support weapon, but US Infantry the infantry are the main line and not support and that's why I strongly believe Specialist Equipments needs to give them double bazookas, I'm against a lowering of the bazooka price because even if it was free it would not convince me that 1 bazooka on riflemen with no option to take bars would be anywhere near as effective as rangers for vehicle-busting duties.

[Nimitz]

Wehrmacht Grenadiers don't use PE Kars.

Wtf? I said myself they use Elite kar98s, which have +10% more accuracy [at every range] and do 50% more damage than the normal kar98's used by volks. Still I think they (elite kars) are a good deal weaker than G43s. Or am I wrong in some way?

But hey, if you don't think it's worth it, I have another suggestion. For 50 munis I can upgrade my grenadiers to elite armor! <3


EDIT: Guys, that "zaxis" thing in my last post is a link...

EDIT2: Guys, I'm not comparing PE kar98s with Wehrmacht kar98s LOL. I'm talking about G43s.

[lionel23]

But they are mainline infantry, not elite... if anything, 3 pool units should be given that option (ie Falls, Storms, etc).  It's like giving riflemen elite armor... that's just overkill.

And you're comparing Volks Kar98s, what about Gren K98s against PE K98s? Can't pop any DPS calculators to look myself.

[Rocksitter]

 Oh while your at it can we get a option of fire up for KCH and better armor for Storm Troopers as up grades that would be nice....

[lionel23]

Well two reasons..

1. This thread is specifically about single bars and thus riflemen... and another thread is already discussing the armor option.

2. KCH don't need fire-up, they rarely get suppressed and can quickly recover from it, and have assault nades to break suppression.

Back on point, Specialist equipment needs to open up more options, or even better allow it to allow more options off the T3 Assault Teams and turn that 2 pool, 5 man rifle squad into that 4 BAR (no suppression) support team that Salan made and gave US Infantry the needed firepower without I Win Buttons on the field.

[Rocksitter]

1. This thread is specifically about single bars and thus riflemen... and another thread is already discussing the armor option.

 I have not seen this thread when was it listed?

[lionel23]

Discussed in passing in the Marksman snipe for grens... discussing what could replace that... and armor was brought up there for Grens, having additional weapon options for them or volks, and a few other interesting suggestions.

[NightRain]

Smoke grenades and bazookas are awsome. Why should the kit give you more than that?