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[PE] Hummel spread fix
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Topic: [PE] Hummel spread fix (Read 30109 times)
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LeoPhone
Honoured Member
Posts: 0
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #60 on:
December 07, 2010, 02:53:24 pm »
what spread? according to corsix scatter is same as 105.
I have a theory though:
the 25 pdr has less range than the 105. This results in the barrage being used at a shorter range on average and shells going lower in the air and coming down at a less steep angle. this cause the 25 pdr to overshoot or "undershoot?" more.
like this:
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nugnugx
Donator
Posts: 4051
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #61 on:
December 07, 2010, 03:11:13 pm »
so how can you explain that hummel also misfires on closer ranges ?
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Spartan_Marine88
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4838
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #62 on:
December 07, 2010, 03:15:56 pm »
Yea, but the buggest problem atm is that everyone wants arty to seem like real arty.
The biggest problem was that there were rarely that many 'over/under shoots' How it would work is 2 shots were fired called 'ranging' shots, 1 infront of the target accuracy confirmed by radioman, 1 behind once more confrimed, then they would carpet the area between it.
A very effective artillery doctrine developed as they realized in ww1 massed arty just didn't do a good enough job at knocking out hardened positions, but it was great at supporting or destroying an attack.
Hell, i laugh at the assumption that indirect fire was innaccurate a good radioman and experienced gun crew could hit a tank on the move.
Im also not talking just allied stuff either, axis equipment was generally better, just less of it.
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Quote from: Sachaztan on March 24, 2013, 03:49:43 pm
Yes that's me, the special snowflake.
LeoPhone
Honoured Member
Posts: 0
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #63 on:
December 07, 2010, 03:23:11 pm »
Quote from: nugnugx on December 07, 2010, 03:11:13 pm
so how can you explain that hummel also misfires on closer ranges ?
I just explained it there above? It does not matter which artillery piece you are using but at what range you are. because of the 25 pdrs inability to go long range its average accuracy is lower. I think...
Ill do some ingame tests.
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nugnugx
Donator
Posts: 4051
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #64 on:
December 07, 2010, 03:25:03 pm »
Quote from: LeoPhone on December 07, 2010, 03:23:11 pm
I just explained it there above? It does not matter which artillery piece you are using but at what range you are. because of the 25 pdrs inability to go long range its average accuracy is lower. I think...
Ill do some ingame tests.
yes you explained long range of hummel vs low range of 25pdr .
but when hummel shoots on closer range it shoots 'up' just like 25pdr and any other arty piece and bullets are not flying as steep as on long range but it still misses.
also , howie on max range fires with the same steep as hummel and it does not spread as much. Their range is the same.
Even Brn said hummel has a higher scatter angle (page 3)
«
Last Edit: December 07, 2010, 03:28:54 pm by nugnugx
»
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LeoPhone
Honoured Member
Posts: 0
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #65 on:
December 07, 2010, 03:45:29 pm »
I was never talking about the hummel.
I did the tests, and the formula for scatter calc is pretty simple:
average width of barrage area = scatter angle of arty piece * range
average length of barrage area = - angle of floor / scatter angle of arty piece / range
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«
Last Edit: December 07, 2010, 03:50:00 pm by LeoPhone
»
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LeoPhone
Honoured Member
Posts: 0
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #66 on:
December 07, 2010, 03:57:10 pm »
wow... I just checked the hummel's stats in corsix. it has double the scatter of all other arty pieces and fires only 4 instead of 6 rounds. wtf???
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nugnugx
Donator
Posts: 4051
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #67 on:
December 07, 2010, 04:31:29 pm »
Quote from: LeoPhone on December 07, 2010, 03:57:10 pm
wow... I just checked the hummel's stats in corsix. it has double the scatter of all other arty pieces and fires only 4 instead of 6 rounds. wtf???
no kiddin
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nugnugx
Donator
Posts: 4051
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #68 on:
December 12, 2010, 12:41:59 pm »
Why hummel cannot get something like this if brits RCA get this for all of their artillery ?
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Artekas
Donator
Posts: 784
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #69 on:
December 12, 2010, 01:06:36 pm »
Because the Hummel has its own doctrinal buffs?
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VERTIGGO
EIR Veteran
Posts: 392
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #70 on:
January 18, 2011, 01:37:16 pm »
Leo - I think those might be backwards, because at least from the videos and my memory I think the Hummel's trajectory is higher at short range, i.e. the barrel points higher to hit closer targets (more like the mortar trajectory), because at long range it definitely scatters more.
The Hummel in CoH is specifically intended to target armor, however. That is why the splash is low, but because of the scatter, it's not the greatest at its own job. The incendiary rounds, on the other hand, turn an underpowered weapon into an overpowered one since 16 different fires work best when spread out. Not that these are the only stats that count, but just look at the leaderboard - more than 50% of all the Hummels are at vet 3 whereas only a few Priests are. The burn is currently way too much, and
because
of the spread ensures that anything within the target circle has a very slim chance of even retreating out of it.
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TOV units = intentionally OP marketing gimmicks
Tymathee
Donator
Posts: 9741
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #71 on:
January 18, 2011, 05:10:23 pm »
Vertiggo, its not intended to target armor, its intended to target emplacements and buildings, it's very good at taking those down, which is why it has the high penetration but of course it does well against armor.
I agree the Incendiary rounds are a bit much, they need to be about 2x as big as the spread from a Nebel and should fire 4 rounds instead of 6, which i've never really understood, it's not even in the tooltip description.
Quote from: nugnugx on December 12, 2010, 12:41:59 pm
Why hummel cannot get something like this if brits RCA get this for all of their artillery ?
Because the Hummel doesn't seem to need it? The doc abilities it gets are obviously doing well, any time someone has a 3 hummel company and regularly puts out 2 at a time then u know they're quite strong. I dont' see any 2 or 3 priest coy's do u?
btw anyone surprised i dont have a priest or hummel coy lol and my howie, my single howie, is only vet 2 heh...go figure.
«
Last Edit: January 18, 2011, 05:12:34 pm by Tymathee
»
Logged
Quote from: nikomas on October 04, 2012, 09:26:33 pm
"I want proof!"
"I have proof!"
"Whatever, I'm still right"
Dafuq man, don't ask for proof if you'll refuse it if it's not in your favor, logic fallacy for the bloody win.
AmPM
Community Mapper
Posts: 7978
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #72 on:
January 18, 2011, 05:42:44 pm »
Why would you use 3 priests when you can put out 2-3 25lbrs that do the same thing for less?
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Spartan_Marine88
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4838
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #73 on:
January 18, 2011, 05:50:27 pm »
Quote from: AmPM on January 18, 2011, 05:42:44 pm
Why would you use 3 priests when you can put out 2-3 25lbrs that do the same thing for less?
No, 1 priest is better then 3 25 pdrs
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Tymathee
Donator
Posts: 9741
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #74 on:
January 18, 2011, 06:04:25 pm »
Quote from: AmPM on January 18, 2011, 05:42:44 pm
Why would you use 3 priests when you can put out 2-3 25lbrs that do the same thing for less?
'
mobility, range, more precise barrage and a small ability to defend itself
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LeoPhone
Honoured Member
Posts: 0
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #75 on:
January 18, 2011, 06:22:35 pm »
and the priest can crush wooden walls!
not stone walls though.
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Spartan_Marine88
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4838
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #76 on:
January 18, 2011, 06:30:22 pm »
although the priest will die faster from pumas and ac's 20 mm cannon then from any other vehicle
Logged
LeoPhone
Honoured Member
Posts: 0
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #77 on:
January 18, 2011, 06:52:44 pm »
25 pdr dies to small arms, and its own units coz its not shot blocking everyone tries to shoot over the emplacement.
Logged
Tymathee
Donator
Posts: 9741
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #78 on:
January 18, 2011, 07:24:17 pm »
also 25s dont retain vet well
Logged
Firesparks
Honoured Member
Posts: 1209
Re: [PE] Hummel spread fix
«
Reply #79 on:
January 18, 2011, 11:38:22 pm »
Quote from: Tymathee on January 18, 2011, 06:04:25 pm
'
mobility, range, more precise barrage and a small ability to defend itself
and damage. Priest shell deal 200 damage compare to 125 damage on the 25 pdr
Logged
With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine. However, this is not necessarily a good idea. It is hard to be sure where they are going to land, and it could be dangerous sitting under them as they fly overhead. -- RFC 1925
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