Noob --> Pro process

[Guest]

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever

Login with username, password and session length

[Katusha]

I'm just wondering about how long it took people to start doing better in this mod. Considering I had barely any vCOH experience (like 10 games.. 15 at most), and I joined this mod i believe in July of this year, I feel like at first I improved, and then I stalled out at my current mediocre level, just below average player. I can't even keep a 1.0 W/L ratio still, its more like .6-.8.

I am asking this because I'm considering giving up on playing this game, because I can't seem to get better at it. I'd like some input as to how long it took you guys to reach a respectable skill level.

P.S. sorry smokaz about your vet 2 panther.. still don't know if that was completely my fault, but it was partly my fault

[TheLastArmada]

this mod is as unpredictable as it is fun,
sometimes you feel as tho your doing so well, then next game you get steamrolled
its all to do with stacking and trying to play games with people of simillar skill lvls

try to avoid playing against high lvl players if your only lvl 5-6
stick to games with people of a similar lvl or skill range

[Masacree]

True pros are born pro.

No but really, you don't get competent until after like 15 games (I lost my first 15 games miserably) and don't get good for a bit after. Just stick with it! It's like any learning curve. Watch replays to get an eye for good tactics, and practice being quick with the mouse and quick with the hotkeys and you'll be good in no time. Most players stay around a mediocre-noobish level because they lose the ability to progress. The biggest advice I can give is to constantly change your company until you find one that fits and maximizes its value (for yourself) and learn hotkeys.

[Spartan_Marine88]

and don't get discouraged, things like doctrine changes can leave you feeling lost and confused all over again for about 10 games

[TheLastArmada]

i remember my first or second game, wind was on the axis side
he called out 2 tigers, i was like ahh game over man

[Jodomar]

It took constant yelling at my failing from lionel, untill i finally figured out how to play. I would say atleast half of the game if not more goes into a good company set up and knowing what to call out when. Also not having idle units making sure you are using everything you have. For instance you might have an mg in a building not doing anything but your team mate is getting hit hard with infantry. You would then take that mg out of the building thats doing nothing and go help your team mate out with it. Small things like that can make a big difference. Mostly for me it was being yeld at untill one day the yelling stopped and a better player emerged. I still do get steam rolled from time to time that you just can't avoid and it happens.

[Artekas]

There's not a set timeline in which you improve in any game. You won't start getting better after x amount of time has passed. You have to actively try and improve. Save a replay+battlefile of every game and watch it, and analyze yourself. What did you do wrong? Maybe your micro was off there, or maybe that unit died pointlessly when you could have kept him alive and earned his cost back. Or perhaps you called in something you shouldn't have. Keep these things in mind and make sure they don't happen next time. Keep doing this for a while, and make sure that you're actually using what you learned from the mistakes replays.

[Spartan_Marine88]

There's not a set timeline in which you improve in any game. You won't start getting better after x amount of time has passed. You have to actively try and improve. Save a replay+battlefile of every game and watch it, and analyze yourself. What did you do wrong? Maybe your micro was off there, or maybe that unit died pointlessly when you could have kept him alive and earned his cost back. Or perhaps you called in something you shouldn't have. Keep these things in mind and make sure they don't happen next time. Keep doing this for a while, and make sure that you're actually using what you learned from the mistakes replays.

Actually yes, we have come to a concensus from alot of us on the forums thats its about 15 games in you start to know what your doing.

[Katusha]

the thing is its not like i've only played 20 games, or even 50 games, its well over 100, if not almost 200 (my launcher name is Katusha if you guys dont know)

what beats me everytime is how players position their units in a way that any attack i try to do ends up in me retreating or taking heavy losses

i agree about hotkeys, always wanted to learn them, never got to it

this mod is as unpredictable as it is fun,
sometimes you feel as tho your doing so well, then next game you get steamrolled
its all to do with stacking and trying to play games with people of simillar skill lvls

try to avoid playing against high lvl players if your only lvl 5-6
stick to games with people of a similar lvl or skill range

i feel like 70% of the games i see are stacks

also allies being OP might have something to do with it  

[salan]

I'm just wondering about how long it took people to start doing better in this mod. Considering I had barely any vCOH experience (like 10 games.. 15 at most), and I joined this mod i believe in July of this year, I feel like at first I improved, and then I stalled out at my current mediocre level, just below average player. I can't even keep a 1.0 W/L ratio still, its more like .6-.8.

I have been playing this game for almost 3 years? (come april) and in almost all my companies I run a low win loss ratio for the first half of playing with them.  It takes me forever to FEEL the company.  To get to know it.  to build it to my style of play.   And, then again I generally play with anyone against anyone, which usually means i get stomped bad, even if I personally play well.  Right now my WM blitz company is 3 losses and 1 win for instance.  I don't expect to win MANY games atm.  Not till I achieve closer to end tier status, at which point the company has worked itself out enough that I can give more then I take in almost any situation.

In any game you play it takes time to be more then mediocre.  In any instrument you take up, any schooling you take... there is a curve to getting to the end, and owning those around you.   

I personally love your contributions on the forums, and I understand your frustration.

do you find any of these things contribute to you personally staying or leaving:

Losing more then winning and making LESS pp and xp then those winning?
are you having a hard time finding players you connect with and able to play with multiple times?

what would you say makes you the most frustrated in the mod?

[bbsmith]

15-20 Games sounds about right for someone to understand the core mechanics of the game,
but it takes far longer (Months) for someone develop their game sense. Sadly most people tend to quit before that happens though. You just have to remember everyone was bad at some point.

[Katusha]

Hey salan, first of all thanks for the comment. Yours and stumpster's shoutcasts are what got me into the mod (Groundfire you too   )

Yeah i know what you mean, my first company was airborne, and i started doing better once i purchased all doctrines and my company felt like my company and i knew exactly what to do with it

Erm, personally i dont care much about PP's but i care more about seeing at least a tiny amount of improvement in my skill.. which i havent in a while, sometimes i do well, sometimes i get trampled on

no i dont have NAT problems if thats what you mean, but yes lack of many players of my level is frustrating, its just noobs and pros, its like theres no middle class lol

most frustrated.. the very good players that insist on stomping noobs, or only playing with their buddies, for example i've always wanted a mentor of some kind to teach me some things, but the world is harsh

personally i love the mod, when i first started watching the shoutcasts, my impression was wow.. this is what i've been looking for, no resources, and more focus on tactics, i thought i might do better at that type of game <-- but that came to backfire on me when i realized nobody had to worry about resources, and there are just so many expert players here that its hard to enjoy very many games that you play

[TheLastArmada]

yes gimmicks and stacks ruin the overall feel for the game, but their is that glimmer of hope that sometimes you get a game with even temrs and a win from it is rather satasfactory

[bbsmith]

most frustrated.. the very good players that insist on stomping noobs, or only playing with their buddies, for example i've always wanted a mentor of some kind to teach me some things, but the world is harsh

We used to have a mentoring system. Perhaps we should think about reviving it again. Someone (Someone named Rusty with a big L) Mentored me when I started playing the Mod and it really helped out alot. A mentoring system would probably improve our retainment rates.

[Katusha]

yes gimmicks and stacks ruin the overall feel for the game, but their is that glimmer of hope that sometimes you get a game with even temrs and a win from it is rather satasfactory

yeah i thought the gameplay would be so EPIC, with actual flanking going on and stuff like that, but all i came to see are gimmicks

We used to have a mentoring system. Perhaps we should think about reviving it again. Someone (Someone named Rusty with a big L) Mentored me when I started playing the Mod and it really helped out alot. A mentoring system would probably improve our retainment rates.

yeah that would certainly help, but that would be a lot to ask from people. However even half an hour contributed to helping a player can have a huge morale boost.

for example, i remember AmPM and I played a game, and he guided me as to what I should target to help his units function best (i killed atgs for his KT and p4's), and we ended up winning and it was actually fun for me

[bbsmith]

Perhaps people who used to be mentors could start up again. The only people who I remembered being mentors were me, Smokaz, and Wind. Perhaps some sort of reward point incentive to people who participate.

[Katusha]

Perhaps people who used to be mentors could start up again. The only people who I remembered being mentors were me, Smokaz, and Wind. Perhaps some sort of reward point incentive to people who participate.

perhaps, perhaps 

i am nobody to say what should or should not be done though, i'll just say a mentoring system would be cool

[Illegal_Carrot]

yeah i thought the gameplay would be so EPIC, with actual flanking going on and stuff like that, but all i came to see are gimmicks

That's partly because doctrines just got completely reworked, so balance issues and the like are still present. It's also partly because that's how EiR is now. There used to be a lot more focus on tactics and micro, now it seems to be mostly about gimmicks and spam.

[Smokaz]

I'd say around 500 games to grasp the basics, between 1000-3000 to become a all-star master. Ha ha. Actually I have no idea what it would take to become good at the game at this point. It's so intutive everything now, can't even imagine what it is to not know. I'm pretty sure you can avoid 2999 games if you just learn incredibly fast.

Dont worry katusha about that game we played, I was just raging because it was a Stomp-Gone-Wrong. (Noo not my vet 2 panther and my vet 2 panzergren.. lol pathetic!)

Hilarious in retrospective

Like a lot of things in life you have to develop your own style. Some people do annoyance tactics. Some people try to outspam, outattrition or outmicro you.

The different factions don't fit everyone equally well. With PE I find a good mix of annoyance and spam is great. With wehr you can easily run annoyance/attrition. Lightning war can outspam allies easy with map control, rapid reinforcing etc. But generally wehr requires you to use mortars and mg's to maximise their losses and minimize your own.

With americans you can do everything. The sniper, the riflespam with grenades, the perfect use of your great AT combinations..  Outspam, annoy, attrition it's all open to them. Great artillery, good support weapons, flexible aggressive infantry.

Brits I'd say Ace officer micro and good amount of spam coupled with patience is the way to go. Brits can boost their infantry to obnoxious levels.

Now you might spit at these concepts and say "this is vague". But if im not going to write a 1000 page essay about it, that's what I feel like saying.

[panzerman]

u talking about the one that wind has gotten all angry about lol