57mm AP rounds

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[Unkn0wn]

Allies can also recrew a pak and use its camaflauge too in OMG

AFAIK We've gone over this in the past and decided against it from a design perspective.

If these AP rounds are tied to the ATG, would that not mean axis get to use AP rounds on captured allied ATGs as well?

[NightRain]

AFAIK We've gone over this in the past and decided against it from a design perspective.

If these AP rounds are tied to the ATG, would that not mean axis get to use AP rounds on captured allied ATGs as well?

YES!

[LeoPhone]

If these AP rounds are tied to the ATG, would that not mean axis get to use AP rounds on captured allied ATGs as well?

nah, there is a way to stop that from happening.

[panzerman]

but i want my stolen 57's to have ap rounds so i can make allies weap as all there tanks die extremley fast.

oh lol Luft would be epic...stolen 57's that cloak and have ap rounds!!!!

[NightRain]

but i want my stolen 57's to have ap rounds so i can make allies weap as all there tanks die extremley fast.

oh lol Luft would be epic...stolen 57's that cloak and have ap rounds!!!!

What are the cloak bonuses?

[brn4meplz]

Captured ATG's that cloak from the Luft selection have no ambush modifiers. But you are getting Cloaking Green cover, and if you jump on Pak40's or 17pdr's... ohhh god

[panzerman]

just sayin popping ap rounds 57 from a hidden position would be hella funn watching half the health of a sherman go in 2 shots lol.

but yeah so much you can do with luft in stealing allied stuff lol.

[WildZontar]

To be honest, I could really care less if the Axis had gotten ahold of some 57's with leftover AP rounds, I just want the chance to recrew those ATG that I lost, to be able to contain the AP rounds that they lost so quickly, otherwise, I want AP rounds to be cheaper   

[Vermillion_Hawk]

My opinion is it would be okay if only Allies could gain the benefits from recrewed Allied AT Guns, and vice versa. This would prevent Axis players gaining access to AP rounds, and seeing as AT Guns kill pretty much any Allied tank without them, I really don't know if they should have access to such a weapon.

[smurfORnot]

and seeing as AT Guns kill pretty much any Allied tank without them, I really don't know if they should have access to such a weapon.

did u see em against churchils?

[EliteGren]

57mm have less chance to penetrate the rear armor of a churchill than to penetrate the front of a tiger lulz

[nugnugx]

57mm have less chance to penetrate the rear armor of a churchill than to penetrate the front of a tiger lulz

buff tiger front armor 

[Spartan_Marine88]

57mm have less chance to penetrate the rear armor of a churchill than to penetrate the front of a tiger lulz

good less chance of a scatter round friendly firing a churchill

[smurfORnot]

buff tiger front armor 

buff whole tiger!

[WildZontar]

Tiger doesn't need a buff, it's fine as it is.

[Vermillion_Hawk]

Let me rephrase that: AT Guns can kill pretty much any non-doctrinal Allied tank fairly quickly without armor piercing shells, in comparison to the speed at which Allied AT Guns kill Axis tanks without armor piercing shells.

And if they buff the whole Tiger, Pershing needs King Tiger Armor and 33% penetration increase.

[AmPM]

Let me rephrase that: AT Guns can kill pretty much any non-doctrinal Allied tank fairly quickly without armor piercing shells, in comparison to the speed at which Allied AT Guns kill Axis tanks without armor piercing shells.

And if they buff the whole Tiger, Pershing needs King Tiger Armor and 33% penetration increase.

Let us then compare similar tanks

57mm vs P4 = 4 shots penetrating

PaK vs Sherman = 5 shots penetrating

The 57mm works fine vs anything upto a Panther without even having to worry about AP rounds or rear shots.

57mm w/ AP vs Panther = 4 shots to kill

Wait, what?!

PaK vs Churchill = 6-7 shots

PaK vs Jumbo = dont even try from the front

Stop comparing the 57 vs KT/Tiger to PaK vs Sherman. Compare similar tanks vs the ATGs and you find out that they are practically the same.

[Vermillion_Hawk]

I said without AP shells, and I was talking about non-doctrinal tanks, so the best non-doctrinal the Allies have to offer (Sherman, Cromwell) versus the best non-doctrinal the Axis has to offer (Panther, and... Panther), and it's obvious which one is better versus AT Guns (yet again, non-armour piercing, in case you missed it the first time, like you evidently did in my first post).

[AmPM]

57mm still goes through a Panther pretty easy....

It's not like it's a tough tank, it only has 107 more HP than a Sherman.

Let us assume worst possible scenario for shooting a Panther (which costs much more than a Sherman and cannot deal effectively with infantry)

Long range .85 pen modifier.

Panther target table .35

29.75% chance to Pen without AP rounds, however, a bounced shot still does 75 damage (12.5 damage less than a penetrating Sherman or P4)

The Panther has a mighty 742 HP. So 10 bounced shots to kill it. Lets round up to make up the difference between medium and long range assuming it wants to try and circle your ATG instead of just being a target. So a flat 30%, every 3rd shot or so Pen's.

After 3 shots the Panther is at half health. Not bad for 5 pop, 110mu and 380 or whatever MP.

Add in a second one, you still have less pop of AT on field than the Axis player. Dead Panther.

And don't even start crying about how you have to have multiple pieces of primary AT on field, Axis has to do the same thing with more expensive stuff that is, in the best case, only slightly better.

WITH AP rounds, it gets retarded, 1 ATG can nearly 3 shot a Panther.

[Vermillion_Hawk]

You're only examining one side of the argument here. In the same 3 shots that would bring a Panther to 50% health, a Sherman would be at 33% health or less. Besides, I'm not complaining about this, I'm simply saying it's the way Company of Heroes was made. Axis armor has better health and armor than Allied tanks, but they have their drawbacks as well. The game works like that.