[US] Rangers - Need some love?

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[Unkn0wn]

The difference in platform plays a large role here. That being said though, they'll likely be undergoing a price revision.

[TheIcelandicManiac]

Something smells rotten in Denmark here.

I think you are in Christiania 

well if they are gonna get a price reduction will it be a major reduction or just a minor one?

[Mysthalin]

Say what you will, but paying 22.5 mu per sten while 45 mu per thompson is by no means warranted by the rather marginal superiority of rangers over commandos.

[Unkn0wn]

Well you could argue either that smgs are too expensive or stens are too cheap
Or both.

[Mysthalin]

Considering how much pain we've gone through setting the current sten price while ignoring the thompson completely... What do you yourself think is more likely?

[TheIcelandicManiac]

I say make the tomsons cheaper.
The times i beat a ranger squad with tomsons with my storms and 4 mp44s it just makes the tomson unappealing.
i can even beat 2 commando squad with 4 mp44s and they have stens if i have blitz on.

[cloud234]

Edit: I believe this to be correct. Correct me if I'm wrong. MP40 really has a good Medium range DPS amazingly. Contribution due to longer burst time, shorter cool down period, higher accuracy at mid range and more bursts before reload.

Thompsons SMGs are too expensive. I just did the DPS with LeoPhone's DPS thread. Heres a comparison of SMGs & ARs...

# mp40_smg.rgd
  | Zaxis S DPS = 15.13
  | Zaxis M DPS = 6.55
  | Zaxis L DPS = 1.19

# mp44_assault_rifle.rgd
  | Zaxis S DPS = 19.43
  | Zaxis M DPS = 3.91
  | Zaxis L DPS = 1.02

# m1_thompson_smg.rgd
  | Zaxis S DPS = 16.27
  | Zaxis M DPS = 2.81
  | Zaxis L DPS = 1.11

# cw_sten_smg.rgd
  | Zaxis S DPS = 18.97
  | Zaxis M DPS = 2.85
  | Zaxis L DPS = 1.07

So you're telling me you're paying 180 munitions for 4 Thompsons when you can get 6 Stens at 135 Munitions? Higher DPS, better platform etc.

Also, this makes MP40 the indisputable poor man's champion against thompsons at 60 munitions for 5 MP40s... thats dirt ass cheap. Just to be fair...

Thompsons Medium range is 17, MP40s Medium range is 15. Though I don't see how anyone can magically discern 2 coh metres...

There are some differences in "Target Tables" notably being Infantry Elite & Infantry Heroic where Thompson performs better than Stens by 66% and 28% better

respectively according to the percentage change value calculation.

However, Sten makes up for it by being superiorly cheaper... and having 50% more stens (6 vs 4) than thompsons when purchased.

[cloud234]

Also..

Commandos > Rangers

Smoke disables assault (surprise surprise for those who don't know) and allows u to run up invisible and rape the the hard counters.

[BigDick]

actually thats a thing i would agree on

the thomson could need price decrease and the stens could need a price increase

same to piats on commandos

they should be more like 160mun not 130mun

[DarkSoldierX]

You need to calculate DPS vs armour types for a better understanding.

Tompsons is -25% damage vs all armours exept sniper
Sten has MASSIVE decreases all round, with the largest decrease being vs soldier armour with -25% acc and -50% damage.
Mp44 has No decreases at all, it performs same vs all armours

That being said I still believe tompsons are overpriced.

[cloud234]

There are some differences in "Target Tables" notably being Infantry Elite & Infantry Heroic where Thompson performs better than Stens by 66% and 28% better

That is the only difference.

Most automatic weapons (mp40s, stens, thompsons, STG44) has a 0.75 modifier to damage. The nerf to soldier armour type is useless because the only inf_soldier armour is Falls which is only 1 doctrine where as majority of the players are using inf armour.

Sten does not have massive decreases all around. Mp44 HAS decreases. Where are you getting ur stats from?!?!?

[BigDick]

You need to calculate DPS vs armour types for a better understanding.

Tompsons is -25% damage vs all armours exept sniper
Sten has MASSIVE decreases all round, with the largest decrease being vs soldier armour with -25% acc and -50% damage.

and where is the difference in performance between thomsons and sten than? did you missed the point that pe has infantry armor now and not soldier armor?

stens are way to cheap and thomson a bit to expensive

[RikiRude]

could you guys throw grease gun dps on there as well?

im just curious how it stacks up.


because of thompson price and first aid not working as well as intended. i dropped rangers from my infantry company with in three games.

[cloud234]

So... how about a price change to thompsons in the interim? Bazookas as well perhaps?

[RikiRude]

I think most people can agree zooks are priced pretty good for rangers.

Shouldn't zooks for rifles be like 45 instead of 55? I mean if 2x zooks on rangers is 80, then 1 zook should be 40, plus it's on a worse platform.

[PonySlaystation]

no, faust is 50.

[RoyalHants]

no, faust is 50.

But deosent it almost garaunntee a hit once fired? and penetrate

[Unkn0wn]

Bazookas used to be around 50 Mun, we had to increase their price.
That being said, when the upgrade pool system comes into play, we will be able to better balance upgrades such as the bazooka and the panzerfaust. (Allowing them to be cheaper while still preventing them from getting spammed)

[RikiRude]

Bazookas used to be around 50 Mun, we had to increase their price.
That being said, when the upgrade pool system comes into play, we will be able to better balance upgrades such as the bazooka and the panzerfaust. (Allowing them to be cheaper while still preventing them from getting spammed)

oooooh! sounds interesting.

[Heartmann]

Okey sorry if what im typing now has been pointed out, but there was so many posts and so much text at times that i could not be bothered.

I agree rangers need love  (Holy crap i buffing allies what am i doing!!!)

anyway im running a inf coy, and rangers need love, the 180 mu for a CQB weapon is not worth it sorry, today's EiR imo anyway is won in the long to med range weapons, or those units that can take enough hits and get upp close fast enough like (cloak fjs or Oak leave KCH) The smg rangers just fall to pecies against any PE player that uses G43, combined with a suppression platform, its just that simple. Slow hampers fire upp, and the suppression platform be it scout cars or Iht will eventually suppress them again and then its bye bye rangers. The 180 mu does simple not have a place imo in the current game play sorry.

The zooks, well they are ok, if used like ab, they hit hard when then punch though, the only problem is that they miss to many times, the scatter is to big, and there ability to hit any form of small midgets or tiny bushes that are in the way is to great.
They simply need a tweak imo for the better.

this is also cause i consider them loosing guys to easy to long range fire, and they become in my mind to much of a hit and run unit than the rangers that are suppose to lead the way.

ALTHOUGH!

WHEN one gets the final docs and jumbo support the inf coys rape, with the extra acc and dmg, gives them that extra little edge to become in my mind good.

But i wonder if that is what it should be like, that one doc, (ofc again this is entirely my opinion and knowledge of using a TR focus inf coy) but it still feels that one is in need of this extra nudge to be able to compete with the current buffs that certain axis docs have.