Fallschrimjaegers: A comparison of Elite Infantries

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[UndeathWrath]

They could use a buff. They are arguably the weakest elite infantry in the game.

For quick comparison:

Fallschirmjaegers - 250mp, 5pop
4 men
60hp per man
240hp per squad
Soldier Armor (armor upgrade from standard infantry) (-25% received accuracy and dmg from standard weapons like garands, bar rifles, hmgs. 0 or little effect vs enemy elite infantry weapons like tompsons and carbines.)

Airborne - 280mp, 6pop
6 men
70hp per man
420hp per squad
Airborne Armor (flat -25% received dmg from most weapons and -25% received accuracy while moving from all weapons)

Rangers - 310mp, 6pop
6 men
65hp per man
390hp per squad
Elite Armor (2nd best armor in the game. flat -25% received dmg and accuracy from all weapons except flamethrowers)

Stormtroopers - 300mp, 5pop
4 men
95hp per man
380hp per squad
Infantry Armor (Standard armor most inf have like volks, grens, rifles. No modifiers)

Commandos - 280mp, 6pop
6 men
65hp per man
390hp per squad
Soldier Armor

Assault Engineers - 240mp, 80mu, 5pop (come with shotguns)
4 men
55hp per man
220hp per squad
Elite Armor

So as you can see for yourself at a glance, they are quite fragile with a paltry 240hp per squad. Volks have 300hp per squad...

The T3 Scout training that gives them a total of 75hp per man and airborne armor is what they should at least start with. Hell without fg42s they are grens with 80 less hp and 10 more mp cost and a doctrinal unlock with slightly better armor.

Airborne have nearly double the hp of fallschirmjaegers on top of better armor. They only cost 30mp more and are furthermore more survivable in general with 2 extra men (from tank shots, sniper shots, artillery, grenades, any area of effect weapons, etc.)

[hans]

can u also add the max amount of damage they do?

btw how compare 4 man squad with 6 man ones?? no!
the 60hp per man compared to other elite inf is fair enough

[NightRain]

Tommies have Soldier armor, not Infantry Armor.

[UndeathWrath]

can u also add the max amount of damage they do?

btw how compare 4 man squad with 6 man ones?? no!
the 60hp per man compared to other elite inf is fair enough

I will add dmg values tomorrow if I have a chance.

I'm not sure what you mean...a 6man squad with 65hp per man and elite armor is way more survivable/effective than a 4 man squad with 60hp per man and soldier armor

Tommies have Soldier armor, not Infantry Armor.

Corrected.

[Demon767]

Where to start, lol

[Scotzmen]

Falls have access to FG-42s. Rape at all ranges. If i could get them on my allies, i would. I'd prefer them over stens or thompsons tbh

[hans]

uh btw add unit price and population + pool values just for a good comparison

PS: the rangers look good in this comparison. Oh btw add assault engineers?

[Demon767]

you also have to take into account faction + doctrines and units available through the doctrines, then compare it to the elite infantry of other factions + their doctrines that come with it.

quite frankly, calling for a buff for fallschirmjagers baffles me. you're gonna have to provide so much more information then "Oh falls have less hp....." thats not good enough to convince us of your point.

[UndeathWrath]

Falls have access to FG-42s. Rape at all ranges. If i could get them on my allies, i would. I'd prefer them over stens or thompsons tbh

I believe that fg42s have the highest damage in close range, but the problem is they are so fragile they will drop 1/4th of their firepower everytime one man dies and can be killed quickly.

fg42s are priced accordingly extremely expensive at 120munitions. The problem is their platform is complete weaksauce. They are more expensive than KCH mp44s.

uh btw add unit price and population + pool values just for a good comparison

PS: the rangers look good in this comparison. Oh btw add assault engineers?

that's why people have been spamming rangers. They're the most efficient and effective elite infantry atm.

[UndeathWrath]

you also have to take into account faction + doctrines and units available through the doctrines, then compare it to the elite infantry of other factions + their doctrines that come with it.

quite frankly, calling for a buff for fallschirmjagers baffles me. you're gonna have to provide so much more information then "Oh falls have less hp....." thats not good enough to convince us of your point.

My point is that all elite infantry start out solid and have doctrine options that buff them. You can look at the doctrines for yourself. Tons of buffs for rangers.

The difference is fallschirmjaegers start off weak and become solid only if you get the bottom T3 that buffs them, and that's their only direct stat buff in the doctrine.

[Demon767]

I disagree on that point. Fallscrimjagers are fantastic when used with Fg42 and ambushing. You dont need any buffs to make this unit anymore better. Its a defensive unit and can only be used in such a fashion or it will be destroyed.

[UndeathWrath]

I disagree on that point. Fallscrimjagers are fantastic when used with Fg42 and ambushing. You dont need any buffs to make this unit anymore better. Its a defensive unit and can only be used in such a fashion or it will be destroyed.

hmm I always thought of fallschirmjaegers as assault infantry. I still stick to my opinion that they could use a slight buff, at the very least having airborne armor so they can attack/pull back without suffering heavy losses.

Assault Engineers added. In perspective with these, the engineers do the most damage at short range and have much better armor whilst being considerably cheaper.

Of course every elite infantry has it's own role, yet paradropped infantry is meant to be mobile and thus I feel falls deserve airborne armor. They should not be constrained to camping

[hans]

i have the feeling as if its like oh shit volksgrens have only 300hp and are so weak. lets give them 100 hp and yeah they should be okay then.

but doc buffs are important, unit price pool usw. u cant just say, look they have less hp lets give them more or different armour whatever. U have to take a look at the whole situation.

+ i just remember how fucking strong fg42 falls are if u use them right. for sure as an assault unit they are too weak but use them for the situations they are made for and not put them in different roles!

falls arent used like rangers as an example...  

[hans]

isnt there a doc buff that gives falls airborne armour?

[I2ay]

If anything nerf the price of fausts on Falls. With the new pool you can axe all the Pgrens in a luft company and stick in falls with 30 munition fausts. (volks pay 40 munitions for fausts) Why do falls have cheaper fausts anyway...?

[Demon767]

Vet + ambush also increase the damage of fausts too right?

including the falls tankbuster + faust alpha strike lol.

Falls can build cover through doctrine annnndddd, falls aint a mobile unit as we can see with the FG42 bad acc on the move, sitting in cover camo.. and ... low hp XD

but anyways ill be reading your posts with intrigue to see what more points you bring up.

*tips tophat*

[UndeathWrath]

i have the feeling as if its like oh shit volksgrens have only 300hp and are so weak. lets give them 100 hp and yeah they should be okay then.

but doc buffs are important, unit price pool usw. u cant just say, look they have less hp lets give them more or different armour whatever. U have to take a look at the whole situation.

+ i just remember how fucking strong fg42 falls are if u use them right. for sure as an assault unit they are too weak but use them for the situations they are made for and not put them in different roles!

falls arent used like rangers as an example...  

I just made a comparison with what I could quickly access. I'll add the pop too.

This is the whole point, the fallschrimjaegers are not equipped to do their role effectively without airborne armor. Paradropped troops are used for their mobility!

PS: If I want something to camp there and defend, I'll just drop a flakvierling and make Ray QQ. =p

Vet + ambush also increase the damage of fausts too right?

including the falls tankbuster + faust alpha strike lol.

Falls can build cover through doctrine annnndddd, falls aint a mobile unit as we can see with the FG42 bad acc on the move, sitting in cover camo.. and ... low hp XD

but anyways ill be reading your posts with intrigue to see what more points you bring up.

*tips tophat*

Well the tankbusters are a wholeee 'nother story, and perhaps OP with the top t4 lol. Ambush only increases accuracy and that's with the top tier 4.

Ah I did not notice that .5 moving accuracy modifier, thanks for pointing that out.

I suppose one of the problems many things boil down to is that the unit base price is based on the upgrades it can get. For example 250mp for a paradropped gren squad with 80 less hp lol. Of course you get em for the fg42s mostly, but I always drop them in pairs for double fausts and sometimes only one can get the fg42.

[hans]

This is the whole point, the fallschrimjaegers are not equipped to do their role effectively without airborne armor. Paradropped troops are used for their mobility!

PS: If I want something to camp there and defend, I'll just drop a flakvierling and make Ray QQ. =p

as demon already mentioned, fg42 falls arent made for the mobility u are talking about. they are made for ambushing coz they lose acc while moving AND get ambush boni + cloak in ambush. they dont need better armour for their usage, do they?

[I2ay]

If you only paradrop units for their mobility then why can you paradrop MGs, AT guns, and Mortars? Your statement makes no sense. If anything you paradrop them so they don't have to move much further...

[UndeathWrath]

as demon already mentioned, fg42 falls arent made for the mobility u are talking about. they are made for ambushing coz they lose acc while moving AND get ambush boni + cloak in ambush. they dont need better armour for their usage, do they?

AFAIK they don't get any bonus out of ambush without the top t4 unlock.

Also, if they were given airborne armor, they would remain exactly the same when standing still and fighting/ambushing. It would just grant them -25% received accuracy while on the move and give them more flexibility/survivability out of the box.

I'm off to bed guys, we'll continue this tomorrow. Goodnight

If you only paradrop units for their mobility then why can you paradrop MGs, AT guns, and Mortars? Your statement makes no sense. If anything you paradrop them so they don't have to move much further...

Don't they have fire-up? Is that not mobility to you? Being able to sprint to or away from enemies and redeploy on the fly.

You could reinforce close to your front lines, or you could drop behind enemy lines for a hammer and anvil strike or a flank.