[CW] Bofors 40mm

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[nikomas]

I would like to see hold fire on the bofors and 88 tho.  So that way peopel can get close enough before you begin to unload on them. 

I see you dont understand the Bofors... It's accuarcy gets worse at medium range and is utter crap at short.

[Poppi]

or mortar.. or sniper or 1 tank flank lol

so combine that with long reload times allowing infantry to run right up to it, bc it can hit units up close.... i see it far from OP.

[3rdCondor]

The bofors does too good of a job killing units that run right up to it and stop. It needs to be nerfed so that it actually heals the enemy units around it.

This post seems less ridiculous that some of the others that I'm reading.

[Mysthalin]

bofors it its deadly strong and much similar to an 88.

*complete mental shutdown*

[XIIcorps]

The bofors does too good of a job killing units that run right up to it and stop. It needs to be nerfed so that it actually heals the enemy units around it.

This post seems less ridiculous that some of the others that I'm reading.

indeed, the only way the bofors is effective is if theirs 3 at one time in the same spot staggered.
thats 15 pop on units that really only accel at anti LV duties.

[PonySlaystation]

I see you dont understand the Bofors... It's accuarcy gets worse at medium range and is utter crap at short.

But aside from mortar smoke, is there any way to get close to it with infantry before getting shredded by it?

indeed, the only way the bofors is effective is if theirs 3 at one time in the same spot staggered.
thats 15 pop on units that really only accel at anti LV duties.

You only need one as long as you support it well and they're not 5 pop.

[puddin]

yes, the bofors is just like an 88.  But you can move a bofors, and not an 88. 

On top of it, it heals when its moved....  Completly, so if you don;t kill it, your wasting tiem against infintie heals. 

On top of that its area denial, just like an 88.  No Lv or Inf go close to it, unless its En mass... and even then it takes all your units on one unit.  Risking arty, or a complete failure, a half dead bofors and you runnign for your life. 

It can get ridiculous if they have the pop cap advantage, your pretty well screwed.

[XIIcorps]

considering the bofors is out ranged by any atg, vulnerable to arty, storm schrecks can alpha it, smoke and flamers destroy it......
i can go on.

its far from OP

[Smokaz]

the whole leave emplacement thing is bugged to fuck, they gain way too much health from being recrewed. it would be better if they could just fire normally while being repaired as a base ability.

also bofors round needs to be able to target and travel through vickers nests

[RikiRude]

maybe use the bofors and come back to us?

atg + something giving sight = dead bofors in about 3 shots.

maybe you shouldn't be sending things that it can kill to kill it?  

[PonySlaystation]

Those counters only work if the bofors is unsupported. An atg takes about 10 shots to kill a bofors during which time it will be exposed and it's the same thing with a mortar because it takes so many shots to kill it. Stormtroopers schrecks will also be exposed, not to mention that 2x Stromtroopers is 600 MU and 10 pop to counter a 60 MU unit 4 pop unit, if there are two bofors, you wouldn't get out alive, if there is one bofors with support you wouldn't get out alive either. Smoke and flamers don't work well because pioneers are too fragile. Wehrmacht barely has any on-map artillery and you're not gonna be able to kill it with a nebel.

My point is, there is no easy counter. I never said that it's overpowered, I said that it's too cost effective at 60 MU and that the usage of immobile emplacements is counterproductive to the gameplay of EIR.

[puddin]

ITS AMAZING how you all come up with all of these great counters...  hel;; why not use a friggin KT while your at it to. 

Next time i say storm shrecks alpha striking a m8 which is onlyy 80 fuel, No complaints about storm shrecks. 

hell i suggested an increase of 1 pop.  Its no OP, never claimed it was...

Oh wait, look for the quote, lookk... still looking?  Still yet?  Not findinf it?  Oh shit thats right because its a simple 1 pop fix. 

What in this mod is 4 pop cap?  Not much....

[XIIcorps]

all of the CW emplacements are incredibly vulnerable while settingup/ also their infantry units that deploy them auto retreat after loosing 1 or 2 squad members iirc.

They are far from being OP, if their chewing you up at range close in as stated countless times.

Goliaths and smoke tend to counter everything, give that a try aye.

[PonySlaystation]

The Goliath is a different balance issue and you shouldn't need to bring specialized units to counter a unit like this.

[XIIcorps]

The Goliath is a different balance issue and you shouldn't need to bring specialized units to counter a unit like this.

Care to elaborate how the bofors isnt a specialised unit ?
its a T1 unlock the goliath is not. the bofors only really excels at LV duties at range

[Mysthalin]

Quick question, Puddin, Pony - do you even know what the two pretty little letters "OP" mean?

If you are aware that they mean "Overpowered", and are repeatedly stating that the Bofors is anything but - then why the hell are you even proposing nerfing the unit? If you are in fact under the impression the bofors is too powerful (for it's cost) then try and prove it with actual fact rather than reminiscing (Puddin) how you couldn't counter 2 bofors nests on the Dike a month ago.

I think I can dig out the replay, and anyone watching it will agree that it was your horrible play that killed you and your boring company, not the bofors being overtly strong.

The facts remain that the bofors is not an efficient infantry killer, and becomes less and less efficient as units get close to it. PE AT grenades take it out in 3 hits (afaik). Bundle nades do much the same, and there's plenty of other relatively cheap counters to the bofors - not least of which is simply hitting it with an AT gun or two. It's not like it's going to run away anytime soon, what with the 30 second tear-apart timer, during which the bofors becomes completely defenceless.

Yes, it's fairly good against light vehicles - but that's pretty much as far as the unit goes in terms of what it can kill. It can kill fast, lightly armoured vehicles most axis players do not even use at a range of up to 40 metres. While being immobile. Paying 295 Manpower and 60 Munitions (the manpower is easily the more important cost to be looking at. RSE rarely suffers from a lack of muni while manpower can be a pain) for this fairly one-dimensional task of warding off light vehicles in a small radius is, IMO, perfectly fine.

[tank130]

Let's refrain from the personal attacks please gents.

Keep it on track or you will be removed from the balance forums.

[RikiRude]

I just don't get how players that I find are quite skilled cant deal with something that I have no problem fighting? like i said post a replay of these things being an issue.

in fact ill do you a favor, next time i play axis and bofors are a threat ill post a replay of me beating them.

in fact if you watch the replay in the bug file i posted about pak 40s i think you see me easily take out 2x bofors?

and one last thing. if you compare the bofors to the 88, why dont you treat it like one? avoid it!

[puddin]

God.... Where have i ever said its OVERPOWERED.  YOU DON:T READ. 

Neither of us say it is.  It needs a slight tweak. 

Just like the GMC nneded tweak to be  brought in line. and not much more then a minor tweak to make the game flow better.

FFS.  Pay attention. 

Read the Forum its called a discussion, one of which i agree with.  he also said that 60 munitions is increadably cheap. 

I would say the Flack verling, Which is MUCH WEAKER, Can Not Re set up or move, And can be sniped out is a much more vulberable and useless Stationary Object, and its priced the exact same and a TEIR 3. 

So is the bofors to Powerful for 4 pop and 60 munitions yes.  Why,  here Mystalin, this one is for you....
because its direct counter part the flackverling can not penetrate M8s or any light vehicles reliably, and does not shred infantry as hard, and can not be moved.  yet its price is identical.  And not sure about flackverlings pop i think is 5...  Maybe its 4.  But thats a 4 pop unit for 60 munitions....  Cheap. Cheap and made from walmart.

[TheWindCriesMary]

So is the bofors to Powerful for 4 pop and 60 munitions yes.  Why,  here Mystalin, this one is for you....
because its direct counter part the flackverling can not penetrate M8s or any light vehicles reliably, and does not shred infantry as hard, and can not be moved.  yet its price is identical.  And not sure about flackverlings pop i think is 5...  Maybe its 4.  But thats a 4 pop unit for 60 munitions....  Cheap. Cheap and made from walmart.

Flakverling is direct counter to Bofors?

...an, er, interesting strategy.

Edit: Riki explained this to me (counterpart not direct counter). Still a funny image though