[PE] FJs

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[nikomas]

Bwhahahaha, Oh man, I checked again... our FJ's are even more gimped than I remember.

Recloak Timer between shots.
Vcoh - 1 second * 1.25 per shot in rapid succession/active combat, max 10 seconds
EiRR - 10 seconds * 1.25 per shot in rapid succession/active combat, max 10 seconds (LOL)

First Strike (Ambush Bonus)
Vcoh - +25% Damage and accuracy, an additional 25% of both on a second ability for over a total of 50% extra acc and damage
EiRR - Only 25% of both.

And in Vcoh they would recloak in combat for several ambush shots per fight until the timer stacked up...


Oh my god they have been nerfed so hard and nobody could really tell exactly why cause of the camoflauge extensions, LAMO

[Hicks58]

I'm wondering when that happened. It wasn't a product of my time, or hell, even PQ's or Skaffa's if I recall.

[tank130]

Better ambush? Sit in cover and wait? Laaaaaame, boring imo.............

You mean like storms cloak at vet one? The only use of cloak for storms now is to sit behind cover and hope someone drives by. Meanwhile your teammates are raging cuz your units are sitting there doing nothing.

[nikomas]

I'm wondering when that happened. It wasn't a product of my time, or hell, even PQ's or Skaffa's if I recall.

So do I tbh, it was musta been before I even started playing (So before 2011)

[Hicks58]

There's a fair possibility it happened with the introduction of EiRR, as a preventative measure that has not been unnoticed, but rather uncared for.

After all, when pool was prevalent nobody cared for unupgraded FJ's, it's only with the release on pool have they become a viable option.

[TheWindCriesMary]

I've been trying all upgraded and upgraded for the past week trying to get them to work. Something seemed terribly off because they just weren't viable both when I was using them or when I saw other guys try to use them (elitegren, Katusha etc).


And it's not just unupgraded FJs that are the problem, it's all FJ's. But yeah the problem is definitely more prevalent with unupgraded ones.

Good to see the flag wave didn't go unanswered. Let it never be said the balance forum can't lead to some good... though it was a lot of work to quash the

[jackmccrack]

I think there's a better way of strengthening Falls, without increasing their squad size. A few folks have mentioned tweaking the ambush technique. I think that's a good idea.

[Katusha]

A few things:

1) We should try having the old ambush back, as nikomas described how much it was nerfed. Good step to making vanilla k98s better, also other weapons. Would increase survivability vs inf. Tanks still a problem

2) Please for the love of god make cloak a toggle ability so it's not a pain in the ass to cap or hold a sector when you need to.

3) I like the idea of smokaz of having a toggle ability for ambush that's really strong on a cooldown. Think of something like a "Concentrated fire" ability which decreases cooldown and reload by a lot for maybe 10-20s, allowing for possible "POOF rifles gone" situations with good micro. This could be followed by a 20-30s period of cooldown and reload penalties like they just "ran out of ammo" from concentrating fire.

4) I also agree with wind because any of these buffs won't be really good without survivability. The trick here is not overbuffing killing power AND survivability together. It is hard to find a middle ground. I would still be against adding an extra man because this adds too much survivability vs tanks. Maybe add +5 hp per man? Or decrease mortar bonuses vs fsj.

[nikomas]

Here is the thing some of you are missing thou, the "Combat Qucik-Cloak" does increase survivability because the falls cloak so fast in the start of an engagement that they'll break up enemy fire, bursts specifically. The enemy has to retarget them every time they shoot and they gain a brief window where they are not visible to the enemy due to the recloak, this does in fact increase survivability.

With such a quick cloak by the way the FJTB's become more potent, because the tank literally only has a 1 second window to shoot the FJ after he fires his shreck before he goes back to cloak, it's pretty much the speed of sniper cloak on his first shot.

[ick312]

Here is the thing some of you are missing thou, the "Combat Qucik-Cloak" does increase survivability because the falls cloak so fast in the start of an engagement that they'll break up enemy fire, bursts specifically. The enemy has to retarget them every time they shoot and they gain a brief window where they are not visible to the enemy due to the recloak, this does in fact increase survivability.

With such a quick cloak by the way the FJTB's become more potent, because the tank literally only has a 1 second window to shoot the FJ after he fires his shreck before he goes back to cloak, it's pretty much the speed of sniper cloak on his first shot.

playing top t4 - i cant confirm that.

ALSO the Vet modifier is a problem for them

[nikomas]

playing top t4 - i cant confirm that.

ALSO the Vet modifier is a problem for them

Top tier 4 isnt remotly similar to what vcoh fallscloak was, so it's irellevant to what I'm suggesting.

[EliteGren]

I'm wondering when that happened. It wasn't a product of my time, or hell, even PQ's or Skaffa's if I recall.

It happened during the salan times, early to mid 2009

I do agree their ambush could be reverted, just like the PE soldier armor with less hp. But one can dream

[Heartmann]

I remember Two complaining that they where op

[Hicks58]

Heh, Two... I'm pretty sure I've inherited his modifiers.

Bastard.

[GrayWolf]

How to buff FJs :

- nerf received suppression (They get pinned in 0,5 sec... FASTER than Panzer Grenediers.)
- AB armor without unlock (Ab armor unlock goes for luftwaffle infantry).
- Cause there's 4 of them, not 6, give them 0.8 received damage or sth.
- You can also buff vanilla rifles, cause they are shitty as fuck :/

[XIIcorps]

How to buff FJs :

- nerf received suppression (They get pinned in 0,5 sec... FASTER than Panzer Grenediers.)
- AB armor without unlock (Ab armor unlock goes for luftwaffle infantry).
- Cause there's 4 of them, not 6, give them 0.8 received damage or sth.
- You can also buff vanilla rifles, cause they are shitty as fuck :/

they do not need buffing, in a 3v3 i just played they were fine.
they are specialist inf and when used like a scapel can cut more deadly then the broadest of swords.

Vanilla maybe they suck, but hey Vanilla mandos are better then Stens in the current meta.

[GrayWolf]

they do not need buffing, in a 3v3 i just played they were fine.
they are specialist inf and when used like a scapel can cut more deadly then the broadest of swords.

Vanilla maybe they suck, but hey Vanilla mandos are better then Stens in the current meta.

Play not one, but 10 matches with them.

[PonySlaystation]

They are deadly assault infantry, with FG42 they have a pretty high DPS. There are three issues:

1: They are complete junk without them. Running any other upgrade without the FG42 is useless, also requiring a T3 unlock to get some of those extra weapons is ridiculous.
2: They get suppressed very quickly. Faster than other infantry.
3: The ambush bonus from attacking out of cloak are pretty weak. So no one uses them as a defensive unit.

[Mysthalin]

Fallschirmjagers will be receiving certain buffs in the upcoming patch.

Their rifles are going to be upgraded to grenadier rifles as a base, and they will also feature a reworked cloak (more like vCoH cloak, but not nearly as extreme).

Them being suppressed faster than anyone else is a myth, however. They have the same suppression tresh-holds as any other infantry in the game.

[XIIcorps]

Their ambush bonus is actually extremely powerful, even at med range.