SCAR Controlled Map Events

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[Unkn0wn]

Now that our mapping community has expanded to impressive proportions and with us mappers being on the lookout for new creative features to implement in upcoming maps, I would like to progress into a more advanced area of mapping, namely map based SCAR coding.
I believe using SCAR could truly make for some interesting & unique experiences on our maps, wether it is providing random artillery fire & flare drops or airplanes passing overhead and whatnot, there's a whole variety of things that could be implemented to achieve a more 'campaign' like feeling.

Having these kind of events occur would have a positive impact on the map atmosphere, instead of fighting in an isolated town, a lot more would be happening around the users, even things they have little or no control over, just like in singleplayer.... and as we all know CoH has one of the most intense RTS singleplayer experiences to date. The tricky part is carrying some of this over into a multiplmayer environment.

The goal here would be to make the user feel as if he's truly partaking in a war, as if his battle is only a part of something much bigger.

Some thoughts:
- Random airplanes flying over, possibly even a random airplane crashing.
- Random flares during nighttime settings
- Awarding the players with an off-map artillery call in when achieving a certain objective
- Objective based maps (=/= OCP, Convoy/Ambush/etc like gameplay -> This should be discussed in a different thread as this is a whole different gamemode)

If anyone has experience with SCAR and would be willing to contribute and investigate feasability on some of our ideas, please don't hesitate .
As for everyone else, post all your ideas!

[salan]

anything that actually effects the game play of the game should be very conservative in its nature.   There are reasons the doctrines balance our abilities the way they do, as well as our TAV and what not controlling what we actually have on the field.

breaking those boundries will probably turn more people away from the map rather then to it.   But anything that adds atmosphere without giving extra to a side will probably be a great bonus!

[anthony210]

Flares and airplanes crashing, maybe even random bomb or arty shell dropping would be ok.  Anything that gives one side the edge would be bad and imo would turn people away from the map.

[Unkn0wn]

Good and definately valid input.
Although on the issue of 'random artillery or bombs', I can foresee a lot of people going 'fuck this' just because they lose a unit to something they had no control over. Perhaps if somehow the artillery would only strike empty land, basically just be there for the atmosphere.

[Thtb]

Well give the system sevearl possible hit points that are no-go zones anyway or set a "arty" area around the middle of the map, at the fastes way to the other side

[Lolto]

This is great and all, but who here actually knows how to do it?

[salan]

Good and definately valid input.
Although on the issue of 'random artillery or bombs', I can foresee a lot of people going 'fuck this' just because they lose a unit to something they had no control over. Perhaps if somehow the artillery would only strike empty land, basically just be there for the atmosphere.

would be really interesting if you could make an artillery barrage go ahead of a defensive position as it sets up during the set up timer, of course this could bone airborn early drop, but it would be interesting.  

ie as your defensive forces move into the town in abbeville, a creeping barrage flattens the fields nearby to clear it of potential spotters.. of course this creates cover, but it adds a bit of 'prep' artistry and the feeling of being in a war.  <normally enemies wouldn't be there yet..>

Could also have a crashing airplane when an early deployment timer ticks down for airborn, it does have the small chance to hit something, but thats really minor and a small % of it happening.

flairs all over the place when blitzkreig enter early would also be an interesting scar code, without LOS being tuned to it, as well as for the infantry early deployment.  right now defenders have no clue that they are on the map, could easily denote this with a string of flairs all over the place as they prepare their offensive.

[Thtb]

I miss easy to use premade codeing like in WCIII-WE :I

[Ucross]

right now defenders have no clue that they are on the map, could easily denote this with a string of flairs all over the place as they prepare their offensive.

If you mean besides the territory turning color, the recon plane overhead, the 'possible' airborne deployment detected and the big message saying that the enemy is here than I agree. 

Otherwise I'd say the only time you don't know they are there is with blitz and that's intended.

[salan]

flairs all over the place when blitzkreig enter early would also be an interesting scar code, without LOS being tuned to it, as well as for the infantry early deployment.  right now defenders have no clue that they are on the map, could easily denote this with a string of flairs all over the place as they prepare their offensive.

right now defenders have no clue that they are on the map, could easily denote this with a string of flairs all over the place as they prepare their offensive.

If you mean besides the territory turning color, the recon plane overhead, the 'possible' airborne deployment detected and the big message saying that the enemy is here than I agree. 

Otherwise I'd say the only time you don't know they are there is with blitz and that's intended.

i remember taking a portion of your statement out of context and having you ask me to fix it... I would recommend the same.  I was talking about blitzkreig, and lesser infantry. 

and ya we know the territory changes color, it was mostly just input for the idea of scar coding eitherway.

and the message that the enemy is here comes at the full duration of the defense timer, not the early deployment rundown.

[Ucross]

I didn't read your full post there. =P  My bad.  If you're only talking about blitz I'd argue that their 'unknown' presence was good and helped represent the lack of preparation defenses felt when being 'blitz'ed.

[Wraith547]

I think I would be tight to add a prep bombardment on sword beach.

Just have it flatten the initial line of defenses and buildings. Definitely will be following this discussion.

[Razor]

Would be sweet if some arty comes down on the attackers side before the 3 min timer. To add some more dynamic and cover =).

[$_TEXAS_$]

I have experience with scar code, it isn't really difficult (to me). The big thing to watch is imbalance, but it would be possible to code in conditions such as manipulating were random arty falls (so it won't kill your units). plan crashes are a little trick, I don't know of any way to kill the plane in mid air, but I have caused planes to shoot down another plane (they were both p-47s). I like flares, in part because of the effect and since they are half object and half code.

coding does take time and a lot of experimentation.

[|-|Cozmo|-|]

I think making bombs fall on empty land would be pretty easy, in fact like texas said - it just takes time.

[DerangedGerman]

Then could we get some SCARring on, then? I'd love to have these effects on my maps, but I have no idea how to implement them. I guess I'll have to find out like I did the day/night transitions...

[zomgzombiescalliope]

Something no one has brought up yet.  Can you make sure that the planes flying overhead aren't targeted by pieces of anti-air?  Otherwise we're going to have more accidental plane crashes than we bargained for.

[DerangedGerman]

Even better

Adds to the feeling of general chaos on the battlefield.

[Thtb]

Well someone coud make the code for a baisc effect like those named, post it here, explain a bit & then people can take it on work on it / build it into there map.

[fldash]

You need to make sure they aren't assigned to a player but to the world, then they wouldn't be targeted.  Furthermore, all SCAR maps will have to be approved by me.  So don't try to get cute.

Something no one has brought up yet.  Can you make sure that the planes flying overhead aren't targeted by pieces of anti-air?  Otherwise we're going to have more accidental plane crashes than we bargained for.