Paks sniping at guns

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[Smokaz]

This is a problem in retail CoH as well. Maybe this mod and its balance team could show a strong hand by nerfing accuracy between at guns. You shouldnt need to blob up elite infantry or other silly stuff just to take out camoed paks. In fact, its considered a genuine balance issue over at Gamereplays.org (where I come from) and from my experience in the community at large.

"Paks sniping at guns is bs"

Basically sums it up. Its hard for balanced american builds to advance upon defending germans when their at guns gets sniped by paks with no chance of retribution. Some targets (like the king tiger) is just not viable to take on with tanks only. You need those at guns. If the paks just sniped the crew now and then, it wouldnt be so bad as you could be smart and recrew with supporting riflemanz. But alas, the gun itself is destroyed.

A couple of different fixes are proposed:

- Long range accuracy of the Pak is nerfed against the 57 MM
- Both 57 MM and Pak has vastly decreased accuracy against each other at long range (most realistic I think)
- At guns snipe crews now, not the gun themselves (perhaps the best idea and a previous way this was handled)
- Accuracy between at guns are nerfed to neglible levels (0,05 - 0,10) at all accuracy ranges.

[Akranadas]

Fixed next vCOH patch

[Mysthalin_Terror]

And it's JUUUUST around the corner, now isn't it akra?
Saying "this won't be fixed because the patch will fix it" is not at all valid.
The patch isn't coming, ever.

[NightRain]

PAK Sniping isn't really a problem.

PAK is 50mm and ATG is 57m.
To tell you. PAK gun is more expensive than US AT Gun. Its Cloak ability makes it useful. I mean hell you can win pak with a circle strafing Crocodile and it doesn't even die... so I don't think it is a problem.

US At gun is effective Anti tank weapon. It can destroy any tank from distance and cause major damage. So...why wouldn't Wehr players snipe US At guns? The Anti tank guns are always a trouble especially in EiR when Inf companies have Tank Reapers. Tank reapers gives 70 procent of basically everything from health to penetration. That is why PAKs are used to snipe them because we don't have anything else to snipe them with. You say Sniper Hans. SNiper hans gets sniped by the At gun too...

People PAK snipe so that they can take out all the anti tank guns, as a allied player all you can do is to make sure your AT guns are farer back and bring them forward when needed. Always Wehr players snipes PAKs.
In few games I sniped At guns so that I can bring in heavy tanks in so that they don't die that quickly :p

By the way, have you seen when US At gun one shots a PAK? Hahaha you can snipe paks too when they are visiable after those 3 shots. For example if it shoots a tank or a building just snipe it with your own at gun. All you can do to avoid being pak sniped is being more careful with them...

I think it is still fine as it is...I play both sides and Had had my AT gun sniped...I just moved it back to cover and brought it out when I needed it.. =)

[Sach]

And it's JUUUUST around the corner, now isn't it akra?
Saying "this won't be fixed because the patch will fix it" is not at all valid.
The patch isn't coming, ever.

when the patch comes and fixes all these things like pak sniping and relic online shittiness and global warming and world hunger, you''ll feel silly!

[Duckordie]

Fixed in EiR 2.0, nuf said

[martin_the_monkey1]

i think one of the problems is some axis player use a bug where they fire the pac then move it  a little bit so it clokes faster stopping the allies from firering back at it
i dont know if this is part of the game or a bug.
but it dose make it so you cant return fire on them unless your forec fire the ground.

[NightRain]

i think one of the problems is some axis player use a bug where they fire the pac then move it  a little bit so it clokes faster stopping the allies from firering back at it
i dont know if this is part of the game or a bug.
but it dose make it so you cant return fire on them unless your forec fire the ground.

Its a basic thing. PAK gets 3 Shots and third one reveals it. You shoot twice then retreat it...good Axis players uses this to kill enemy AT guns...

[Smokaz]

That its fixed in next retail patch, really isnt much of an argument. I'm sure you are all aware of relic's speedy way of patching the game.

That the 57MM is a "problem" for axis isnt much of an arguement either. Shreks two-shot this thing and mortars will force it move (not fire). How it is a problem, I cannot fathom. That the wehr sniper gets shot by the 57 MM is a separate problem not related to this.

[MannfredvonRitter]

I don't find pak sniping to be a huge problem. Why are your ATG's on your frontline? Move them back further and use infantry as your front line. Where are your mortars to counter his AT or even just some form of indirect fire?

When there is a combined defence of tank reaper ATG's, HMG's and perhaps a few infantry pak sniping is the only way to break the deadlock of which I'm quite sure you're aware.

Keep your ATG's back and have an infantry frontline.

As previously mentioned, whilst we paksnipe your ATG's, you also have croc's and many, many excellent counters of which we have some, but less effective (and albeit less cost effective).

Try using mortars or snipers even, you will be surprised at the results.

[Killer344]

Keep your ATG's back and have an infantry frontline.

Tell me, how do you that if there´s an ostwind next to a pak?

Move the infantry, they die, move the 57, it dies.

Pak sniping is a problem.

[Draken]

Keep your ATG's back and have an infantry frontline.

Tell me, how do you that if there´s an ostwind next to a pak?

Move the infantry, they die, move the 57, it dies.

Pak sniping is a problem.

Arty?

[martin_the_monkey1]

not evry one has arty

[MannfredvonRitter]

Keep your ATG's back and have an infantry frontline.

Tell me, how do you that if there´s an ostwind next to a pak?

Move the infantry, they die, move the 57, it dies.

Pak sniping is a problem.

Axis companies take 2-4 paks. Use artillery, you play as the allies, artillery is plentiful. You can easily break fortifications that way, we usually can't break fortifications with artillery (due to a lack thereof).

We have better AT guns (supposedly due to cost), our AT guns are less useful against tanks than yours are due to speed differences (assuming solo AT) and equal or slightly weaker than yours when supported by infantry AT. Our ability to snipe your ATG's imo makes our pak guns worthy of their higher cost.

[Killer344]

Axis companies take 2-4 paks. Use artillery, you play as the allies, artillery is plentiful. You can easily break fortifications that way, we usually can't break fortifications with artillery (due to a lack thereof).

We have better AT guns (supposedly due to cost), our AT guns are less useful against tanks than yours are due to speed differences (assuming solo AT) and equal or slightly weaker than yours when supported by infantry AT. Our ability to snipe your ATG's imo makes our pak guns worthy of their higher cost.

If you´re playing with a pershing company you don´t have arty....

Arty?

same as above but how do you arty what you can´t see ? :p

mortars? as soon they hear it they will move the paks ....

[MannfredvonRitter]

Axis companies take 2-4 paks. Use artillery, you play as the allies, artillery is plentiful. You can easily break fortifications that way, we usually can't break fortifications with artillery (due to a lack thereof).

We have better AT guns (supposedly due to cost), our AT guns are less useful against tanks than yours are due to speed differences (assuming solo AT) and equal or slightly weaker than yours when supported by infantry AT. Our ability to snipe your ATG's imo makes our pak guns worthy of their higher cost.

If you´re playing with a pershing company you don´t have arty....

Arty?

same as above but how do you arty what you can´t see ? :p

mortars? as soon they hear it they will move the paks ....

I didn't even mention the pershing so I don't understand why you talked about pershings. I was talking in general about pak v atg. If you don't have ANY indirect fire then you deserve to die. Perhaps one of you lacks artillery due to pershings but I would imagine at least one has it...even if you don't have actually artillery I would home you have mortars. They will move their pak, but whilst you force it back you have a chance to move up also. Where is your croc in all of this too?

You can't expect to counter one thing with its counterpart and win. Allied armour versus axis armour you will usually lose as an ally. Allied infantry usually wins, straight inf v inf combat without vet/upgrades. Artillery combat is a near unilateral war, axis artillery can't fight back against allied artillery and so forth. Don't expect counterparts to be equal, this is part of the game dynamic.

[GamerAndy]

Just wanted to mention that this is really easy to fix, make it so the pak decloaks after it fires 1 shot and its about a 50/50 battle between the 57 and the pak - it doesnt really change much, it just means that most players no longer want to use their paks to knock out AT guns since they have a good chance of losing the fight.

we've had that in for the last 3 weeks and it works wonders, people still kill AT guns with AT guns but very rarely will they move a cloaked pak up in front of their lines and try to snipe it because its simply too risky.

[donnieDark]

I have to side with the axis players on this one.   It is true that not everyone has arty..but thats kinda something you need to consider before starting a battle.   Pak sniping is legit and it works both ways...ive blasted plenty of paks with AT guns

[notenome]

First off Paks can be sniped by allied AT guns, or killed by fireup rangers/AB. I've seen this happen a lot. Second between mortars/callies/bombing run/strafing run/howies/1 sec arty and all that other nonsense, you should always be able to kill a pak with offmap, especially due to cloaked paks moving slowly as they are cloaked and the set up time. Paks are very vulnerable to indirect fire. And they cant kill a croc before it starts circle strafing them. But if you think Paks are overpowered bc they can snipe AT guns I'll gladly trade you tank reapers for paks. I'll even throw in flamenwerfers as a bonus. Deal?

[GamerAndy]

...
did you really just base your argument that Paks arn't overpowered on the fact that allies can get the T4 tank reapers?