Sherman Jumbo!

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[AmPM]

Wow can't believe people use time to fight NEW CONTENT.. I mean how retarded is it to fight new content.. The developers are not robots who ceaselessily work toward improving whatever the community cries for each time the wind changes directions or follow schedule blindly.. It should be received as overwhelmingly positive if community discussion or ideas has spurred new directions or concepts in EIRR development.

I should dig up some of AMPM's squirming posts about how bored he is with vcoh factions or pre-reinforcements EIR type of units/gameplay.. and then we combine this with his tornado of tears against proposed new content to make the ultimate anti-logic bomb, fzzzzBOOM!

No, its more about units that remove the usefulness of other units in the same faction or side.

If every doctrine ends up with units that mirror other doctrines....well, yay...all the same.

[Smokaz]

How do you know they remove usefulness from other units before you have seen it? Would you agree to a label called "preemptive whining" to coin this action?

[DasNoob]

Some people will always min/max based on cost and stats... for those people new units tend to represent that.

[AmPM]

Some people will always min/max based on cost and stats... for those people new units tend to represent that.

People that build a company to do well or be competitive will do this, as everyone who plays to win is already doing it.

You don't win by picking the worst combinations and use of resources.

Oh Das, I got a new pic for you.

[Smokaz]

Well you DEFINITELY do not win by being predictable or manhugging the build of everyone else and as for the crocodile.. can you name a good example of any eirr units being overshadowed by others in the same role?

[bbsmith]

can you name a good example of any eirr units being overshadowed by others in the same role?

Luftwaffe infantry and volksgrenadiers when you have them from the reinforcement package.

[Nevyen]

AMPM and Smokaz  Keep it civil or don't post

[DasNoob]

Dude they are keeping it civil  

Nice to see some folks over at OMG still care to read our boards

I still watch the VRR... love that Hogan's Heroes intro!  Classic!


Thread cleaned.

[jackmccrack]

Luftwaffe infantry and volksgrenadiers when you have them from the reinforcement package.

These units are slightly similar, yes: both have five men, both are used as recrewing squads, both are marginally bad at combat, and both have similar costs.

But I would not say either of these units overshadow eachother. Volks can get MP40s and Fausts and their combat ability can be increased *slightly* by doctrine abilities (like the Blitz -incoming supression or the Defensive +sight or the Terror Zeal); Luftwaffe benefit *mostly* from direct doctrine abilities (like Crete Veterans or Handing It Over) instead of through upgrades.

They are also doctrinal and never act as main line infantry. We never see Luftwaffe Infantry fielded en masse unless in a desperate push for territory late game...unlike MP40 Volks which are sometimes (maybe even most of the time) brought on in pairs.

How these units somehow "overshadow" each other I do not understand. What sets a lot of units apart nowadays is Availability. Even if unit A is better than unit B there is still the Availability cost associated. A lot of folks would rather have a Pershing than an M4 Sherman, but the Pershing does not "overshadow" the Sherman in my opinion.

[Smokaz]

Spot on by jack, and this is pretty civil imo.

Also a unit "overshadowing" another unit should not be confused with not being cost-effective on its own, thats a balance problem related to that unit and that unit only, a great example would be the hotchkiss. It sucks at both anti light vehicle and anti inf, but does that mean a P4 IST overshadows it? No it means that the hotchkiss sucks for cost or needs tweaking of its ability to do their job.

[gamesguy2]

i do have an allied account, and its 100% easier to play then axis. just put a hmg here, atg here, then put a bren with some sappers and ur all set against anything the PE can throw at u. and im sorry if i sound spiteful, hey updates have to start somewhere, its gonna be unbalanced if new units, improvments are added with some factions then later on completed other faction, but its just ive always doubted Americans first to update, compared to what PE can field. but hey i have to deal with it right.

Click

[DasNoob]

Spot on by jack, and this is pretty civil imo.

You guys are practically sitting down for high tea compared to some threads! hehe.

[Tymathee]

Luftwaffe infantry and volksgrenadiers when you have them from the reinforcement package.

These units are slightly similar, yes: both have five men, both are used as recrewing squads, both are marginally bad at combat, and both have similar costs.

But I would not say either of these units overshadow eachother. Volks can get MP40s and Fausts and their combat ability can be increased *slightly* by doctrine abilities (like the Blitz -incoming supression or the Defensive +sight or the Terror Zeal); Luftwaffe benefit *mostly* from direct doctrine abilities (like Crete Veterans or Handing It Over) instead of through upgrades.

They are also doctrinal and never act as main line infantry. We never see Luftwaffe Infantry fielded en masse unless in a desperate push for territory late game...unlike MP40 Volks which are sometimes (maybe even most of the time) brought on in pairs.

How these units somehow "overshadow" each other I do not understand. What sets a lot of units apart nowadays is Availability. Even if unit A is better than unit B there is still the Availability cost associated. A lot of folks would rather have a Pershing than an M4 Sherman, but the Pershing does not "overshadow" the Sherman in my opinion.

Probably more for PE as when you're the other PE docs and you get the lufts and fj's, you will use more of those types than the pz grens and if you get volks and grens, they will overshadow pz grens.

Also, if you are luft and you get luft reinforcements then more than likely you wont be using any type of pz grens, there's no need especially when you can get g43's on the lufts.

[Tymathee]

i do have an allied account, and its 100% easier to play then axis. just put a hmg here, atg here, then put a bren with some sappers and ur all set against anything the PE can throw at u. and im sorry if i sound spiteful, hey updates have to start somewhere, its gonna be unbalanced if new units, improvments are added with some factions then later on completed other faction, but its just ive always doubted Americans first to update, compared to what PE can field. but hey i have to deal with it right.

I've played you when you were on allies, your allied game is far worse than your PE game because you didn't have those hordes of vet 3 units.

 .

[Smokaz]

Probably more for PE as when you're the other PE docs and you get the lufts and fj's, you will use more of those types than the pz grens and if you get volks and grens, they will overshadow pz grens.

Also, if you are luft and you get luft reinforcements then more than likely you wont be using any type of pz grens, there's no need especially when you can get g43's on the lufts.

Why wouldn you use panzergrens just because you have waffles? They are decidedly different: Pgrens get incendaries/at nades, waffles get wire/sandbags. They are two unique choices catering to different playstyles.  Very unconvincing example of units overshadowing each other.. the question could be furthered by asking "what kind of overshadowing units are you forced into having access to by any available doctrine/reinforcements choice?" as getting overshadowing units even if someone could make a fair point for them exisiting would just reflect upon being a POOR choice of doctrine/reinforcement combinations.

[DarkSoldierX]

I want a King Tiger 5x normal size that can crush light to medium tanks

[Lt_Apollo]

so you want this?

[AmPM]

Sherman Jumbo

same gun as Sherman Upgun

Speed 4, cannot purchase Overdrive/Flankspeed

Purchasable Dozer and .50 cal

Pershing Armor table (zomg, schreks no hurt from the front), 750 health

All defensive vet

avail 1/1/3

12pop, 450mp, 300fu

Something like that.

[Demon767]

hey waait we might be onto something, sherman upgun as standard, pershing armor but same hp as a normal sherman

[Smokaz]

Needs a tradeoff, make it less effective against inf than the normal upgun and like 10% more penetration or accuracy or better range or something.