[WM] Flak 88

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[DarkSoldierX]

Why does jagdpanther do 25% less dammage to churchhills but the marder 3 does 25% more damage to pershings? Don't keep changing the awsum wtf thats gay modifiers guys they keep this game fun too.

[LeoPhone]

Why does jagdpanther do 25% less dammage to churchhills but the marder 3 does 25% more damage to pershings? Don't keep changing the awsum wtf thats gay modifiers guys they keep this game fun too.

i dont know the exact reasons for these modifiers, but one could be is that churchils in vcoh are a t1. and axis should have a low teir counter for it.. so that explains marder.
but jagt is a t3, and it is gonna rape all the shit of anything else so the allies can use some help.
in eir however, u can just call in a jagt from the start or call in the churchill on the end. so lots of these modifiers lose their reasoning.

another thing is that churchils just destroy marders while marders should be good AT.
but flak rapes the shit out of pershing. it has 100 range while pershing has 40, the flak kills the pershing in 4.07 shots(it has 0.225 penetrating at long range, 0.45 at medium and 0.9 at short, reload of pershing is faster at long range, but flak is faster at short range)

[Mysthalin]

And considering the short range of the flak is basically equal to the long range of the pershing..

Honestly, the pershing shouldn't have that modifier - it's quite silly.

[CafeMilani]

i think you havent seen players driving up their vet3 pershing to kill that flak, did you?
it would be quite silly if the pershing wins without losing more than 40% HP, now wouldnt it?

[LeoPhone]

well atm youll be luckey if you get one shot of before pershing is dead.

[Silver1Wolf2]

countering a AT EMPLACEMENT with a TANK is... stupid? moronic? crack pipe worthy? this is a classic case of L2P in my eyes as the flak 88 is vulnerable to an amazing number of units.... hell it can even be decrewed by 3 jeeps and you want it to be useless vs pershings as well? lets be honest here guys... how many of you assault a flak 88 head on without softening it up first with an artillery barrage first? how many times is that flak in a open area (ergo likely been butt fucked by the arty) or next to a building? (in which case you can just use the building as cover for a fast moving tank like an M10 to get close and circle rape it or hell even 3 jeeps could just about do that too if there's no MG in the building (after a well placed arty strike it's doubtful).

[CafeMilani]

word, lol

[LeoPhone]

still makes no sense that a bigger tank does less dmg vs it.

[Killer344]

Bigger tank => more HP => can sustain more damage from the flak => able to fire more times => modifier to compensate.

[LeoPhone]

still makes no sense that a bigger gun that is better than any other US gun in every way does less dmg.

and the sherman dies in 3 shots, the difference is not that big. the price is.

[Silver1Wolf2]

Ok... I'll repeat this one last time... don't charge anti tank weapons with tanks, it doesn't work and it should not either... the 88 both in game and historically was a beast that was/is plagued by the problem of low mobility, once it's deployed it's stuck there until decrewed/dead or the end of the game so could we please get over the "lol...my big tank can't kill the big AT weapon BUILT TO KILL IT" ? I get sick of this stuff quickly as it's biased, a dude likes his pershing and hates it can't kill everything in the game even if used skillfully, it just isn't meant to be used that way Leo, the sherman is a lighter, speedier tank that can avoid the flak until it's neutralized by artillery and the pershing itself can take a few shots and back out before killed, neither tanks aren't meant to kill it though 2 of each likely could if they are microed well (hell the pershings will rape it bar none and the shermans could if lucky get away with only losing half health off of one).

[LeoPhone]

so you like the vcoh british army? where every emplacement is rapeshit against any type of unit exept for one? two king tigers cant beat one 17 pdr emplacement? one tommy in a trench will beat 5 kch?

And do you not understand that my point is that pershing does less damage than a sherman vs the 88? i do not want the pershing to rape the shit out of a flak, the only thing i expect is that the pershing has a bigger chanse to do anything compared to a sherman.

[TheLastArmada]

The Endless struggle in Coh
Gameplay > Realisim

[Mysthalin]

1st off - the Pershing already does NOT kill the 88. It'll need at least 12 seconds just to get within shooting range of the 88 after the 88 opens fire on the pershing. 12 seconds is enough time for a minimum 3 shots from the 88 - with 243 damage dealt per shot against the pershing. Of course, with the pershing's armour, it's more likely that 2 shots will bounce off before getting in close enough to fire at the 88. I don't have access to Corsix atm, but IIRC the deflection multiplier for the 88 is 0.35(and not 0.5 like CoH-stats claim). Meaning that this one penetration and two bounces will deal a grand total of 413 damage to the pershing - a pretty serious toll on the 990 HP heavy tank. Now, the assumption the 88 won't manage to kill the nearly half-health Pershing in the next 36 seconds (minimum) the Pershing would need to kill the 88 is absolutely retarded. So yeah Aloha - even if we made the Pershing instagib the 88 in one shot - it would still lose 40 percent of it's HP, considering the 88 is actually scouted for.

Secondly - the 88 costs less than half as much as the pershing fuel wise, nearly half as much popcap wise and also quite a bit less manpower wise. It's also not just an "anti-tank" tool - it snipes infantry, and it manages that extremely well. I would know, I've been using 88s on my volks coy to great effect thank you. I'll also ignore the part where the 88 gets access to the wonderful 105 barrage via a certain T3 that also happens to be in the same tree as the ultimate buff for the 88 - Omniscience.

I also don't imagine what exactly you're doing to lose an 88 to a 3x Jeep rush.

The sherman is in NO way faster than the Pershing - it has the exact same speed.

@Killer :

Wouldn't the whole POINT of a bigger tank be that it should be stronger than the smaller tank? It makes absolutely no sense that the Sherman, which is half the cost of the Pershing, on top of being non-doctrinal does better vs the 88 than the Pershing.

This isn't about realism Armada - it's about pure logic.

[TheLastArmada]

Indeed i do see your logic,
Bigger Tanks>BIgger Armour

But tbh there werent all that many Pershings in Europe
Mayb we should replace the pershing out right witha Jumbo Sherman

shutting down>.....

[Sharpshooter824]

Indeed i do see your logic,
Bigger Tanks>BIgger Armour

But tbh there werent all that many Pershings in Europe
Mayb we should replace the pershing out right witha Jumbo Sherman

shutting down>.....

this is about balance not realism, guess what, half the axis units were barely used in the war, who cares, its about gameplay and balance, you shouldn't even have the right to discuss balance after this last post of yours

[Rocksitter]

 1/2 ??

[Falcon333]

guess what, half the axis units were barely used in the war,

Wait what ?

[Sharpshooter824]

guess what, half the axis units were barely used in the war,

Wait what ?

wasnt the ostwind a prototype or something? by his silly logic units that weren't used or were barely used in the REAL LIFE WAR, shouldn't be in the game

[Tymathee]

just a question...why would u want to sacrifice ur pershing to kill an 88 anyway?