The R/ME mode spam start, how to sniff out and deal with it

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[Spartan_Marine88]

Am I sensing a slippery slope?

I am sensing a slippery slope, so i hope you are. Your trying to take an easy way out instead of doing the harder and longer way of taking an individual look at all the different units, abilities and weapons and balancing them that way.

I could be wrong, but thats the way it feels to me. It is just my opinion, but hey im not the only one who thinks this mod is going down hill.

I love this mod, im just trying to look out for it.

[LeoPhone]

Why exactly do you assume the developers will be putting down retarded pool costs on the thompson upgraded infantry, and that there will be no pool cost on things like assault grenades?

Am I sensing a slippery slope?

because you said so. BARs cost extra but nades dont.

[Groundfire]

Thumbs down on this, you already pay an arm and a leg for upgrades (180 for SMGs on a 9 pool infantry unit) so why should I be penalized for fielding expensive upgrades? Will flame throwers on engineers make their pool 9 then for how powerful flamers are? And if we add mines then the engineers are more expensive than rangers?

And what about PE/Wehr, Assault grens which have a flamer and 3 MP44s would be over elite infantry then, and shrek squads.. expensive as is for 1, but imagine now that guy with 3 double shrek squads now taking up double the pool in his company.

This is not how its going to work.

Afaik, the pool will draw from all muni weapons upgrades and (maybe) muni costing support weapons.

The weapons cache pool will be tailored to the upgrade and probably all infantry units that will normally draw 9 pool from the Infantry pool will be reduced to 4 or 5 from the infantry and the difference made up in the weapons cache pool.

What this does is allows you to field entire elite infantry armies but you wont be able to fully upgrade all of them and still have the capability of fielding sufficient protective support weapons, or you must rely on some kind of Fuel AT/AI to make your army fully functional. (hopefully eliminating suicide inf/ATG spam in the process, as well as support weapon spam)

If it's not prohibitive it's restrictive, I dont know the extent that this system will work, (infact what I described above is largely what i suggested internally and what EIRRMOD seemed to agree upon) apparently were getting rid of oversupply. This is news to me (or outright rumor) and Preferably i would like to see incremental price increases for all units in oversupply.

[Mysthalin]

because you said so. BARs cost extra but nades dont.

1) And since when am I a dev who's word is undisputably law?
2) I was taking the specific case of AB riflemen. Was not aware they had access to assault grenades or thompsons .

[Spartan_Marine88]

1) And since when am I a dev who's word is undisputably law?
2) I was taking the specific case of AB riflemen. Was not aware they had access to assault grenades or thompsons .

1) Never said you were, but you are well respected by the devs, and do seem to have there ear on certain topics (such as balance)

2)AB rifles did have AW and in the case of thompsons, who knows they might show up one day

[Mysthalin]

1) No, the devs hate me and salan keeps calling me a whore .

2) AW was a top-table ability. You never had to pay anything for top-table abilities ;p. And thompsons being given is a theory-craft. And you know how people take to theory-crafting around these parts.

[Spartan_Marine88]

2) And thompsons being given is a theory-craft. And you know how people take to theory-crafting around these parts.

I didn't say it WOULD happen i said you never know, and i wasn't being serious.

[Smokaz]

This is not how its going to work.

Afaik, the pool will draw from all muni weapons upgrades and (maybe) muni costing support weapons.

The weapons cache pool will be tailored to the upgrade and probably all infantry units that will normally draw 9 pool from the Infantry pool will be reduced to 4 or 5 from the infantry and the difference made up in the weapons cache pool.

What this does is allows you to field entire elite infantry armies but you wont be able to fully upgrade all of them and still have the capability of fielding sufficient protective support weapons, or you must rely on some kind of Fuel AT/AI to make your army fully functional. (hopefully eliminating suicide inf/ATG spam in the process, as well as support weapon spam)

If it's not prohibitive it's restrictive, I dont know the extent that this system will work, (infact what I described above is largely what i suggested internally and what EIRRMOD seemed to agree upon) apparently were getting rid of oversupply. This is news to me (or outright rumor) and Preferably i would like to see incremental price increases for all units in oversupply.

If lionel isn't forced into fielding less rangers and more rifles, this system won't work. But hey.. maybe he wants to play with rangers without upgrades.

The whole point of the change is to stop company's like Lionel's all ranger company from happening.. `?

[Jizz Magnet]

Sorry, but I can't look seriously at anyone claiming "gimmick" on me when I use the most bread and butter of Wehrmacht units : grenadiers, followed by a single flamethrower halftrack and 5 bikes for scouting/sniper killing duty.

Nice thread smokie .

It was a gimmick because that officer made them rape machines. And grens are meant to be used in support of support weapons/vehicles.

[Artekas]

Wait, are you trying to say mainline infantry shouldn't be used as mainline infantry? Or that using a single unit that's designed to buff other units in its intended role is a gimmick?

[Jizz Magnet]

I'm saying EIR's doctrines wouldn't look out of place in a fantasy world.

[lionel23]

If lionel isn't forced into fielding less rangers and more rifles, this system won't work. But hey.. maybe he wants to play with rangers without upgrades.

The whole point of the change is to stop company's like Lionel's all ranger company from happening.. `?

And why should I be forced to field riflemen? They're piss-poor mainline infantry that lose 1-2 guys the moment they engage any inf squad, while rangers can sit in cover and exchange fire with M1 Garands and get back and heal at a Infantry Triage.  If I was going to make a pure suicide riflemen company (which I did pre-wipe with 30+ squads of vet 2 sticky riflemen and 5 howies), then I would never buy a triage as it would net you little in return for the cost of it when healing a weak riflemen squad or engineer squad as opposed to rangers.  Sides, my company is easily countered by hard AI vehicle counters (like Tigers, ISTs) and certain doctrines can field sufficient units or infantry mobs to whittle their numbers down (such as Blitz all Elite Armor Infantry companies, which I am planning to run with 22+ grens).

@ Groundfire - I'm really interested in this system and am generally in favor of this weapon pool thing, was there a thread somewhere in the forums that has more info on this?

[Smokaz]

And why should I be forced to field riflemen? They're piss-poor mainline infantry that lose 1-2 guys the moment they engage any inf squad, while rangers can sit in cover and exchange fire with M1 Garands and get back and heal at a Infantry Triage.  If I was going to make a pure suicide riflemen company (which I did pre-wipe with 30+ squads of vet 2 sticky riflemen and 5 howies), then I would never buy a triage as it would net you little in return for the cost of it when healing a weak riflemen squad or engineer squad as opposed to rangers.  Sides, my company is easily countered by hard AI vehicle counters (like Tigers, ISTs) and certain doctrines can field sufficient units or infantry mobs to whittle their numbers down (such as Blitz all Elite Armor Infantry companies, which I am planning to run with 22+ grens).

@ Groundfire - I'm really interested in this system and am generally in favor of this weapon pool thing, was there a thread somewhere in the forums that has more info on this?

Thats the game. Thats americans.

[lionel23]

It was a gimmick because that officer made them rape machines. And grens are meant to be used in support of support weapons/vehicles.

I disagree with that, grens can be made to be mainline infantry, much tougher and for their cost they can floor a riflemen squad 1 on 1.

[Mysthalin]

It's not my fault you didn't manage to provide enough of a challenge for me to have to refer to the use of anything heavier than a flammenwerfer halftrack as far as vehicles are concerned .

And you do have some very interesting conceptions about how mainline infantry is supposed to be used. I always assumed they were supposed to be mainline infantry.

[Smokaz]

If you think Rangers with fireup, 6 man squad, all that HP and elite armor are "mainline" infantry you've been spoiled tbh.

[Spartan_Marine88]

It's not my fault you didn't manage to provide enough of a challenge for me to have to refer to the use of anything heavier than a flammenwerfer halftrack as far as vehicles are concerned .

And you do have some very interesting conceptions about how mainline infantry is supposed to be used. I always assumed they were supposed to be mainline infantry.

He has been playing for 2 days, so unless he is a smurf his opinion is invalid.

[Mysthalin]

He's apparently a rather avid OMG player . Not sure who though.

[Spartan_Marine88]

He's apparently a rather avid OMG player .

This ain't OMG, haven't been the same, or even similiar in a long time

[Smokaz]

This grens vs rifles discussion is so tiresome.. what I wouldn't give for stickies as wehr. They are also fairly sniper immune at their low cost, doesnt matter that much if you lose a guy to a snipe.  Rifles are definitely good.

On my armor company, rifle stickies is a lifesaver EVERY time. Bar supression is immensilyuseful. You really learn to appreciate having that vet 3 rifle with bars and stickies.