nugnugx
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« Reply #140 on: February 09, 2011, 11:59:55 am » |
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They are pretty much the same from my observations. They die with the same speed as before for me  |
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AmPM
Community Mapper
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« Reply #141 on: February 09, 2011, 01:26:31 pm » |
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No, I'm saying some people here have the perception that they're now absolutely terrible, when my point is that they're only as 'terrible' as your average WM grenadier... Yes, they were significantly stronger in certain departments before this change, but their high pre-nerf resistance versus BARs for example is a vCOH mechanic that is irrelevant in EIR gameplay.
Except that the Wehr Gren does far more damage =) |
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Unkn0wn
No longer retired
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« Reply #142 on: February 09, 2011, 01:43:39 pm » |
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I'm obviously referring to their survivability, which is what this thread is primarily about.
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LeoPhone
Honoured Member
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« Reply #143 on: February 09, 2011, 01:50:28 pm » |
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if they kill the enemy faster they will take less dmg and survive more.
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AmPM
Community Mapper
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« Reply #144 on: February 09, 2011, 02:07:30 pm » |
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Indeed, you have to figure in the units total combat ability when determining if it is comparable.
The PGren has the same health and armor as a Grenadier, while dealing 40% less DPS and costing the same pop for the same number of men. It also costs a similar amount (215mp for PG, 240 for Gren).
For 25manpower you lose 40% of your damage dealing ability from Grens to PGrens....Seems off to me.
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| NightRain
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« Reply #145 on: February 09, 2011, 02:16:49 pm » |
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Indeed, you have to figure in the units total combat ability when determining if it is comparable.
The PGren has the same health and armor as a Grenadier, while dealing 40% less DPS and costing the same pop for the same number of men. It also costs a similar amount (215mp for PG, 240 for Gren).
For 25manpower you lose 40% of your damage dealing ability from Grens to PGrens....Seems off to me.
If you add veteran sergeant your squad costs 240 and still deals less dmg. |
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Because a forum post should be like a woman's skirt. Long enough to cover the subject material, but short enough to keep things interesting.
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nugnugx
Donator
Posts: 4051
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« Reply #146 on: February 09, 2011, 02:18:20 pm » |
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who said pgrens are supposed to do the same damage as wehr grens ?
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LeoPhone
Honoured Member
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« Reply #147 on: February 09, 2011, 02:22:09 pm » |
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who said pgrens are supposed to do the same damage as wehr grens ?
well if the price pop and hp is the same and the upgrades are crappier... |
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nugnugx
Donator
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« Reply #148 on: February 09, 2011, 02:26:08 pm » |
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well if the price pop and hp is the same and the upgrades are crappier...
that's why imo g43 should be buffed to be better than wehr gren , so normal pgrens have worse damage , and upgraded to g43 better damage than wehr grens |
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| BigDick
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« Reply #149 on: February 09, 2011, 02:33:56 pm » |
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i think one problem is the pop nerf that makes pgrens really shit now
especially since you pay for 2 marders already 12 pop and if you want a mortar or some indirect fire of stukka u need additional 6-8 pop without having any infantry on the field
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LeoPhone
Honoured Member
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« Reply #150 on: February 09, 2011, 03:35:36 pm » |
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i think one problem is the pop nerf that makes pgrens really shit now
especially since you pay for 2 marders already 12 pop and if you want a mortar or some indirect fire of stukka u need additional 6-8 pop without having any infantry on the field
this is true. PE is dependant on vehicles. on average vehicles are more pop than infantry. mortar ht 6 pop -- mortar 4 pop marder 6 pop -- atg 4/5 pop etc. |
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nugnugx
Donator
Posts: 4051
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« Reply #151 on: February 09, 2011, 03:37:07 pm » |
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Pgrens were the only main infantry that was 4 pop
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LeoPhone
Honoured Member
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« Reply #152 on: February 09, 2011, 03:38:36 pm » |
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PE is the only army without normal support weapons. even though they have the 4 man hmg now.
so what? each army has its uniqueness. you could argue spamming PE inf would be better than spamming rifleman due to pop but go try to be effective with that.
rifles will do better though.
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lionel23
Donator
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« Reply #153 on: February 09, 2011, 04:28:51 pm » |
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I have to agree with Leophone on this one, his last post clearly shows why the pop nerf is pretty bad for PE. You have an inferior, mainline infantry who can't really perform mainline infantry duties being they have crappy armor and a weak gun for a higher premium. The also lack support weapons that are infantry based, meaning they use the vehicle based equivalents which is more expensive in terms of pop anyway.
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Congratulations, dear sir...I must say, never before have I seen such precise gunnery displayed. - CrazyWR (on Leaderboard Howitzers)  |
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AmPM
Community Mapper
Posts: 7978
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« Reply #154 on: February 09, 2011, 04:30:59 pm » |
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To clarify matters..
PGren Rifles does 12 damage per shot
Grenadiers use the Stormtrooper rifle which does 15 damage per shot
Both have the same target tables.
PGrens do 20% less damage than Grenadiers.
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TheIcelandicManiac
Resident forum troll. Fucked unkn0wns mom
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« Reply #155 on: February 09, 2011, 05:25:14 pm » |
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Leo has a good point andif you guys deside to rewert the changes i have a reason to start playing again
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Soon
gj icelandic i am proud of u  Sometimes its like PQ doesnt carrot all.
Work Harder |
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| spinn72
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« Reply #156 on: February 09, 2011, 05:37:52 pm » |
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PE now has a HMG and according to TH t3, a pak 36 which can cloak.
Goodbye PE, i missed you and your originality.
Hello Wehr v2
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| cloud234
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« Reply #157 on: February 09, 2011, 07:26:08 pm » |
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PGrens do 20% less damage than Grenadiers.
40% less DPS. I think it has to do with the accuracy, wind up wind down ,cd and whatever at range. |
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Tymathee
Donator
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« Reply #158 on: February 09, 2011, 11:15:21 pm » |
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I think they're fine...all i keep saying is PE, PE, PE lately, no one's going wehr, and they all have g43's and they're pzgrens, not assault grens. They seem to be doing just fine.
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"I want proof!"
"I have proof!"
"Whatever, I'm still right"
Dafuq man, don't ask for proof if you'll refuse it if it's not in your favor, logic fallacy for the bloody win.
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| NightRain
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« Reply #159 on: February 10, 2011, 01:03:50 am » |
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PE now has a HMG and according to TH t3, a pak 36 which can cloak.
Goodbye PE, i missed you and your originality.
Hello Wehr v2
PE only has 3 HMGs. 1. Scout Car with MG upgrade. 2. Luftwaffen MG34. 3. SE HMG42. They got no pak36s. I don't think they'll even get one. |
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