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Author Topic: [PE] PzGren Changes  (Read 57948 times)
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nugnugx Offline
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« Reply #140 on: February 09, 2011, 11:59:55 am »

They are pretty much the same from my observations.  They die with the same speed as before for me  Roll Eyes
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AmPM Offline
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« Reply #141 on: February 09, 2011, 01:26:31 pm »

No, I'm saying some people here have the perception that they're now absolutely terrible, when my point is that they're only as 'terrible' as your average WM grenadier... Yes, they were significantly stronger in certain departments before this change, but their high pre-nerf resistance versus BARs for example is a vCOH mechanic that is irrelevant in EIR gameplay.

Except that the Wehr Gren does far more damage =)
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Unkn0wn Offline
No longer retired
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« Reply #142 on: February 09, 2011, 01:43:39 pm »

I'm obviously referring to their survivability, which is what this thread is primarily about.
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LeoPhone Offline
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« Reply #143 on: February 09, 2011, 01:50:28 pm »

if they kill the enemy faster they will take less dmg and survive more.
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AmPM Offline
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« Reply #144 on: February 09, 2011, 02:07:30 pm »

Indeed, you have to figure in the units total combat ability when determining if it is comparable.

The PGren has the same health and armor as a Grenadier, while dealing 40% less DPS and costing the same pop for the same number of men. It also costs a similar amount (215mp for PG, 240 for Gren).

For 25manpower you lose 40% of your damage dealing ability from Grens to PGrens....Seems off to me.
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NightRain Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 3908



« Reply #145 on: February 09, 2011, 02:16:49 pm »

Indeed, you have to figure in the units total combat ability when determining if it is comparable.

The PGren has the same health and armor as a Grenadier, while dealing 40% less DPS and costing the same pop for the same number of men. It also costs a similar amount (215mp for PG, 240 for Gren).

For 25manpower you lose 40% of your damage dealing ability from Grens to PGrens....Seems off to me.

If you add veteran sergeant your squad costs 240 and still deals less dmg.
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Because a forum post should be like a woman's skirt. Long enough to cover the subject material, but short enough to keep things interesting.
nugnugx Offline
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« Reply #146 on: February 09, 2011, 02:18:20 pm »

who said pgrens are supposed to do the same damage as wehr grens ?
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LeoPhone Offline
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« Reply #147 on: February 09, 2011, 02:22:09 pm »

who said pgrens are supposed to do the same damage as wehr grens ?

well if the price pop and hp is the same and the upgrades are crappier...
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nugnugx Offline
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« Reply #148 on: February 09, 2011, 02:26:08 pm »

well if the price pop and hp is the same and the upgrades are crappier...

that's why imo g43 should be buffed to be better than wehr gren ,  so normal pgrens have worse damage , and upgraded to g43  better damage than wehr grens
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BigDick
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« Reply #149 on: February 09, 2011, 02:33:56 pm »

i think one problem is the pop nerf that makes pgrens really shit now

especially since you pay for 2 marders already 12 pop and if you want a mortar or some indirect fire of stukka u need additional 6-8 pop without having any infantry on the field
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LeoPhone Offline
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« Reply #150 on: February 09, 2011, 03:35:36 pm »

i think one problem is the pop nerf that makes pgrens really shit now

especially since you pay for 2 marders already 12 pop and if you want a mortar or some indirect fire of stukka u need additional 6-8 pop without having any infantry on the field

this is true.
PE is dependant on vehicles. on average vehicles are more pop than infantry.
mortar ht 6 pop -- mortar 4 pop
marder 6 pop -- atg 4/5 pop
etc.
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nugnugx Offline
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« Reply #151 on: February 09, 2011, 03:37:07 pm »

Pgrens were the only main infantry that was 4 pop
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LeoPhone Offline
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« Reply #152 on: February 09, 2011, 03:38:36 pm »

PE is the only army without normal support weapons. even though they have the 4 man hmg now.

so what? each army has its uniqueness. you could argue spamming PE inf would be better than spamming rifleman due to pop but go try to be effective with that.
rifles will do better though.
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lionel23 Offline
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« Reply #153 on: February 09, 2011, 04:28:51 pm »

I have to agree with Leophone on this one, his last post clearly shows why the pop nerf is pretty bad for PE.  You have an inferior, mainline infantry who can't really perform mainline infantry duties being they have crappy armor and a weak gun for a higher premium.  The also lack support weapons that are infantry based, meaning they use the vehicle based equivalents which is more expensive in terms of pop anyway.
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Congratulations, dear sir...I must say, never before have I seen such precise gunnery displayed. - CrazyWR (on Leaderboard Howitzers)

AmPM Offline
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« Reply #154 on: February 09, 2011, 04:30:59 pm »

To clarify matters..

PGren Rifles does 12 damage per shot

Grenadiers use the Stormtrooper rifle which does 15 damage per shot

Both have the same target tables.

PGrens do 20% less damage than Grenadiers.
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TheIcelandicManiac Offline
Resident forum troll. Fucked unkn0wns mom
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« Reply #155 on: February 09, 2011, 05:25:14 pm »

Leo has a good point andif you guys deside to rewert the changes i have a reason to start playing again
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Sometimes its like PQ doesnt carrot all.

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spinn72 Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 1802



« Reply #156 on: February 09, 2011, 05:37:52 pm »

PE now has a HMG and according to TH t3, a pak 36 which can cloak.

Goodbye PE, i missed you and your originality.
Hello Wehr v2
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cloud234 Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 363


« Reply #157 on: February 09, 2011, 07:26:08 pm »

PGrens do 20% less damage than Grenadiers.

40% less DPS. I think it has to do with the accuracy, wind up wind down ,cd and whatever at range.
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Tymathee Offline
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« Reply #158 on: February 09, 2011, 11:15:21 pm »

I think they're fine...all i keep saying is PE, PE, PE lately, no one's going wehr, and they all have g43's and they're pzgrens, not assault grens. They seem to be doing just fine.

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"I want proof!"
"I have proof!"
"Whatever, I'm still right"

Dafuq man, don't ask for proof if you'll refuse it if it's not in your favor, logic fallacy for the bloody win.
NightRain Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 3908



« Reply #159 on: February 10, 2011, 01:03:50 am »

PE now has a HMG and according to TH t3, a pak 36 which can cloak.

Goodbye PE, i missed you and your originality.
Hello Wehr v2

PE only has 3 HMGs. 1. Scout Car with MG upgrade. 2. Luftwaffen MG34. 3. SE HMG42. They got no pak36s. I don't think they'll even get one.
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