Pe Panther 3 as medium AT tank

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[nugnugx]

and stugs and stuhs cloak?

stugs can cloak  and stuh is AI not AT so it does not need to cloak because its usage is different

a jagdpanzer fits the axis philosophy of being strong defensively with high fire power, sacrificing mobility and sometimes health (marders, hetzers, tigers, king tigers, stugs, stuhs, etc)

PE does not need a defensive high fire power unit without mobility ,  there is already 50mm marder and hetzer which fit this description.

PE needs an offensive AT mobile tank.
 

tbh, a turreted tank doesn't fit pe, with the 50mm, and marders, a panther 3 type at tank doesn't seem to fit as well as a heavy fronted tank would.

So what panther and ist is doing there ? they have turrets,  you are just creating arguments to fit your theory here.

This is the type of tank you can send out to engage at guns, take a few hits and save your marders from being targeted by the atgs.

You can do the same with what i proposed.

[PonySlaystation]

PE does not need a defensive high fire power unit without mobility ,  there is already 50mm marder and hetzer which fit this description.

PE needs an offensive AT mobile tank.

Marder and 50mm both excel at both defensive and offensive operations. They are hardly a defensive unit like most AT guns.

The entire concept of Panzer Elite is that they have weak but powerful units, ie low health and high damage offensive units to peer with Whermacht defensive and damage soaking units. If you give a medium tank to PE then you would also have to give one to CW and I just don't see it happening or any reason for it, it's a step in the wrong direction. If you combine a marder and an armored car then you have two units for the same pop as a medium tank that are more mobile and can inflict more damage. One of the major reasons why players choose Panzer Elite is to gain access to these powerful units, not so that their playstyle can be a complete mirror of WM, if you don't plan to have a vehicle based company then Panzer Elite is not the choice for you.

If you still want heavier anti tank vehicles that can soak damage then there is always tank destroyer doctrine with hetzers and jagdpanther who both perform well in offensive operations, especially if you have APCR rounds.

And then there's also the fact that the devs stated that "we're not changing the core gameplay of Panzer Elite and there are no models or animations for a new tank."
I do think that AP rounds for the IST sounds like a good idea though.

[Groundfire]

Tbh, im liking the "mini panther" more and more. Just take the normal PE panther and scale it back to the belsfpanther or whatever. No one really ever uses the PE panther enough to justify it's fuel and it's role would overlap with the cheaper MBT that we would give, so why not just make the panther fit that role?

Of course, we would need a new model.

[nugnugx]

Tbh, im liking the "mini panther" more and more. Just take the normal PE panther and scale it back to the belsfpanther or whatever. No one really ever uses the PE panther enough to justify it's fuel and it's role would overlap with the cheaper MBT that we would give, so why not just make the panther fit that role?

Of course, we would need a new model.

nice  

If you give a medium tank to PE then you would also have to give one to CW and I just don't see it happening or any reason for it, it's a step in the wrong direction

CW already got firefly and Comet to come.

[PonySlaystation]

Firefly is a light AT vehicle just like the Marder and I have not heard about any planned introduction of the comet into the game, do you mean when warmap is released?

Mini panther sounds like a good idea as long as it's a nice model and not just a smaller panther. But it would more make sense if you just gave the panther some firepower.

[nugnugx]

Mini panther sounds like a good idea as long as it's a nice model and not just a smaller panther.

This thread is about this from the start  

You are contradicting yourself from the post earlier.

[Mister Schmidt]

Nug just be glad he's come around to our way of thinking, let's not drive them away!

[nugnugx]

Nug just be glad he's come around to our way of thinking, let's not drive them away!

I think he just want to oppose me , but when someone else said the same thing , he agreed.

[PonySlaystation]

No that's not it, I just formulated wrong, the mini panther sounds like a bad idea INSTEAD you should just buff the panther some.

It's more likely the power of the devs, If they want it then there's not really anything I can do to stop it. And if it's happening then I might as well state my opinion on the whole model theory, someone suggested a smaller panther but that would look really stupid.

[Groundfire]

Panther has all the firepower it needs, it's just you can get more bang for the buck outta 2 50mm HTs.

P.S., im not saying I fully support this as it still needs discussion. IMO, PE dont rly need a MBT, but i'd use it if we gave them one. I just dont want PE turning into "Fasty shooty" wehrmacht. With some doctrines you can already do that.

[nugnugx]

I just dont want PE turning into "Fasty shooty" wehrmacht. With some doctrines you can already do that.

Apart from blitzkrieg wehrmacht has always been camp heaven.

[NightRain]

Firefly is a light AT vehicle just like the Marder and I have not heard about any planned introduction of the comet into the game, do you mean when warmap is released?

Yes, Sherman armored 55 ranged tank with 125 damage is indeed a 'light AT vehicle'. It is true that Marder has 60 range and Marder also has 150 damage (165 in lockdown). Marder is not a tank, marder is a Anti tank gun. A Tank destroyer so to speak.

[Demon767]

Well 50mm is not 'HIGH FIREPOWER' most bullshit AT support you can get if your forced to use it. fucking fix the 50m. Paying both Mu and Fu for the worst AT support in the game

[Uglysori]

Well 50mm is not 'HIGH FIREPOWER' most bullshit AT support you can get if your forced to use it. fucking fix the 50m. Paying both Mu and Fu for the worst AT support in the game

What used to make them a bit OP was their ability to fire on the move.  With the increase pop and decrease accuracy to ATGs which means u can't kite in 3 50mm anymore and snipe out an ATG, would that possibly be a fix?

[smurfORnot]

I would take marder any day over 50mm,only reason for 50mm is if you spend your fuel on IST's,panthers etc...and you are forced to take em cuz there are not rly any other 'viable' AT options around.

[Tymathee]

lol 50mm the worst at support? its one of the best tbh i love those things. if i had the muni's and if they didn't cost so much in teh support pool i'd run about 6-8 of 'em in dual call ins, freakin rape all allied armor except the heavier stuff

[chefarzt]

They miss like crazy, cost 110 muns, and get raped by vanilla rifles. Only reason i got them is that u can get 3 for 1 marder (munition excluded). 

[Groundfire]

They miss like crazy, cost 110 muns, and get raped by vanilla rifles. Only reason i got them is that u can get 3 for 1 marder (munition excluded). 

Your hyperbole is showing.

It's a no cloak pak38 on a Wehr HT, practically immune to small arms fire.

The 50mm HT is an awesome Mid level AT solution. If you are using them (especially in 1s and 2s) against pershings and churchills with no support and getting destroyed, well herp derp, ya get what ya get.

[chefarzt]

Its not immune to small arms fire. Get ur shit straight.Only thing immune is the inf halftracks. Just saying. And as for for missing, ive seens the worst misses ever in my last 2 games, like 45 degrees from target. Might have been bad luck . But well....

[Groundfire]

How long did you have those vanilla rifles firing at the rear armor of your 50mm to kill it? 5 minutes? 7 minutes?

Everything in this game has a chance to penetrate everything, but that's immune to small arms in my book.