Villers Bocage

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[tank130]

I want to review each of these maps to see why they are not getting played. I would like people who ACTUALLY PLAYED THE MAP to give their input on what they liked and disliked about the map. What could be done to improve the map.

The the owner of the map will have to the option to make the suggested changes or allow someone else to make the changes for them. If the changes are just too overwhelming and not worth the efforts, we will just remove the map.

Show Some respect:

People put a lot of work into these maps. Comments like "it sucks" will not be tolerated. Post useful, helpful comments or just don't post.
We need input from people who actually want to help and better the playing environment.

If you can't play nice, just don't post please.

If you need a screen shot of the map to show notes etc, let me know and I will unpack it and post the shot.

[tank130]

[8thRifleRegiment]

People avoid this because of its enormous bias towards certain strats, when people pick this map, you know the gimmick bus is coming to town. Tight spaces leave PE grasping at straws to micro thier units. Bringing vet here is a death sentance, and support spam dominates most of the left side of the map. It should be a 3v3 if anything. 4v4 brings about too many units in  such a small space it removes all of the maps strategical aspects becuase theres simply no space on the map where you wont find someone.

[skaffa]

Town has too many buildings making it too compact. This results in a clusterfuck. Imagine moving 25 pop thru this map, its gonna be annoying. The sides are open which is nice, but they are too narrow making them easy to lock down and hard to flank. The map looks nice. Imo remove some buildings on the sides of the map as well as in the middle to create a few open fields - not just building vs building fighting.

[aeroblade56]

It really is a pain to move through this map to many buildings

[Unkn0wn]

It's a terrible map for EIR, it was designed for a vCOH campaign and had almost no changes made to it for EIR gameplay to work in it.  Get rid of it tbh

[TheWindCriesMary]

Please don't get rid of it. It's a great map.

Had some of the best 4v4's i've ever played in EiR on this map.


It is unconventional and it is different than other maps, but that's what makes EiR a rich experience: different types of terrain leading to different game atmospheres.

The homogenization of EiR maps to a single type of gameplay is not only wrong, it's ultimately harmful.

[tank130]

The homogenization of EiR maps to a single type of gameplay is not only wrong, it's ultimately harmful.

But they do need to maintain some standards to remain part of our mod. We have certain standards of play we would like to adhere to. If our mod becomes a cluster fuck of this that and the next thing,then we loose our vision.

Our visions will never be shared by all, but it's our vision to adhere to.....

On another note Wind: if you look in your THQ\companyofhereos\archives folder, is this sga in there?

[TheWindCriesMary]

But they do need to maintain some standards to remain part of our mod. We have certain standards of play we would like to adhere to. If our mod becomes a cluster fuck of this that and the next thing,then we loose our vision.

I agree with that.

The thing is, in this particular case, this map doesn't come into conflict with that philosophy. It's just a well-made (Relic quality) urban map. It's nice to have maps like this and Carentan that, while not perfect, give a sense of variety to map selection.

These maps come with the knowledge that they're not going to get played as much as a Schindel or a Neuville because they don't have small, easily avoided towns flanked by giant fields (which EiR player's love for ease/convenience of gameplay). But that's ok as long as those maps are available.

Every now and then though you get a game full of players who don't mind (and indeed like the idea) of fighting in different types of terrain that might be more difficult or favour certain units, though, and in those instances it's great to have a map like Villers Bocage around.

Also, they're important for the Warmap in that it will, at least as far as I've been able to gather, have certain sectors or objectives that will require certain maps to be played. This is a great idea because taking a major objective should require a bloody and intense, dense city fight in order to mirror historical accuracy.

[Hicks58]

Personally I love this map and most other urban environments.

Getting people to play urban maps though... Too much QQ about pathing.

Shit, I'm a vehicle/armour focused person and I love urban environments.

[brn4meplz]

The only real issue i have with this map is that some of the people who still play CoH can't actually run 3vs3's on a map of this design quality.

Theres alot of detail in this map and some people just have shit computers. That's not the maps fault and I enjoy this map. Maps like Arnhem winter(Salan's map) and other urban maps definitely bring something unique to the gameplay.

[tank130]

Just kinda thinking out load.......


What if the city area got turned 90. Trim the edges so there is good flanking.
Would that create to possible battle areas pushing top to bottom. In other words, the two main roads would fought over......

Just throwing out ideas, may be shit, might work. I would have to get into WB and have a closer look.

[Unkn0wn]

I suppose if a few more buildings got wrecked or removed and the streets were widened a bit it probably would end up being better. It has quite a bit of potential, but it needs some serious time put into it by an EIR mapper for that potential to be unlocked.

[tank130]

but it needs some serious time put into it by an EIR mapper for that potential to be unlocked.

Well, I guess that rules me and unknown out......

[TheWindCriesMary]

To be honest fiddling around with a great map like this is just tinkering for the sake of it.

It's god a warm place in the hearts of a few players as it is, but being an Urban map it's going to have a sizeable portion of the community that won't be interested no matter what.

Once the warmap is more realized it will get the recognition it deserves.

[tank130]

Once the warmap is more realized it will get the recognition it deserves.

You mean when people are forced to play it, it will get played more often......

[TheWindCriesMary]

You mean when people are forced to play it, it will get played more often......

Yes and no.

While my understanding of the intended warmap features does entail that it will have certain objectives that require certain maps to be played, I also think another advantage of the warmap is that it will encourage EiR players to be a little more open minded about types of EiR maps.

In the case of Villers Bocage we have an extremely well made map (Relic quality) in terms of pathing and balance that only gets avoided by a section of EIR's players because it is an urban map.

Right now current meta opinion is that you should build a certain company and that that company should need to be customized, changed or have variations in order to be competitive in all your games.

This in turns lends itself to most players only liking one particular kind of map so that each game is as predictable as possible.

Maps like Villers Bocage, because they are urban (and thus nonstandard) fly in the face of that.

[aeroblade56]

Plz Goobies, the warmap isn't going to get updated soon. so don't count on this implementation of map cycling

[tank130]

While my understanding of the intended warmap features does entail that it will have certain objectives that require certain maps to be played, I also think another advantage of the warmap is that it will encourage EiR players to be a little more open minded about types of EiR maps.

That option has definitely been suggested, but it has never been on the official dev team 'gonna happen' list.

The problem is that enough people feel that would be too restrictive; That players should have every option available to them.
So we end up with watered down options like give extra bonuses for playing the suggested map.

We have taken this mod and watered down so much of it that people do not know how to adapt or play anymore. Everyone builds a company based on resources from the Warmap and playing on Nueville. If they had to change their company composition to play a map, all hell would break loose......

At Areo - What would you update the Warmap to? Or are you just suggestion a reset.

[aeroblade56]

I do agree that options should be left open and when the warmap cards ever get updated into the game this in turn with adding maps to be played in certain sectors Would provide a reasonable incentive for someone to actually advance on the warmap.

Right now there is no reason for me to play out of the usual maps because i see no reason to?. Or if you added like a announcment saying

This friday-sunday only play on egleton if we get up to 30+ games players will receive like 2 reward points. If Allies capture Bremen and axis capture Genova get 5 reward points.


And each week provide something So with that in mind you could also reset the warmap and then you have a warmap without cards not forcing but offering people to play deffirent maps or attack certain sectors and in turn providing a incentive to play.