Patch 0.7.9.Z.4

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[I2ay]

Whose this rocketranger guy? I've played two games with him now and he hasn't called anything on in either. He just surrenders in the first minute...

[Marlboroman]

Great job on neutering stormtroopers! nice that you took elite armor away the only thing that brought them up to par with rangers mandos etc etc, oh and really cool i got to buy the old assault nades now before i can get the useful upgrades keep up the good work, (btw whoever told you not to rework that blitz doct was totally mental).

[TheIcelandicManiac]

Stormys are still way better tbh.

[Marlboroman]

unless i missed something really obvious they recieved no significant buffs combatwise and lost elite armor dub shrecks and quad mp44s, so how are they better?

[TheIcelandicManiac]

mainly 95Hp per man, They can cloak, have 2 bundles at vet 2, and after the most idiotic change by whoever made the infantry doc of putting the triage at t2 instead of 1 makes it that unlike the rangers they can heal to full health after a battle while an infantry player requres a Brit with a ccs to heal his(only applys early war with the healing ofcourse).

[tank130]

Please take your balance discussion to the appropriate forum.

[Hicks58]

unless i missed something really obvious they recieved no significant buffs combatwise and lost elite armor dub shrecks and quad mp44s, so how are they better?

Yes you did miss something really obvious. Look at the bottom section T2 that gives them back their +2 MP44's and +1 Shreck. If you want to run powerful Stormies, you've gotta invest some unlocks. You also missed them being 95HP per man and being able to cloak, but apparently they needed an extra -25% incoming accuracy to become useful vs elite infantry? Try using bundle grenades, both Nikomas and SpartanMarine will attest to how dangerous they can be to infantry of any description.

They also get +1 bundle grenade with the mid T4, and still retain +1 at vet 2, making for a total possible of 3 bundles on a squad. That's an insane amount of AI firepower for 45 MU, and it's still not good enough?

Even against Thompson Rangers and Sten Commandos I had Stormtroopers WITHOUT x4 MP44's perform more than well enough.

[Marlboroman]

yes and by making the better unlocks a doctrinal unlock youve made it so i got to choose between either gimped storms or gimped tigers and storms (No BK) oh and unless the bundle nade isnt dodged (Which it is 90% of the time btw ) the aforementioned ranger squad will beat the stormtrooper squad EVEN with 4x mp44 which is a far pricier upgrade than thompsons x4 if i remember correctly.

[Marlboroman]

i will however say that you did a generally good job with the patch, only other issue is the way you buffed the tiger but whatever.

[TheIcelandicManiac]

yes and by making the better unlocks a doctrinal unlock youve made it so i got to choose between either gimped storms or gimped tigers and storms (No BK) oh and unless the bundle nade isnt dodged (Which it is 90% of the time btw ) the aforementioned ranger squad will beat the stormtrooper squad EVEN with 4x mp44 which is a far pricier upgrade than thompsons x4 if i remember correctly.

actually 4 mp44s and a tommy upgrade on rangers cost the same and at the same time 4xmp44 storms actually beat rangers if its the fight involvs moving from long to close like an actual fight is.
granted rangers do have the ability of keeping a smg if a guy goes down but even that is quite limited when there is no real healing.


# m1_thompson_smg.rgd
  | Zaxis S DPS = 16.27
  | Zaxis M DPS = 2.81
  | Zaxis L DPS = 1.11


# mp44_assault_rifle.rgd
  | Zaxis S DPS = 19.43
  | Zaxis M DPS = 3.91
  | Zaxis L DPS = 1.02

[PonySlaystation]

those dps stats are for the scoped stg44s.

[TheIcelandicManiac]

i know, i copyd the wrong thing

I actually forgot to point out in that stat that the MP44 has a  0.75 accuracy modifyer vs Elite armor while the tomson SMG has a 0.75 damage modifyer vs infantry armour, and you also have to take in account the general luck thats involved but yea, storms are still better tbh.

[Tymathee]

The point is, stormtroopers with elite armor were an insane unlock, so they were taken away. Stormtroopers aren't mainline infantry, they're ambush and its annoying as heck having stormtroopers sneak behind your line with 4 schecks, clobbering you then popping blitz to get out of there, theres no other unit that can do that.

Now you use them as ambush, put them with ur units to protect them, enemy attacks, fire.

[Hicks58]

yes and by making the better unlocks a doctrinal unlock youve made it so i got to choose between either gimped storms or gimped tigers and storms (No BK) oh and unless the bundle nade isnt dodged (Which it is 90% of the time btw ) the aforementioned ranger squad will beat the stormtrooper squad EVEN with 4x mp44 which is a far pricier upgrade than thompsons x4 if i remember correctly.

Learn to use cloak. The best part of Stormtroopers is that you are rarely forced into engaging your enemy in the open, and if you are then you're doing it wrong. Too many times have I let my opponent get pre-occupied with a frontline unit to make a squad or support weapon disappear that he isn't paying attention to.

Gimped Tigers? You think you NEED the Blitz ability to use Tigers? I've NEVER used Blitz with Tigers and I've performed very well with them, and that was before we decided to knock up the health.

4x MP44 is a far pricier upgrade than 4x Thompsons? What? So you're trying to tell me that 140 MU is somehow substantially more than... 140 MU? Not to mention a Stormtrooper squad can be either sat in green cover or be behind your target when it opens up on them (Being behind a target can mean you kill 2 guys before the target has finished turning around to start shooting you if you've decloaked at close range).

As for Thompson Rangers beating 4x MP44 Storms, it's about who fires first, who closes the distance, and who has cover. Guess who can put all three of those in their favour.

[Spartan_Marine88]

As for Thompson Rangers beating 4x MP44 Storms, it's about who fires first, who closes the distance, and who has cover. Guess who can put all three of those in their favour.

Might it have something to do with a unit that can close to point blank before the other unit even knows there there? And potentially start the firefight off with a grenade that is hard to dodge due to not seeing it coming?

[aeroblade56]

open gun fight rangers should win. other then that have fun fighting units that have first attack that kills half the squad.

[Tymathee]

open gun fight rangers should win. other then that have fun fighting units that have first attack that kills half the squad.

probably, mainly because of armor and men  but if it were 4 rangers vs 4 storms, storms win. Also because its 4 as vs 6, more firepower is being focused on the 4 than the 4 on the 6 since it spreads the fire among the units in the squad.

[Poppi]

Airborne pool values are wacky as shit. if u want to make some kind of airborne army ure stuck with like 200+ on everything. It just doesnt fit.
Tbh.:Remove the pool restrictions

the problem is equipping RRs and Bars to AB units, that takes an insane amount out of your pool values. Im not going to say that you should solve this problem by having only 4 RRs in your company, but ya that helps. You are pretty much forced to use the ammo supply drop T2 unlock.

[nikomas]

Yeah... That drop is going to need pool as well.

[nikomas]

You're not supposed to be able to field a fully upgraded doctrinal coy without taking a pool hit