[PE] PE General Balance and Theme Issues

[Guest]

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever

Login with username, password and session length

[AmPM]

TLDR; My thoughts on PE.

For everyone else that wants to read on these forums.

PE have been the beaten and abused red headed stepchild of EIRR since their inception. They don't have the units or infantry to play a game of "hold the line" or to push through support units. This leaves them with Flanking, Speed, and mobile support options for weak infantry.

The problem with these things are that they all cost Fuel, no other doctrine is as fuel dependant as PE. Your basic capping unit, the Scout Car, comes in at 20 fuel, which doesn't seem like much, unless you plan to use them as intended and get 10 or so. On top of that, to allow them to defend an area (required in EIRR) you have to upgrade with the HMG for 60MU (fine) and another 15 FU (not so fine). This puts a basic capping unit with upgraded half useful HMG (only works when locked down, which only works in some areas) at 180MP, 75MU (with repair), 35 FU.

The Armored Car, your basic AI tool, is 9 pool, 9. The IHT is 5 pool. To give you an idea, Vehicle Pool for Tank Destroyers is 42. That means I can get 4 IHTs, 2 AC's and 2 scout cars before I am over pool.

In my mind, I think PE should be a mobile doctrine based around LV's that can die to small arms (SC, IHT, LATHT, etc) that relies on speed and hitting power to keep the initiative. Right now you have speed, you have hitting power, but you have no redundancy. So once your IHT/AC gets instantly killed by the 3-5 ATGs + AT infantry and Armor on the field you are done with the mobile part, and the hard hitting part.

What I am proposing is changes that allow PE to have their light armor, with reductions in fuel cost in some places that allows them to get light armor and the required support for it. I think that these changes will do that.

Drop Scout Car FU cost, drop IHT Pool, drop support unit FU costs.

Basically, PE can play mobile with balanced support with about 200 more fuel than they currently have, so free that up in the units that they need to have to do the job.

Scout Car I would take from 180/20 to 200/15, change the HMG upgrade to 10FU instead of 15, leave MU price alone.

Lower Pool cost on Armored Car from 9 to 5.

Reduce IHT Pool from 5 to 3.

Reduce FU cost on LATHT, MHT, MUHT and Vampire about 10 FU each.

Reduce Hetzer FU cost to 180.

This would allow PE to field more light vehicles at the cost of Infantry, allow redundancy in units, and in some (Hetzer) put them in their proper price range.

PE should be a faction based on their light armor, it provides every piece of support and is integral to their infantry use. Right now PE does not have the synergy between infantry and light vehicles mostly due to prices. Infantry price changes might be in order as well, or perhaps looking at the casualty rate of IHTs.

[hans]

i have a question, do you play PE?

[CrazyWR]

I'll second AMPM's post.


And yes Hans, he does, rather effectively.

[hans]

I'll second AMPM's post.


And yes Hans, he does, rather effectively.

kk, anyway agree with AmPM

[Mysthalin]

I generally agree, but not with the scout car fuel cost change. It's already insanely efficient at it's job for the price you pay (best sniper-hunter in the game, caps very efficiently, can become an HMG for a nominal increment in price).

My main gripe with PE, and EiRR in general, is the pool restrictions. Even if you could sort of argue that they are necessary for other factions (the only 2 things, for instance, that I can think of as potentially problematic in americans would be greyhound spam and ranger zook spam with TR. Effective greyhound spam has been eliminated as a possibility with the up-scale in price years ago, and ranger spam is very easy to do efficiently as is anyway). In PE they are done so wrong it's not even funny, as the pool restrictions were thrown in completely arbitrarily and randomly and never actually adjusted to reflect the needs of the faction.

[AmPM]

My biggest gripe with the Scout Car is the your territory only HMG that can only set up in optimal areas (no ground clutter). If they fixed the ground clutter issue that would at least be something.

The HMG is ok, but it is only half an HMG really, it can't be used to support an offense. I tend to think that for those limitations it's fair to drop the fuel 5 points.

EDIT: This might change depending on Armored Car and IHT fixes.

[terrapinsrock]

I support this post as well.

If anything the pool restrictions are thething hurting PE the most.

[TheIcelandicManiac]

I generally agree, but not with the scout car fuel cost change. It's already insanely efficient at it's job for the price you pay (best sniper-hunter in the game, caps very efficiently, can become an HMG for a nominal increment in price).

wasnt it smurf that broke your epic winsteak with a boatload of them?


Also, love it.

[Mysthalin]

? What you on about?

[AmPM]

Let's try and keep this thread clean and on topic. Don't want this derailed.

[UndeathWrath]

I agree with OP. Good place to start and see where PE stands from there.

[ick312]

you have a very good vision how PE should be.

But in my opinion are neither pool changes nor Price changes  the solution. From my experience are support weapons the death for pe and tbh i dont think that more of the very powerful PE vehicles can solve this issue since they are knocked out by 2 atg shots.
More vehicles could force the allies to use more mines and stickies again. But it wont help to deal with atgs.
I think that the infantry needs to be competetive, cause there are situations, where a flanking is complicated.

[AmPM]

Mortar, IST, smoke and Armored cars, smoke and AT/Inc nades, sniper, flank.

Pool and fuel are the biggest hurdles.

[XIIcorps]

Don't mind ick and his QQathon.

This seems like the perfect foundation to bring PE up to par with the other factions.

Tho I'm still afraid of ac spam especially with the lowered pool .
Myst was/notorious for this.

As for the scout car, I can't believe it still has the Vcoh requirements to setup.

And also not sure about the hetzer price decrease it seems fine as is.

But the IHT AC and SC definately need love

[AmPM]

Don't mind ick and his QQathon.

This seems like the perfect foundation to bring PE up to par with the other factions.

Tho I'm still afraid of ac spam especially with the lowered pool .
Myst was/notorious for this.

As for the scout car, I can't believe it still has the Vcoh requirements to setup.

And also not sure about the hetzer price decrease it seems fine as is.

But the IHT AC and SC definately need love

I considered AC spam, but to be honest, 8 of them at 40 pool isn't that scary. With the amount of AT available you shouldn't have too many issues fighting them off, and it gives AT Rifles a reason for existence.

[I2ay]

Make assault grenadiers a viable unit please.

[AmPM]

Make assault grenadiers a viable unit please.

I wanted to see if they were better with a more easily affordable IHT and support units first.

Baby steps towards balance are much better than giant clumsy strides.

If anything, including some basic healing would be the change. Otherwise it's like Terror MP44 Grens without Medkits..

Maybe a pool decrease since they are priced a little high on that, but not enough to change the company builds too much.

[XIIcorps]

I considered AC spam, but to be honest, 8 of them at 40 pool isn't that scary. With the amount of AT available you shouldn't have too many issues fighting them off, and it gives AT Rifles a reason for existence.

True more abundant lvs for PE would make boys rifles have reason to exist.

[AmPM]

True more abundant lvs for PE would make boys rifles have reason to exist.

Those and AP round HMGs...even Bren button to slow them down a little.

[XIIcorps]

But with an increase to lvs for PE id like to see an increase to bren and bren mmg turn rates.
To bring brits up to scratch in that respect