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hetzer
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Topic: hetzer (Read 8680 times)
0 Members and 8 Guests are viewing this topic.
ick312
EIR Veteran
Posts: 534
hetzer
«
on:
June 03, 2014, 09:16:42 am »
well,
anyone who used them can tell. (Just made a test game to make sure)
Any suggestions what to do to make them useable again?
Logged
Quote from: tank130 on April 18, 2013, 10:06:07 pm
I don't know Wind, that whole 21 virgins thing kinda peaked my interest a little .......
Quote from: EliteGren on December 08, 2013, 06:10:28 pm
From fucking kids to fucking christ, jesus heartmann. Just stop already you filthy monster, you are only making it worse
Smokaz
Honoured Member
Posts: 11418
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #1 on:
June 03, 2014, 10:30:07 am »
With ACPR they are somewhat viable, the ambush does good damage.
I would like if it had a 1.2 or so dmg modifier vs light armor which closes on it to fast and generally fuck them up too much at short range for the damage they are allowed to do.
Generally we use modifiers too little in this our patches. Some of the vcoh modifiers we removed have improved the game, especially concering the hetzer (m18 for instance..)
People will mention the range of the hetzer, Wind thought it was the best medium... Range is good, but the base penetration of the hetzer also gets worse eat range.
Logged
SlippedHerTheBigOne: big penis puma
SlippedHerTheBigOne: and i have no repairkits
SlippedHerTheBigOne: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
GrayWolf
Development
Posts: 1590
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #2 on:
June 03, 2014, 11:04:15 am »
Hetzers (10 pop) are bad. Marders (6 pop) are far better option.
Logged
skaffa
Honoured Member
Posts: 3130
The very best player of one of the four factions.
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #3 on:
June 03, 2014, 11:19:36 am »
Make em good vs infantry.
Logged
Quote from: deadbolt
bad luck skaffa> creates best and most played eir maps
> hated for creating best and most played eir maps
Quote from: Tachibana
47k new all time record?
Quote from: deadbolt
Don't knock it til uve tried it bitchface, this isn't anything like salads version. Besides u said a semois conversion would never work, now look that's the most played map, ohgodwhy.jpg r u map lead
PonySlaystation
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4136
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #4 on:
June 03, 2014, 11:51:41 am »
Hetzer and Stug both cost too much pop (StugIV is now 10 pop for some reason) to be worth fielding for an AT unit. They don't have a rotatable turret and they can't fight infantry well. The Stug needs to come back to 8 pop, the extra range doesn't compensate for 2 pop. The Hetzer, while a decent AT unit, is not worth 10 pop when Marder is 6 pop and 50mm Halftrack is 5 pop.
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Sharks are not monsters Henley, they are cute, cuddly and misunderstood. They love humans. sometimes they love TOO much. They love people so much that sometimes their kisses separate people into two flailing pieces which are consumed by other sharks in a frenzy of peace and joy.
Mister Schmidt
Lawmaker
Posts: 5006
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #5 on:
June 03, 2014, 11:53:08 am »
Stug is 8 pop tbh?
Or is that just in the launcher?
«
Last Edit: June 03, 2014, 11:58:54 am by Mister Schmidt
»
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Quote from: xez0 on August 29, 2014, 10:57:01 am
and 6th " Main Thing " is you have to Chant " hare krishna hare krishna krishna krishna hare hare hare rama hare rama rama rama hare hare ".
Quote from: Smokaz on November 22, 2011, 09:01:38 am
"Seeing Bigdick in his full sado mask attire, David couldn't help but feel a tingle in his special place.."
nikomas
Shameless Perv
Posts: 4286
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #6 on:
June 03, 2014, 12:00:43 pm »
It was 10 pop a while back, it's been 8 again for a while now.
You have to remember pony only updates his info every 3rd month or so
Logged
"You can always count on Americans to do the right thing—after they've tried everything else."
Quote from: PonySlaystation
The officer is considerably better than a riflemen squad at carrying weapons.
Officers have good accuracy so they will hit most targets.
CrazyWR
EIR Veteran
Posts: 3616
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #7 on:
June 03, 2014, 12:15:04 pm »
Hetzers have never been useful...
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Quote from: Ununoctium on September 03, 2009, 07:45:25 am
1. New tactics? it's like JAWS, first one in the water dies
Quote from: jackmccrack on February 09, 2012, 12:47:54 pm
RCA-land where shells fall like raindrops and the Captain is an invincible god
terrapinsrock
EIR Veteran
Posts: 1009
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #8 on:
June 03, 2014, 12:31:46 pm »
Yea, I've been advocating for buffing the Hetzer for forever
It just costs too much in terms of resources and pop, and even with APCR, it performs meh at best. Plus the heavy HHAT meta hasn't helped it either.
It really could use a buff of some sort (maybe increased pen?)
Logged
Quote from: XIIcorps on June 04, 2013, 09:50:56 am
Bit hard when its flaunted infront of you as a broken reward piece of ass you'll never get to shag with.
Current Vets:
Mister Schmidt
Lawmaker
Posts: 5006
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #9 on:
June 03, 2014, 01:20:18 pm »
I was determined to find a viable Hetzer build when I returned
Lost 6 games in a row
#justsaying
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Shabtajus
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2564
The very best player of one of the four factions.
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #10 on:
June 03, 2014, 02:41:57 pm »
Hetzer.marder.stug.g-vagon.50mm all of those units are great in hands who know how to use them. Its way harder to use hetzer than etc panther which is dedicated td so as hetzer is. Most ppl go nuts cuz of hard micro and misinformation what hetzer is suposed to do. You have 50 range unit after all with acces to ambush bonus. If that dont say you nothing than well i will volunteer showing you how hetzers can hetz
Logged
Quote from: TheWindCriesMary on April 08, 2013, 11:10:04 am
I feel like if Smokaz and Shab met up it would be a 50/50 tossup to see which one of them robbed the other first.
Quote from: Hicks58 on May 04, 2013, 01:59:39 pm
Tries to convince people he's a good guy,says things like this. Scumbag Shab.
Smokaz
Honoured Member
Posts: 11418
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #11 on:
June 03, 2014, 02:51:26 pm »
One thing we haven't thought about is simply moving hetzer out of the confines of the generalist anti tank.
Hellcat and m10 was differentiated nicely. We solved this overlap very well.
PE don't need 10 pop hetzer to snipe from range - marder is too effective in comparison. And they both have the same weaknesses (infantry charge, flanking)
What about increasing the price to hellcat fuel levels - upping the Hp to 646 - make it 0.15 accuracy vs inf and give it even better armor? Give the ambush a slight slow effect (0.5 coh speed) lasting 5 seconds and give it faster reverse.
This unit needs to be worth it to use over the marder (in some situations) other than having better armor and ability to snipe 1 man.
But I'm not sure, like I posted earlier, with ACPR + Ambush the hetzer is not bad. But I wouldn't play it in the tournament unless I was very sure what I was playing against.
Logged
terrapinsrock
EIR Veteran
Posts: 1009
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #12 on:
June 03, 2014, 03:09:57 pm »
Dunno had quite a few of these over the years, and even managed to have a coy of 2 vet 5s and a couple of vet 4s so I'd say I've got a good idea of how to play the Hetz:
But this was before the AB coy rework (May '13 I think?)
Anyways, I think Smokaz is right, we need to somehow differentiate the Hetzer from the Marder, because the Marder is better in everyway in terms of AT.
«
Last Edit: June 03, 2014, 03:40:03 pm by Smokaz
»
Logged
Mister Schmidt
Lawmaker
Posts: 5006
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #13 on:
June 03, 2014, 03:27:20 pm »
Anyway, on a serious note, I would say the requirement for vet 1 before having the cloaking ability should be removed.
Logged
terrapinsrock
EIR Veteran
Posts: 1009
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #14 on:
June 03, 2014, 03:30:59 pm »
Quote from: Mister Schmidt on June 03, 2014, 03:27:20 pm
Anyway, on a serious note, I would say the requirement for vet 1 before having the cloaking ability should be removed.
Wait, didn't that get removed a patch or 2 ago?
«
Last Edit: June 03, 2014, 03:40:22 pm by Smokaz
»
Logged
Smokaz
Honoured Member
Posts: 11418
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #15 on:
June 03, 2014, 03:40:54 pm »
Any further flaming/trolling/offtopic and I will ask for the person in question to get a 'free' break from the balance forum.
Retard posts deleted.
Lay it off ray/aero, please.
«
Last Edit: June 03, 2014, 03:57:22 pm by Smokaz
»
Logged
XIIcorps
Donator
Posts: 2558
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #16 on:
June 03, 2014, 05:07:44 pm »
Its a perfect example of a redundant unlock.
It could certainly use some buffs vs hhat pen wise.
Cloak should be vet 0.
Maybe give it a lock down abilty too ?
Logged
Quote from: Heartmann on December 03, 2013, 11:20:45 am
some of My kids i work with shower me
NightRain
EIR Veteran
Posts: 3908
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #17 on:
June 03, 2014, 10:35:01 pm »
Hetzer has one of the best armors in game. It does suffer from same thing as StuGs do aka low health. What Hetzer lacks is what a StuG doesn't is damage modifiers. 87.5 damage on a tank destroyer with no modifiers? It could do with some modifiers, it might love that damage buff vs all targets.
From long range vs a Sherman its 50% chance to penetrate. This is further increased with APCR but yeah, dice rolls are a bitch.
We do have to congratulate it having a decent reload speed.
Logged
Quote from: Unkn0wn on June 05, 2011, 04:01:40 am
Because a forum post should be like a woman's skirt. Long enough to cover the subject material, but short enough to keep things interesting.
Mister Schmidt
Lawmaker
Posts: 5006
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #18 on:
June 04, 2014, 03:05:06 am »
Quote from: Shabtajus on June 03, 2014, 02:41:57 pm
.marder.stug.g-vagon.50mm
Every single one of those is a hell of a lot easier and also more effective than the Hetzer.
Marder is much better at AT, much cheaper too.
Stug can fulfill AT quite well, especially with various doctrine buffs, and with the MG and crush is effective at AI.
Geschutzwagon is highly effective AT, especially with Rapid Fire, and again, has an MG upgrade.
50mm is a cheap and highly mobile Pak, suffers from bad pathing like all PE units but is much easier to make up its cost than the Hetzer.
The Hetzer does have long range yes, but its penetration chances are pitiful at that long range.
The MG upgrade doesn't seem too effective to me, I don't think it's as powerful as the Stug one, but that's just an observation, I'm not sure on that. Honestly, it is just not good enough for it's cost.
Logged
Shabtajus
EIR Veteran
Posts: 2564
The very best player of one of the four factions.
Re: hetzer
«
Reply #19 on:
June 04, 2014, 05:37:58 am »
Quote from: Mister Schmidt on June 04, 2014, 03:05:06 am
Every single one of those is a hell of a lot easier and also more effective than the Hetzer.
i doubt ya ever used g-vagons and 50mm. Those 2 have the most fucked up pathing tbfh
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