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Author Topic: A few thoughts..... Ok mebbe more than a few :)  (Read 9889 times)
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NCOIC Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 73


« on: May 31, 2009, 06:47:44 pm »

Many here now know me as Buzzcutt on the Eirr server and have been singularly impressed with my win loss record. So I think that I am now more than enough qualified to of course weigh in on things that might be looked into about tightening up EiRR's more glaring issues... Smiley

Firstly I want to again start off with a HUGE thanx to all who've spent valuable time and effort to create and maintain the gem that EiRR is. It is really great fun to play in this virtual world. To those who's tireless efforts continue to make EiRR an awesome experience a big hats off in respect and thanx!!! In addition I'd like to also thank all of the great players of EiRR who have also given me advice and help in my continuing quest to take back the continent of europe from the valiant but misguided troops of the axis forces. You guys know who ya are and I always appreciate yer patience while explaining to me the ins and outs of EiRR's various units, tactics and doctrines. Thanks very very much!!

Ok now the with that I think that while EiRR is a gem it is a slightly flawed one that requires some tweaking to fully realize it's awesome potential.... Yeah here it comes, the noobs advice to the pros Smiley....

Anyway I am an Armor buff and for some reason continue to play the Armor doctrine doctrine despite my massive inability to convert my love of the US army armor branch into steady wins....or at least a few more than I've got now!  Smiley

So I'd like a look taken at a few things that might need some adjustment..in my humble noob opinion.....Cool

Firstly I'd like an ability to build some repair facility similar to fielded by some of the axis factions. While inferior to german  armor in most respects like armor, optics and ordnance, the US armor was famously and rightfully renowned for ease of operation, maintenance and repair. So while I don't expect to go toe to toe with a panther with a sherman, the sherman should be VERY easy to repair. As a matter of fact the first panthers fielded had over 50% of them go t*ts up at the battle of kursk just because they broke down... engine fires being one of the main culprits. Mainly because they were very mechanically complicated in addition to the normal teething pains of any new piece of gear in combat usage. So while it took 5 shermans on average to take out a panther/tiger (except the british sherman Firefly with it's 17pdr gun) in many cases most of them were recovered and restored to combat status in a very short time...(with a new crew unfortunately Tongue)  I think that this could be modeled better in EiRR. At least fix the field repair thingy and mebbe allow it sooner fer less PP.

Stealth..... this romulan cloaking technology of units of both sides is kinda SF'y. Snipers are one thing but cloaking a  whole friggin squad for more than lets say an initial ambush (dunno how to model that here) is just plain bogus.  Especially if they are moving in open terrain and not woods. A PAK/AT gun was very effective in getting surprise with a first shot or two with it's very low silhouette but after that it it should be as easy to see as anything else is on the EiRR battlefield. Cloaking should only be a one shot start up thing and after that they should be as easily tracked as any large gun would be.

And while I am thinking of AT guns what's with the thing about purchasing AT rounds fer an AT gun? AT guns fire AT rounds.. there were some better versions like HVAP - High Velocity Armor Piercing (issued to TDs and not as much to AT guns, and they were VERY rare) or HESH - High Explosive Squash Head - rounds (late war british invention not sure though of actual field date) but they were not very numerous at all. I'd think that an AT gun has AT rounds, mebbe some HE and a few smoke but AT being the most numerous. Fix that please Smiley

Next...well this has already been talked to death (by me as well Smiley ) but US rifles need some tweaking. Garands were the first semi automatic rifle issued on a large scale to ANY army and could put out a tremendous amount of fire power. So it is disconcerting to see/hear a lame single pow! from a US rifle squad when they engage targets.... wrong answer. A bolt action rifle is just not gonna put out that much lead white and blue in the same amount of time. One might argue that a bolt action rifle like the Kar was more accurate but if yer keeping yer head down due to the large amount of fire from a US squad it is moot...Fix this please! Smiley
.
.... Now to infantry AT capability; the stickies modeled in CoH were the cinematic inspiration of Saving Private Ryan... they were not used on the scale modeled in EiRR/CoH. They are what is known as a 'field expedient' method of anti armor, i.e a band aid to be used in the event of a total lack of anti armor weapons... they were not issued as a standard piece of kit. So mebbe a few more bazookas might be in order here. Or also a rifle grenade version that is more effective against light armored vehicles. (BTW armor can be surprisingly vulnerable a guy in my unit took out an M60 tank by a lucky toss of  a smoke grenade though the hatch... never saw people bail out of a tank that fast! Smiley ) In any event US rifles need more AT capability that doesn't require one to rush a friggin tank. Fix it please! Smiley

Ok that's enough fer now! Smiley Like I said at the beginning of the post EiRR is an awesome piece of work. And I know that it is a work in progress so there's bound to be adjusting and tweaking and all of that. I just wanted to put out a few ideas....

BTW this stuff is obviously more geared towards my experience (or lack of) with the US Armor tree. Other doctrines may have modeled things differently and I am sure (from reading posts here! Smiley ) that there's enuff tweaking and stuff to go around

Anyway thanks fer reading and please keep up the good work devs and all who've helped on EiRR
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panzerjager1943 Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 659


« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2009, 07:00:29 pm »

The only one I'll dispute on part of the team would be in regards to the M1 Garand.
This is because if, in EIRR, M1 Garands and Gewehr 43s fired at the rate that they can in real life, the weapons would become highly imbalanced; the cost effectiveness of US Infantry would soar and that of the Axis troops would fall. While the Semi-Automatic Rifles may indeed have been battle-turners, this is a game, and so balance must exist for it to be fun. We also do not like to do stat-changes; we like to keep most things the way they are in Retail, so people can look at CoH-Stats site and easily gather data, or to easily get into the game with knowledge on the unit effectiveness. There are a few exceptions, but this isn't one we're ready to make. The basic Infantry Rifle functionality is going to stay the way it is. If the community determines US Infantry to be underpowered, we'll make them cheaper and more available. Which I can say is one thing going to be in 006.

As to the other points you bring up.. I'll leave others to discuss.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2009, 07:03:28 pm by panzerjager1943 » Logged
Lai Offline
Propaganda Minister
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Posts: 3060


« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2009, 07:07:54 pm »

You have our respect for sticking to it Buzzy! The idea is to stick with original CoH mechanics and only modify what's necessary to make something work in the EiR environment. So, while you have some interesting ideas there, changing unit values means that the mod will be less accessible for players who come from the vanilla CoH environment. Remember, Buzzy, you belong to a demographic that's very important for EIR's continued growth so your opinion matters!
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EIRRMod Offline
Administrator / Lead Developer
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Posts: 11009



« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2009, 07:14:06 pm »

Definately Buzz Wink

Good well worded post.
Welcome aboard!
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RikiRude Offline
Donator
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Posts: 4376



« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2009, 07:19:38 pm »

In regards to armor being repaired, armor doctrine will be getting field repairs, that work (i hope in the next release?) also in EIR, armor doctrine had on board mechanics which I think you would of loved, all vehicles would be under constant repair. who knows what the future holds for doctrine abilities. and yeah, i agree that storms are annoying as hell, same with pak cloak, but that's something people argue until they are blue in the face (myself included) . also, just keep in mind it's a game so game play > realism. but neat ideas =D

and glad to see you still play US and didn't just go to wher =P
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Killer344: "Repent: sory no joke i just had savage diorea"
... or a fat ass cock sucking churchill being stupid
NCOIC Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 73


« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2009, 07:49:09 pm »

Heheh well I got kicked from my game mebbe cuz of this post! Smiley

Thanx fer the feedback. BTW I heard that the cloaking is used because of the way the game handles LOS so please accept my apologies when it's something that CoH is just not capable of Smiley I also know that CoH is game and that's something I agree with also so I try to take that into account when I post. I guess this is more of a wish list then Smiley
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Freek Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 218


« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2009, 08:32:17 pm »

IMO, it would be great if garands fired at their 'realistic' pace.  The main problem with this would be the fact that axis infantry die like grass or something.

Unless, the garand get's it's accuracy/damage modified so that although it fires much more rapidly, it does the same damage over time as previously.  This would make the garand look great w/o slaughtering axis inf.
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NCOIC Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 73


« Reply #7 on: May 31, 2009, 09:56:48 pm »

Mebbe a way to model them would be to allow suppression of the BAR without the BAR. Acquiring the BAR might then allow increased precision when used as it was a fairly accurate weapon in it's own right.
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AmPM Offline
Community Mapper
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Posts: 7978



« Reply #8 on: May 31, 2009, 11:15:05 pm »

Only if they up MP40 accuracy and damage on the move. Those things didn't really need 30 rounds to kill someone.
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Mysthalin Offline
Tired King of Stats
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Posts: 9028


« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2009, 01:32:08 am »

Damage on the move - no such thing as a damage modifier while on the move.
The MP40 was a machine pistol - rather low muzzle velocity, especialy compared to a rifle, so even though it didn't need 30 rounds to kill anyone, killing anyone in one shot if it's not a headshot would be rather unlikely. And they kill rather fine, as far as I've seen Tongue.

Thing with garands and carbines(both semi-automatic, the later versions of the carbine being fully automatic), fire slower than grenadier k98s, except at close range(then the garand fires 5-10 percent faster), but the k98 still does much more damage per second. So, the garand does seem like absolute and utter shit.
The G43... it fires a hell of a lot faster than the garand does, it has higher damage per shot, yet it is still considered a rather crappy weapon by most of the PE players. I Don't think that if the garand's mechanics were tweaked so they fire much faster, but with lower accuracy and lower damage, that the garand would become horribly OP. Cooler - yes, but not gravely OP.
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Demon767 Offline
Warmap Betatester
EIR Veteran
Posts: 6190



« Reply #10 on: June 01, 2009, 01:42:53 am »

M1 Garand > G43
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Generalleutnant of The Reichs Wolves

Nevergetsputonlistguy767
Duckordie Offline
Community Mapper
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Posts: 1687



« Reply #11 on: June 01, 2009, 01:55:58 am »

German Soldier with G43 > US Soldier with M1 Grand
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^<-- Duck ™ and ©


 We need more axis players!:
Demon767 Offline
Warmap Betatester
EIR Veteran
Posts: 6190



« Reply #12 on: June 01, 2009, 01:57:57 am »

considered a rather crappy weapon by most of the PE players.
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NightRain Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 3908



« Reply #13 on: June 01, 2009, 02:13:32 am »

Three words:

Men of War


Enough said



<3
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Because a forum post should be like a woman's skirt. Long enough to cover the subject material, but short enough to keep things interesting.
Tymathee Offline
Donator
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Posts: 9741



« Reply #14 on: June 01, 2009, 03:03:43 am »

German Soldier with G43 > US Soldier with M1 Grand

Tommy > Mp40?
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"I want proof!"
"I have proof!"
"Whatever, I'm still right"

Dafuq man, don't ask for proof if you'll refuse it if it's not in your favor, logic fallacy for the bloody win.
Bubz Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 726



« Reply #15 on: June 01, 2009, 03:07:45 am »

America>World kthxbye
roflmao ain't the truth
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VictorTarget Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 234



« Reply #16 on: June 01, 2009, 08:20:29 am »

America>World kthxbye
roflmao ain't the truth
For a given definition of >
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CafeMilani Offline
Aloha
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Posts: 2994



« Reply #17 on: June 01, 2009, 08:39:10 am »

switzerland<<<world
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Bubz Offline
EIR Veteran
Posts: 726



« Reply #18 on: June 01, 2009, 08:40:59 am »

I live in italy, u nub.
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Unkn0wn Offline
No longer retired
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Posts: 18379


« Reply #19 on: June 01, 2009, 08:58:45 am »

Come sta Lei Bubz?
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