Commando doctrines... again

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[Demon767]

haha i never knew that, thats good to know 

in any case i stick by my point.

[LeoPhone]

another video showing my bad luck... not that it means anything.
http://www.xfire.com/video/f61c0/

[Baine]

Maybe get closer to the stug so not all the shots get deflected on the good front front armour.

i tried, but as you can see the cromwell moved in (also useless against the stug) and seriously, a hit is a hit, and two AT t4s that are vet 3 should be able to penetrate a silly stug...
i dont want dmg, accuracy or range increase on PIATS, but penetration increase IN A DOCTRINE.

Sorry, but no. You clearly only hit the very front of the stug, that will never penetrate with a piat.
You should have gotten closer, so the hits would have been ontop(rear hits) of the stug.
They would have killed it.
That's like saying a grenade that lands infront of a wall with grenadiers behind should kill them all because it was thrown by Vet 3 units.


To come back to the glider problem. What about a doctrine for "Aggressive operations", that will double the health of a glider and maybe even gives it a little MG position at the sides?
I know it sounds overkill, but just an idea.

[Aggamemnon]

Leo, you blob way too much and never split or flank your troops, that's why you are having problems.
Then after playing very incompetently, you make excuses why you should be winning, usually along the lines of something on the axis side being too powerful or your units not being able to take hits from a hard counter.


Witnessed first hand.

Start splitting and flanking, you will garner a lot better results, especially with things like PIATs.

[LuAn]

The glider problem/bad luck remains.

[LeoPhone]

wel.. i just played a game, at the end teammate one attacked vet 3 half health KT at the front with his vet 3 pershing, my other brit teammate attacked with all his infantry on the right, and i attacked on the left with a button squad, and those two vet 3 amush squads. still all our fired shells bounced off and KT just drove back to spawn while buttoned and retreated.
edit: oh yeah, i had a firefly with CCT attacking at the front too. every shell bounces off

[Malevolence]

another video showing my bad luck... not that it means anything.
http://www.xfire.com/video/f61c0/

You ran it clumped in front of a panther? You would expect something else out of murphy's law and basic targeting priorities?

wel.. i just played a game, at the end teammate one attacked vet 3 half health KT at the front with his vet 3 pershing, my other brit teammate attacked with all his infantry on the right, and i attacked on the left with a button squad, and those two vet 3 amush squads. still all our fired shells bounced off and KT just drove back to spawn while buttoned and retreated.

Being the owner of this vet 3 KT, I can certifiably tell you the only thing that mattered here:

1) The button lasted about 8 seconds, the first five of which were your PIATs running into max range.

All those PIATs you're saying swarmed it? Never happened. You got a volley off during button, then not a single PIAT hit the KT at all.

Talk about looking at events through rose-eyed glasses.

[LeoPhone]

so it seems piats r useless by themselves, and together with a button squad, since they still cant get close to it. thats even worse than what i sayd.

[Caarnus]

Well my glider just crashed losing my 2 vet 2 almost vet 3 piat squads. It would be nice to have some sort of chance to survive a crash.

[LeoPhone]

Well my glider just crashed losing my 2 vet 2 almost vet 3 piat squads. It would be nice to have some sort of chance to survive a crash.

where did you land it?

[Demon767]

it was on caretan and phased through a house ontop of panthers and jagds and KCH and so on  

and it was one of those cases where we pushed up and well it was bad luck.

[Malevolence]

so it seems piats r useless by themselves, and together with a button squad, since they still cant get close to it. thats even worse than what i sayd.

A KT drives faster than infantry if it has a road. Called kiting.

[LeoPhone]

i still want penetration increase as a doctrine or vet upgrade. i checked the vet tables, every single axis tank get penetration reduction, allies only get that on like 2 tanks, and if axis gets pen reduction when vetted up, it only sounds logical that allied AT gets penetration increase when they reach vet, else their units will be useless.
right now the only allied units that receive penetration increase are the pershing ,sherman, m10, 57, tetrach, cromwell and churhill. as you can see only tanks. it seems the devs dont want infantry doing dmg to axis tanks when they vet up...
seriously, if axis tanks get pen. reduction when they vet, allied AT inf should get pen. increase if they vet up.

[EliteGren]

Well that would make the vet bonus next to useless then again?

[CryingWolf]

right now the only allied units that receive penetration increase are the pershing ,sherman, m10, 57, tetrach, cromwell and churhill.

So basically. Most of them....

[LeoPhone]

Well that would make the vet bonus next to useless then again?

no, the axis vet tank will be stronger against not vetted units, and vetted units actually have a chanse fighting these tanks.

[Illegal_Carrot]

i dont want dmg, accuracy or range increase on PIATS, but penetration increase IN A DOCTRINE.

But you just called for a 100% increase in damage an accuracy?

i doubt it, and they shouldnt be unlucky for units that should be so strong.

As I said before, PIATs have a 1/3 chance of penetrating a StuG form the front (and Skirts don't affect PIAT penetration at all). You just got very unlucky with all those shots.

in 30sec that place can be overrun by enemies or a puma rushing in. thats what i say: youre unlucky becouse the enemy wasnt there when you pressed to land your glider

Don't drop your units on the front line, then. Drop them behind you lines to be safe, or drop them at the front/behind enemy lines, and accept the risk you know you're taking.

another video showing my bad luck... not that it means anything.
http://www.xfire.com/video/f61c0/

Though this is unrelated to the rest of the topic, I recommend not standing right in front of a Panther next time.

And comparatively, many Axis vehicles have better armor than Allied vehicles, so the reduced damage/accuracy on Allied vehicles is much more effective than reduced penetration would be.

Any other questions?

[LeoPhone]

yeah, shut up talking about the only things i didnt ment literally:

i dont want dmg, accuracy or range increase on PIATS, but penetration increase IN A DOCTRINE.

But you just called for a 100% increase in damage an accuracy?

i doubt it, and they shouldnt be unlucky for units that should be so strong.

As I said before, PIATs have a 1/3 chance of penetrating a StuG form the front (and Skirts don't affect PIAT penetration at all). You just got very unlucky with all those shots.

AND AS I SAYD BEFORE: axis gets all their great buffs when vetted and when bought doctrines. my units get nothing, and without them, they cant do good dmg as the axis does.

in 30sec that place can be overrun by enemies or a puma rushing in. thats what i say: youre unlucky becouse the enemy wasnt there when you pressed to land your glider

Don't drop your units on the front line, then. Drop them behind you lines to be safe, or drop them at the front/behind enemy lines, and accept the risk you know you're taking.

as i sayd, there can be enemies too, and im sure it happend to a lot of ppl, and even if they get out, it isnt like they rape shit suddenly. give them some survivability, or more effectiveness by reducing the timer. oh, and axis gets that ability too btw, lightning war etc, why allies have to do it with shit?

another video showing my bad luck... not that it means anything.
http://www.xfire.com/video/f61c0/

Though this is unrelated to the rest of the topic, I recommend not standing right in front of a Panther next time.

such vids belong on the forums, stop fucking about it, and the panther is an AT tank, so theyre shouldnt have been such a risk, but now a panther sniped my LT again, whats going on....

And comparatively, many Axis vehicles have better armor than Allied vehicles, so the reduced damage/accuracy on Allied vehicles is much more effective than reduced penetration would be.

but im talking about the infantry: axis can still just shoot at allied tanks and do decent dmg even when allied tanks are vetted up, and when axis inf is vetted up, they do more dmg, so no more difference.

BUT WHEN ALLIED INF STARTS SHOOTING AT VETTED AXIS TANKS....
they cannot penetrate, and do absolutely no dmg at all = not right/fair/etc.

Any other questions?

yeah, stop this retarded fight and make allies stronger.

[gamesguy2]

AND AS I SAYD BEFORE: axis gets all their great buffs when vetted and when bought doctrines. my units get nothing, and without them, they cant do good dmg as the axis does.

Wtf do you mean your units get nothing.  Last I checked veterancy is nearly mirrored on both sides.

as i sayd, there can be enemies too, and im sure it happend to a lot of ppl, and even if they get out, it isnt like they rape shit suddenly. give them some survivability, or more effectiveness by reducing the timer. oh, and axis gets that ability too btw, lightning war etc, why allies have to do it with shit?

Lightning war is a tier 4 that has nothing to do with paradropping anything.

What do you think happens to a squad of falls that drops the near ubiquitous quad?   

such vids belong on the forums, stop fucking about it, and the panther is an AT tank, so theyre shouldnt have been such a risk, but now a panther sniped my LT again, whats going on....

Thats because the panther can reasonably engage infantry with its cannon.   Do us all a favor and go read up on game mechanics and unit stats before you complain.   The panther has good accuracy(same as a sherman or p4) vs infantry thats standing still.  Its accuracy against moving infantry is halved.  And since your commando sniper was standing still clumped in front of a panther, they naturally died for it.   The churchill is the same way.   Good accuracy vs stationary infantry, half accuracy vs moving infantry.

but im talking about the infantry: axis can still just shoot at allied tanks and do decent dmg even when allied tanks are vetted up, and when axis inf is vetted up, they do more dmg, so no more difference.

BUT WHEN ALLIED INF STARTS SHOOTING AT VETTED AXIS TANKS....
they cannot penetrate, and do absolutely no dmg at all = not right/fair/etc.

Which allied tanks are those axis infantry shooting at exactly?   Both pershing and churchill bounces shreks easilly.

And stop saying "allied infantry" like piats are the only allied infantry.   Airborne deal with all axis tanks no problem with some basic kiting(ie not standing still in front of a panther).

Piats are one of the best infantry AT in the game.   They do 2/3 the hp of a panzer IV in one volley from ambush.  They can shoot through hedges and houses.   You get twice as much damage as a shrek for only 100 munitions.    Try using those advantages instead of leeroy charging them in front of a tank expecting to penetrate at max range.  You do realize piats get 2x penetration at medium and short range?

[LeoPhone]

AND AS I SAYD BEFORE: axis gets all their great buffs when vetted and when bought doctrines. my units get nothing, and without them, they cant do good dmg as the axis does.

Wtf do you mean your units get nothing.  Last I checked veterancy is nearly mirrored on both sides.

my commandos dont have doctrine upgrades, and when axis get received penetration increase, my dmg increase vet is useless..

as i sayd, there can be enemies too, and im sure it happend to a lot of ppl, and even if they get out, it isnt like they rape shit suddenly. give them some survivability, or more effectiveness by reducing the timer. oh, and axis gets that ability too btw, lightning war etc, why allies have to do it with shit?

Lightning war is a tier 4 that has nothing to do with paradropping anything.

What do you think happens to a squad of falls that drops the near ubiquitous quad?   

i mean that axis gets their arrival timer buffs too, but even if they dont, still good ability.
and how many times it happens that falls drop next to a quad? NEVER!

but im talking about the infantry: axis can still just shoot at allied tanks and do decent dmg even when allied tanks are vetted up, and when axis inf is vetted up, they do more dmg, so no more difference.

BUT WHEN ALLIED INF STARTS SHOOTING AT VETTED AXIS TANKS....
they cannot penetrate, and do absolutely no dmg at all = not right/fair/etc.

Which allied tanks are those axis infantry shooting at exactly?   Both pershing and churchill bounces shreks easilly.

and do you know why shreks cant penetrate? becouse those tanks DO receive received penetration reduction when they vet, but ALL axis tanks do get their received penetration reduction, and as you could see, the chanse of t4 vet3 amush squad penetrating something simple as a stug is already as low as it can get(1/3) and that was a stug without the pen. reduction.

You do realize piats get 2x penetration at medium and short range?

no i didnt, thx