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[us]Hellcat camo bonus
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Topic: [us]Hellcat camo bonus (Read 9171 times)
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Hicks58
Development
Posts: 5343
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #20 on:
July 13, 2010, 04:06:27 pm »
Quote from: AmPM on July 13, 2010, 03:58:57 pm
The only solution would be to make the m10 gun as shit as the m18 gun. =)
Other than the weapon they are basically identical with the m10 being cheaper by 5 fuel.
Wouldn't that make the M10 shit against tanks and epic against infantry? Last time I checked the M10 was a TANK Destroyer, not a Light Vehicle Destroyer.
Why not rename it to an Infantry Destroyer when you make that change lol...
M18 gun is the problem tbh, not the M10 gun. A unit shouldn't have to rely on an ability to be useful - It should augment it's current capabilities instead of replace them.
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Quote from: brn4meplz on November 05, 2012, 10:45:05 am
I mean I know Obama was the first one in EiR to get a card. and tbfh the Race card is pretty OP. but Romney has the K.K.K., those guys seem to camo anywhere. So OP units from both sides.
Quote from: Mysthalin on March 27, 2014, 04:57:09 pm
At the end of the day, however, stormtroopers finally got the anal invasion with a cactus they have richly deserved for years.
AmPM
Community Mapper
Posts: 7978
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #21 on:
July 13, 2010, 04:12:27 pm »
The Hellcat doesn't even do that =)
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seanconnery
Donator
Posts: 104
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #22 on:
July 13, 2010, 04:12:51 pm »
the m18 doesn't suck. i use hellcats all the time, and they are amazing against p4s even with the nerf. just because they can't penetrate panther frontal armor doesn't mean it's bad. all you have to do is seriously use it as a tank destroy by flanking and ambushing (with/or not with cloak) panthers from the back. don't be a nub and try to tank with it because that's just fail as hell.
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Firesparks
Honoured Member
Posts: 1209
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #23 on:
July 13, 2010, 04:19:33 pm »
the only thing the hellcat is effective against is the Pz 4 and below. The hellcat just completely fail against panther and above.
Quote from: Mysthalin on July 13, 2010, 03:08:38 pm
Which means it's just something that happened with the changes in meta-game. Nothing actually changed about the efficiency of the M-18, nor about the efficiency of the Panzer IV. Therefore, no change will come to either tank - just because people spam something else at the moment doesn't make the units useless.
So you're okay if the M18 is completely junk against panther(and what not). The M10 still have utility against the heavies because of its speed and rear penetration, both of which the M18 lacks.
Most competent axis player can reverse their tanks fast enough to keep the front against the m10, and the m18 is even slower. Even with the cloak bonus the m18's gun penetration only match that of the m10(and it only work for ONE shot).
Sitting in cloak waiting for that rear shot is just not practical, especially since the hellcat is going to be in very hot water once it fire.
«
Last Edit: July 13, 2010, 04:31:26 pm by Firesparks
»
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With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine. However, this is not necessarily a good idea. It is hard to be sure where they are going to land, and it could be dangerous sitting under them as they fly overhead. -- RFC 1925
AmPM
Community Mapper
Posts: 7978
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #24 on:
July 13, 2010, 04:24:52 pm »
And the M10 reliably penetrates almost all targets from the front, not including KT and Jadg.
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Spartan_Marine88
EIR Veteran
Posts: 4838
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #25 on:
July 13, 2010, 04:51:55 pm »
Quote from: seanconnery on July 13, 2010, 04:12:51 pm
the m18 doesn't suck. i use hellcats all the time, and they are amazing against p4s even with the nerf. just because they can't penetrate panther frontal armor doesn't mean it's bad. all you have to do is seriously use it as a tank destroy by flanking and ambushing (with/or not with cloak) panthers from the back. don't be a nub and try to tank with it because that's just fail as hell.
Its a TANK DESTROYER. Why shouldn't it reliably penetrate heavy tanks?
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Quote from: Sachaztan on March 24, 2013, 03:49:43 pm
Yes that's me, the special snowflake.
Groundfire
EIRR community manager
EIR Veteran
Posts: 8511
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #26 on:
July 13, 2010, 04:54:43 pm »
just because something has a title designation in the CoH manual doesnt mean that it functions as such in game.
its not gonna change, even if you put "tank destroyer" in caps.
Everything has a hard time penetrating panther front armor.
M10s, at short range only have a 36% chance out of the box. What makes you think that the Hellcat should be able to have anything better?
«
Last Edit: July 13, 2010, 04:57:35 pm by Groundfire
»
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AmPM
Community Mapper
Posts: 7978
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #27 on:
July 13, 2010, 05:04:18 pm »
It shouldn't, but it should be able to damage a P4 from the front.
It has 1/2 the Pen of an M10, why would you use the M18? For the awesome Hawkins mines?
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Computer991
Donator
Posts: 1219
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #28 on:
July 13, 2010, 05:08:10 pm »
Quote from: AmPM on July 13, 2010, 05:04:18 pm
It shouldn't, but it should be able to damage a P4 from the front.
It has 1/2 the Pen of an M10, why would you use the M18? For the awesome Hawkins mines?
Hellcats rape P4's straight up
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sheffer
EIR Veteran
Posts: 593
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #29 on:
July 13, 2010, 05:13:46 pm »
Quote from: AmPM on July 13, 2010, 05:04:18 pm
It shouldn't, but it should be able to damage a P4 from the front.
It has 1/2 the Pen of an M10, why would you use the M18? For the awesome Hawkins mines?
U see P4. Move your M18, cloak before shot, P4 is yours.
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Senseless and ruthless.
AmPM
Community Mapper
Posts: 7978
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #30 on:
July 13, 2010, 05:33:33 pm »
Or I can use the M10, which does the same thing more reliably vs all targets with less micro =)
The problem isn't that the Hellcat can't do anything, its more of, why buy it over an M10. It costs more and is barely better when it gets its Ambush off. After that it does much less reliable damage.
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Firesparks
Honoured Member
Posts: 1209
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #31 on:
July 13, 2010, 05:46:41 pm »
Quote from: Groundfire on July 13, 2010, 04:54:43 pm
M10s, at short range only have a 36% chance out of the box. What makes you think that the Hellcat should be able to have anything better?
Hellcat sacrifice native penetration for camo and bonus. The fact is that even with the camo bonus the hellcat still doesn't penetrate any better than the m10.
The m10 is just generally better than the m18 aside from the ability to cloak, .50 cal , and hawkins mine, all of which have some what dubious value.
Logged
sheffer
EIR Veteran
Posts: 593
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #32 on:
July 13, 2010, 07:05:18 pm »
Quote from: Firesparks on July 13, 2010, 05:46:41 pm
Quote from: Groundfire on July 13, 2010, 04:54:43 pm
M10s, at short range only have a 36% chance out of the box. What makes you think that the Hellcat should be able to have anything better?
Hellcat sacrifice native penetration for camo and bonus. The fact is that even with the camo bonus the hellcat still doesn't penetrate any better than the m10.
The m10 is just generally better than the m18 aside from the ability to cloak, .50 cal , and hawkins mine, all of which have some what dubious value.
Ok, dont use it. I prefer 3 m18 insrtead 3 m10 in my inf company. I like m18, u like m10. Or u just want another m10 with different skin?
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Mysthalin
Tired King of Stats
Posts: 9028
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #33 on:
July 14, 2010, 12:47:49 am »
Quote
So you're okay if the M18 is completely junk against panther(and what not).
Hellcat cost <<<< Panther cost.
Hellcat role = Panther role.
Yeah, I'm pretty much more or less so absolutely OK with the fact the M18 gets raped by a panther(and what not).
You forget the cloak shot also grants you 1.5 damage - say what you will, I find that quite useful.
Yet again, it's more of a problem with the M10 being too good, rather than the M18 being useless. And no, it's not the M10 crush ability that makes it too good, before anybody puts their two-pence in.
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Tymathee
Donator
Posts: 9741
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #34 on:
July 14, 2010, 02:06:38 am »
For some reason, i always feel like the m-18 is better vs light vehicles than the m-10.
Personally dont think m-10 is too good, its so fragile the problem is some of the armor doc abilities that make it so uber.
Logged
Quote from: nikomas on October 04, 2012, 09:26:33 pm
"I want proof!"
"I have proof!"
"Whatever, I'm still right"
Dafuq man, don't ask for proof if you'll refuse it if it's not in your favor, logic fallacy for the bloody win.
gamesguy2
Honoured Member
Posts: 2238
Re: [us]Hellcat camo bonus
«
Reply #35 on:
July 14, 2010, 11:28:22 am »
Quote from: Tymathee on July 14, 2010, 02:06:38 am
For some reason, i always feel like the m-18 is better vs light vehicles than the m-10.
Personally dont think m-10 is too good, its so fragile the problem is some of the armor doc abilities that make it so uber.
M18 is better vs light vehicles due to ambush damage bonus and the fact that it fires faster than the M10. M10 reload is 6 seconds, M18 only 5.2.
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